Have there ever been filmmakers who had a late start?

Zachadoodle

Zachadoodle

Well-known member
Take for example you have your first start in film at the age of 45 in a job position a 16 year old would have. Has that ever happened, and if it is a bit humiliating considering you should be more advanced and mature than a lot of people that person should be, how could it be dealt with? Like what if you're struggling to be a PA and everyone else at your age is 1st or 2nd AD or AC or a cinematographer. I honestly felt lost in this filmmaking thing considering I thought I was too old to start in acting. I look at several people having an early start in everything in this filmmaking thing all the time.
 
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I'm not sure why you think you were too old to start acting. Characters come in a wide range of ages and some successful actors begin later in life.

There aren't many 16 year olds starting in the film business these days, many have been in university, some even have post graduate qualifications when they start trying to enter the film industry.
 
briandrys1 said:
There aren't many 16 year olds starting in the film business these days, many have been in university, some even have post graduate qualifications when they start trying to enter the film industry.
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On the contrary, I think there are more than ever. The barrier to entry for a teenager has largely been removed, with the technological advancement and availability of platforms to screen one's work, plus "Youtube University". I think that's why I'm seeing people in their early 20's who have already pretty sophisticated skils, because they've been at it since their early teens.
 
CharlesPapert said:
On the contrary, I think there are more than ever. The barrier to entry for a teenager has largely been removed, with the technological advancement and availability of platforms to screen one's work, plus "Youtube University". I think that's why I'm seeing people in their early 20's who have already pretty sophisticated skils, because they've been at it since their early teens.
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What gets me is when a lot of those people show up and I'm below them questioning my worth as a filmmaker since, well, aren't I supposed to be a lot better now than them considering I've researched a lot on the subject and may possibly be more passionate about it than them? Why is someone who is aggressive and passive aggressive all the time getting better chances than me? Do nice guys finish last in this industry? Sometimes it confuses me at times when I'm the only passionate one there and everyone else is serious, wanting to be left alone, technical, treating it like a dirty job, and focused. Give me some tips on how to find something to do as well as a PA that way I can continue another day, so that I'm not constantly hunting for tasks being pushed to the side like trying to get a Playstation on Black Friday before Christmas, and then this band wagon that is a film set goes somewhere else I'm unaware of?
 
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briandrys1 said:
I'm not sure why you think you were too old to start acting. Characters come in a wide range of ages and some successful actors begin later in life.

There aren't many 16 year olds starting in the film business these days, many have been in university, some even have post graduate qualifications when they start trying to enter the film industry.
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After since seeing my older brother get a job at Best Buy and needing a master's degree in history, I'm not so confident in majoring in film. There was also him saying he'd work a job at a jewelry store which is really irrelevant to getting a degree in history. If I could go back in time when I was in theater, I'd definately go to trade school getting something in automechanics or welding or something in business. I'm at the moment trying to get through my business analytics degree. Film industry is too much like American Idol.
 
Zachadoodle said:
What gets me is when a lot of those people show up and I'm below them questioning my worth as a filmmaker since, well, aren't I supposed to be a lot better now than them considering I've researched a lot on the subject and may possibly be more passionate about it than them?
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Research doesn’t get you anywhere, Zack. It’s great that you’re passionate about the subject, but just reading books doesn’t give you much of a sales pitch.

Experience is what matters.

It’s a fickle industry, for sure, and the old adage is that “it’s not what you know, but who you know”. That’s true in many ways, but it’s not the barrier to entry that some make it out to be.

Zachadoodle said:
Give me some tips on how to find something to do as well as a PA that way I can continue another day, so that I'm not constantly hunting for tasks being pushed to the side like trying to get a Playstation on Black Friday before Christmas, and then this band wagon that is a film set goes somewhere else I'm unaware of?
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Getting work as a PA is your foot in the door. Find any and all filmmaking groups you can in your town, in nearby towns, and in the closest accessible city if you’re not in a bigger city. Introduce yourself in the Facebook groups, go to the meetups... get some face time and try to meet people. Let them know you're interested in PA work. Honestly, you may have to start off helping with local film festival teams just to get a couple of credits under your belt. The hobby teams are low-impact, and low-risk, making them a great way to get your feet wet.

The thing about working on any set, though, is that every job is your interview for the next one. This is an industry that is largely reputation and word of mouth. Even local film fest teams often have people who work on other, larger projects. Do a great job on one of the little film fest teams, and you start meeting people and building your network. That’s how you start getting recommendations for other projects.

Now, having said what I said above about “doing research”, I am going to suggest one book for you. It will give you a lot of good information for being a set PA. I have no affiliation with sales of this book. The author is a friend of mine, and she’s created a great resource.

But here’s the caveat, Zack: having the information from a resource like this is to be used to help you do the job. It is not for you to offer helpful advice for others on set. You may find yourself on projects that don’t operate on the level that this book addresses, and it’s not for you to try and teach them. I say this because you do have a tendency to post advice for folks on things you’ve never actually experienced yourself. When the newbie PA seems to have lots of tips for everyone else, the newbie PA doesn’t last long on set.

All that said, this a could be a good training resource for you.

How To Survive On Set: The Set Production Assistant’s Guidebook

Read, mark, learn, and inwardly digest.
 
CharlesPapert said:
On the contrary, I think there are more than ever. The barrier to entry for a teenager has largely been removed, with the technological advancement and availability of platforms to screen one's work, plus "Youtube University". I think that's why I'm seeing people in their early 20's who have already pretty sophisticated skils, because they've been at it since their early teens.
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I've seen teenagers making sophisticated films, they've gone on media courses and have access to digital kit and software, some of which is free. However, getting work on a large production does require having the contacts, or personal marketing skills and knowledge of using higher end kit if working in some departments. It depends on if you wish to work your way up through the grades or start on lower/no budget productions, some people do both, using the latter to build experience for the higher grades.

People in their early 20s will be a lot more capable than most 16 year olds, given the extra experience and education.

Information is much more available today, so what required a lot of work to dig it out can be found with a few clicks on a computer. Although, getting hands on experience with the higher end kit does require physically attending appropriate workshops or courses, if not working on productions. BTW most people attending these courses do have a fair amount of background knowledge before going on them and many are working in the industry.

Regarding nice guys, most people working on sets are generally nice people, although that mightn't be the case with some people in the higher end of the production department.

The jobs people get often have little to do with their degree subjects, especially in the humanities.
 
That's an interesting take on it. What I wonder when being a PA is what if the only two reactions I can get out of someone is either being ignored or causing anger?
 
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Well, you're not alone. No one wants that. Does that prevent you from seeking a PA or other job? We all have fears. One thing that held me back in my youth was my anxieties. What a waste it was. It held me back from doing so many things. Lack of confidence and sagging ego can hold us back from accomplishing or at least trying things.
 
Paul F said:
Well, you're not alone. No one wants that. Does that prevent you from seeking a PA or other job? We all have fears. One thing that held me back in my youth was my anxieties. What a waste it was. It held me back from doing so many things. Lack of confidence and sagging ego can hold us back from accomplishing or at least trying things.
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Speaking from an outsider perspective, the thing about filmmaking that makes it the most complex is that it involves changing another person for the camera. I believe if change wasn't important in this industry, the phrase, "take two" wouldn't exist. Changing things is risk taking. If you're making a stop motion with Legos you're taking no risk, but given of how so many people in this industry have died from stunts and film shoots gone wrong, it effects people in a way if you tell them to do the opposite of what they're comfortable with.
 
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I think you're getting confused by thinking that popular people are always getting the work.

You do need to be able to communicate with cast and crew members, but being effective at that doesn't always make you popular. You can communicate in a very quiet manner, but with the enthusiasm still coming through. I recall on a feature film shoot, the female trainee camera assistant on a bleak hill with the rain pouring down, smiling as she carried camera cases around. She was happy to be there, even in the rain. A year later, I asked for her to do her first gig as clapper loader (2nd AC) on a short I was making - this was shot on Super 16 film for 35mm blow up and the crew got paid, so not a freebie. She got work as an AC on quite a few productions.

The creative industries have people with complex mental issues, some of which are quite dark. I know a number who have committed suicide, and some of them were people who you'd regard as popular. You shouldn't take things at face value, people put up fronts to cover their insecurities.

Professionals in the industry have learnt how to make adjustments. As one cameraman said (although they be referencing someone else) "you're not being creative unless you're afraid". By "afraid" he was referring to it failing, taking creative risks is part of progressing, although it's better to run tests that reveal how far you can go before hitting the failure. However, that's not always possible, but the risks can make a film or an advertisement stand out from the crowd.
 
Zachadoodle said:
That's an interesting take on it. What I wonder when being a PA is what if the only two reactions I can get out of someone is either being ignored or causing anger?
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Paul F said:
Is that your expectation or experience?
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Zachadoodle said:
I just don't want something like that to happen.
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Sounds like you’re worried about a hypothetical situation, Zack. You didn’t really answer Paul’s question, but I understand that this may or may not be based on past experiences you’ve had in other situations. It can be a challenge to overcome our own social barriers, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try.

The reality of being a PA: you’ll draw anger if you swerve outside your lane instead of doing the job, and you’ll be ignored if you are incessantly over-eager in doing the job. Everything in between is pretty much your safe zone.

Being a PA often means being quietly observant. See trash cans that are full? Change them out. See half-empy water bottles lying about on location (that nobody’s marked with their name or initials)? Collect them and move them to the recycling tub. In between shots, when it’s appropriate and not distracting, and wondering if folks need to hydrate? Quietly check in on crew and ask if they need water, and have a few bottles in hand for those who say they do.

Now, if you’re asking the same folks about water every time the camera stops, they might start getting annoyed. But going through every now and then is helpful.

But you’ll also have plenty of duties assigned to you. Do that job. Listen more than you speak. Ask questions if you don’t quite understand. You’ll start to get a sense of how sets operate (and every set is different, so the first couple days are the learning curve). And you may be assigned to a certain department or a certain set of responsibilities. Again, stay in your lane and do the best job you can do.
 
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