Help me not screw up my next job (A7S II)

B

Beeboop

Active member
I'm filming an after party this weekend. The client wants me to film the employees when they are singing on stage and I am allowed to be on stage filming them. I'll be taking my A7S II and pairing it with a Tamron 24-70 f2.8. Good choice? Peaking does not work with this lens on the A7S II. The place will be dimly lit with only lights on the stage. I was thinking about filming the entire place at f20 at a high ISO to keep everything in focus. Does that sound like a bad idea?

Also, what on camera LED would you guys recommend that I bring? I had horrible flickering in Japan that couldn't be fixed at shutter 50 or 60. What can I do to prevent flickering?

My other camera that I could bring is the Canon C100. What do you guys think?
 
F20? I would say at the wide end of that lens that would be excessive unless you really really need everything in focus? Why doesn't peaking work on that lens? I only had the a7s1 but it didn't matter what lens I had, focus peaking would work.

Anyways even with the great low light on the 2, I think you'll want to plan on being a little more open than that.
 
Honestly do not know why peaking doesn't work with the Tamron. I'm using the metabones and it works on all of my other lens, just not the Tamron. I'm thinking about setting up some lights to make sure the singers are actually lit up. I just did a test shot at a high ISO and there was a lot of grain at f20 and iso 51200. I feel like this camera likes to play tricks on me because the image looks clean until I hit record. Even notice a huge dust particle only after I hit record.
 
Beeboop said:
Honestly do not know why peaking doesn't work with the Tamron. I'm using the metabones and it works on all of my other lens, just not the Tamron. I'm thinking about setting up some lights to make sure the singers are actually lit up. I just did a test shot at a high ISO and there was a lot of grain at f20 and iso 51200. I feel like this camera likes to play tricks on me because the image looks clean until I hit record. Even notice a huge dust particle only after I hit record.
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You have no idea how to use this type of camera at all, you should rent a video camera instead and spend time learning how to shoot with DSLR/Mirrorless camera, btw peaking does work with this lens or any lens, I have it, you might be way under exposed and setting on low or you were on auto focus for not able to see it.
 
You need to rock the lens at f/2.8 the entire time, keep your ISO as low as possible. The club owner and singers will not be impressed with flat footage at f/20. Keep your ISO under 20,000 preferably under 12,000.

I have the A7s I and unless they fixed it in the A7s II, your real issue is going to be blue LED lights posterizing to the point where you can't make out faces. It is a really really big problem with the A7s I. Other than that, I love the camera and the super low light is great. I just have a suspicion they did not fix it in the A7s II but would like to know. Some people say it is an issue on all Sony sensors but I can tell you 100% for sure that it is not an issue at all on my FS700.

I have shot tons of club videos of some of the biggest DJ's in the world with a Canon T3i and a Panasonic AG-AC130, both of which pale in compison for low light performance to the A7s. Going up to 12,000 or so for quality footage was unimaginable then, you should not have to go past that. Keep you lens as open as possible and keep your ISO down for footage your client will be much more happy with. Bring you CANON C100 in case the LED's prove to be an issue with posterization...the worse on blue LEDs but evident on some Green LED's as well. If you find you have to use the C100, same rules apply for low light environment like this, rock the lens wide open. I used to use a Sigma 30mm at f/1.4 the whole time with ISO 800 and everyone was more than happy. For an LED I just used a cheap $40 one by NEWER off AMAZON. Use it on the dimmest setting possible and when possible, bounce it or point at an upward angle so you are not blasting directly on their faces.

PSA1 is right in that you need to do some more testing with that camera. Drop your test footage into an NLE and see what your getting.

Here is an example of a video I made a few years ago with way way lesser means of a low light beast that the A7s is.

CEDRIC GERVAIS | SUMMERTIME SADNESS (1080p HD VERSION on YOUTUBE)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PLEdafLrhWMDDtA0bWES8RFR8tpunhkotR&v=vb0SMWN-HSU

or



There are many others on my website filmed with that same camera and LED combo.
http://www.roughcutproductions.com/coliseum.html
 
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Frankly that the OP plan sounds like a horrible idea... at f22 your images may be soft from diffraction and noisy from underexposure. You can't focus without peaking? I've never seen peaking not work because of a lens though maybe there are unusual cases like yours. I don't really trust peaking for focus anyway, best to use expanded focus which I'm certain works with all lenses. Why does it need to be F22? You need to see the effects of diffraction and every piece of dust on your sensor and lens? Is turning the focus ring of your lens completely impossible? Or get a lens with good AF if you really for some reason can't handle manual focus...
 
Yeah I agree, F20 is a bad idea. I'm testing some footage out right now. I promised to lend someone my C100 this weekend but I might have to break that promise.
 
Ahh, that makes sense. Keep close to 24mm - 30mm
and set her around f4 -5.6 and get your most useable field in focus and your good.

Then put the base on your hip (belt) and switch to 2.8, 50mm and up, and use it as a monopod for tighter shots.
 
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Beeboop said:
I'm going to be doing some glidecam shots and can't focuse while it's on the glidecam.
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Oh well in that case get a lens with good AF for video or set focus from shot to shot and operate accordingly or use wide angle set to hyperfocal. I use the Sony 28 f2 and the 28-70 f3.5-5.6 on my a7sii on a gimbal and turn on face tracking AF and if you see boxes on faces you know it's in focus as long as you don't move from wide to macro too fast.
 
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I just wanted to say WOW ashclever, love your work. Are you the only videographer on those jobs or did you have a team?


Edit:
Thanks PSA1, peaking does work. AF was set to on with the lens. Turning it off made peaking work.
 
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Horrible audio and an uncutable single camera pov are the main reasons you will "screw this up" - panic about your audio strategy
 
morgan_moore said:
Horrible audio and an uncutable single camera pov are the main reasons you will "screw this up" - panic about your audio strategy
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Actually, the client didn't want audio but I was planning to get it just in case. I was thinking about strapping my H1N onto the microphone and having a second H1N record ambient audio. I also have a Tascam DR-40. Maybe I can plug the Tascam into a mixer if they have one?
 
It's for stuff like this I love the e-mount lenses. Low weight, good stabilisation and the face detection works fine!
i usually have it at manual focus but with face detection activated and hitting the AF to focus only when I want it to.

And yes, be very careful if there's LED lights. Especially blue ones but all are bad, especially if close to subjects.
 
dmitrizigany said:
It's for stuff like this I love the e-mount lenses. Low weight, good stabilisation and the face detection works fine!
i usually have it at manual focus but with face detection activated and hitting the AF to focus only when I want it to.

And yes, be very careful if there's LED lights. Especially blue ones but all are bad, especially if close to subjects.
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I was thinking about renting an E-mount for this job. Do you have any suggestions that includes AF-C?
 
Beeboop said:
I was thinking about renting an E-mount for this job. Do you have any suggestions that includes AF-C?
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What is AF-C? Continuous AF? If so, I don't know as I never use continuous AF. I have it in manual focus and then when hitting the AF button it focuses (using face recognition if that is activated).
But I think pretty much all of them support it but cannot vouch for how well it works.
 
You're on full frame, you really don't want f2.8, as mentioned before f5.6 would be about as narrow as i'd go, maybe f4 at a push.

I've never heard of focus peaking not working, so that sounds odd.

If you're dealing with flashing lights and strobes then expose for the people and let the light end up where it does. You could set ISO to auto and give it some limits, but that could get quite crazy unless the lighting changes are quite slow. Personally i wouldn't go any higher than ISO 12800, but of course if it's so dark then it's better to get something rather than nothing.

I think putting that lens and camera on a gimbal is asking for trouble, unless you've done this before. You're fighting a loosing DOF game, you have a full frame sensor and a long lens. At least the C100 is APS-C.

Thought about setting up the C100 to cover everything and then you go in hand held for close ups and details? The IBIS on the camera is pretty good and you can react a lot better than if you're on a gimbal.

What you will need to watch for is rolling shutter, fast pans on a long lens and you're in skew city. Hence being able to cut between a master and details.

I think you have to ask yourself what kind of result are you looking for and test, test, test...

cheers
Paul
 
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