HC-X1E LCD frame lag vs. HDMI lag

Mayfield

New member
It’s been mentioned by a few people and I’ve noticed it too... the latency of the HC-X1E's LCD is really noticeable. But in the limited time I’ve had the camera I also noticed that the HDMI output seemed to be less laggy than the LCD, which is counterintuitive to me. So I did the most scientific test I could with the devices I had to hand.

The camera is set up pointing at an ipad running the stopwatch app. The monitor/recorder is a Shogun Inferno. Photos were taken with a smart phone. It’s all I had at the time. The idea being that comparing the “live” ipad time display with what appeared on the Inferno screen and the camera’s LCD would give an idea what the lag on the two devices. It’s not academic to me, the camera and Inferno are mainly going to be used to film aircraft doing high-energy aerobatics, which requires good tracking. Under those circumstances, frame lag can be a real problem.

I ran through a few different scenarios – all at 59.94 FPS, which is how I’ll be using the camera anyway. I left it on full auto for this experiment.

I downloaded the photos from the smartphone to the PC and took screen grabs, which is what you see below. In doing so, I reviewed about a hundred images and these are some of the ones that show the lag effect most clearly.

I’m not pretending this is a scientific analysis, but the results from all of the images are consistent.

My maths is rubbish, but I’ll say (again what you see here is a small percentage of the images I’ve reviewed), it appears that:

• at 1080/60P the HC-X1E’s LCD lags by around .15 of a second – which at 60FPS is 9 frames. If my rudimentary maths is correct!
• the HDMI/Inferno combination lags by about .10 of a second, so around 6 frames. Doesn’t seem to matter whether it’s UHD or 1080. I expected it to get worse when recording, but it doesn't.
• the lag in the Camera’s LCD actually improves to around the same as the HDMI – 6 frames - when it's recording. Strange.... but I'll take it.

Two images with the camera set at 1080/60P, not recording:
HC-X1E frame lag 1080 60P not recording 1.jpgHC-X1E frame lag 1080 60P not recording 2.jpg

Two at UHD/60P, not recording:
HC-X1E frame lag UHD 60P not recording 1.jpgHC-X1E frame lag UHD 60P not recording 2.jpg

One at 180/60P with both the camera and Inferno recording, notice how the LCD lag has reduced(!)... weird:
HC-X1E frame lag 1080 60P both recording.jpg

Then finally, as it will likely be used in the field (because the camera can't record and spit out UHD/50/60P over the HDMI at the same time)... the camera in standby and the Inferno recording:
HC-X1E frame lag UHD 60P inferno recording.jpg


As much as I really like this camera (and I really do), this lag might be a problem.
 
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In the HC-X1 thread, Barry measured the LCD lag on the UX180 to be 3.5 frames:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?349410-Panasonic-HC-X1-4K-60p-camcorder/page4

Although he didn't mention which frame rate he had the camera set to at the time. At 30fps, 3.5 frames would be about 117 ms, which is a bit less than what you observed, but close. At 24fps, 3.5 frames would be 146 ms which is about the same as you observed.

If you have a chance, it might be interesting to do some tests at 24 and 30p. Even if you're not interested in recording in these modes often, it might be worth knowing how the LCD lag compares.
 
Yes, I see the post. Unfortunately I can't open the attachments. Not sure if the links have gone or it's because I'm new here and don't have all of the privileges yet. But broadly speaking the results are similar.

With my method, I can't be much more precise. The iPad stopwatch app displays only some of the hundredths-of-a-second numbers, but the figures fade (albeit very briefly). So there's some interpretation required. I'll see if I can find something that does display all of the numbers for more precision, but on the other hand, it's going to be there or thereabouts.

I'll do a few more tests when I get a chance. I'll try to drop in a few different FPS' too. I'm also interested in whether the OIS has an effect - I'd be surpised if it didn't, but it might well depend on how much stabilisation it's being required to do. And there's only so much camera waving that can be done without the app numbers being impossible to read!

I guess what this means is that panning will need to be done via the monitor on the sticks, which was the intention anyway. Just as well really, I used it for the first time in daylight, but without the monitor, and the main thing I found was that the text on the screen is almost impossible to read in even indirect (but fairly bright) daylight. Text too small and too fine. Orange (active item being changed) disappears completely. Hmm.

0.1 Second lag...? Probably can live with that. Can't read screen text? Time to get a sun shade. Firmware update, please!

On the very big plus side, the lens is an absolute beauty - especially at the long end. Which is a very nice surprise. Really pleased with that.

Might have to start a general use/firmware update suggestion thread.
 
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