Hate Citizen Kane? Think The Godfather is overrated? It's okay, you're among friends

iamWZA

iamWZA

Active member
In my opinion, too many people don't speak their minds when it comes to critically-acclaimed films, for fear of being slated and accused of not appreciating such and such.
I'll start...

1) I hate Citizen Kane.

2) With the exception of Blow Up, I hate all of Michelangelo Antonioni's films. I think they're terrible. Having said that, Beyond the Clouds redeems itself a bit by having a naked Sophie Marceau and a semi-naked Inese Sastres.

Don't be afraid. Speak your mind.
 
Ooh this sounds fun.

I do not like a single David Lynch or David Cronenberg film. Eraserhead is possibly one of the worst films i've ever seen.

I agree with you on Antonioni, but I didn't even like Blowup all that much.

I enjoy The Godfather films, but have never understood the amount of acclaim they receive.

I think Taxi Driver is a bad film, probably the worst Scorcese ever made.
 
I love Citizen Kane, and feel it deserves AFI's number one spot. An amazing piece of work.

The Godfather is okay, the sequel is the best one (haven't seen the third one), but I believe that Once Upon a Time in America is the best of that era's gangster films.

I don't like a lot of 80s horror. Most of it is cheesy and dumb (Hellraiser is the first one I've seen that I thought was still good) and I didn't see them growing up, so that's probably why I'm not impressed as an adult in the 2000s.

Melancholia is a terrible piece of crap, both story-wise and visually (with a few moments in the film that are technically extraordinary).
 
Stephen Mick said:
So, just for reference, let's hear about some of the movies you LOVE as well.
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From the same era as Eraserhead:
1. I HATE Eraserhead.

2. I LOVED: Brother From Another Planet - (haven't seen it since then)

3. The Gods Must Be Crazy - (first one only)

4. The Wave​


My usual "top X" list:

Ghost Dog - wow, the references, philosopy, and so well done!

Faraway, So Close - (as a humanist & visual artist)

Aguirre, The Wrath of God - (mostly for the last scene in the movie)

Where the Green Ants Dream - (content, approach, visual)
​
Best,
Michael
 
Never got that hype about Citizen Kane and Godfather.
Also I hate most French (except Amelie and The Artist) films and any Dogma and similar experimental stuff.

Really like Gangs of New York, Angel Heart and Once Upon a Time in America though.

Frank
 
iamWZA said:
1) I hate Citizen Kane.
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Just what exactly do you hate about it, other than its critical acclaim?

You know, make a case for your argument (no slating, just curious).

Myself, I'm no lemming, but I just watched Citizen Kane a month ago (probably for the 7th or 8th time, and I never do that).

I thought its luster may have worn off- wrong. Brilliant. Still.
 
Movies I love:

All Tarkovsky films, especially Stalker and Andrei Rublev.
some Wong Kar Wai's films, especially Chungking Express and In the Mood For Love
A Man Escaped by Bresson
The Word by Dreyer
All of Joon Ho Bong's films.
Children of Men
The Social Network
Wes Anderson's recent films


That's enough for now.
 
Postmaster said:
any Dogma
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Speaking of Dogma - I really liked "Dancer in the Dark", although that was the wierdest movie I have (almost) ever seen.

Along with "Breaking the Waves", and "Dogville." Gotta give credit where it is due ...

Also, I think that "The Five Obstructions" should be watched again, and again, and again by any serious filmmaker, or visual artist in general. There is a lot to be learned from Jørgen Leth in that movie! Both creative process and pragamatic "how to" storyboard, etc WOW!

OK, I am not now going to defend Dogma. :)
 
groveChuck said:
Just what exactly do you hate about it, other than its critical acclaim?
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This is just my opinion after all. Just one, tiny little meaningless opinion, but...I found it unbearably boring, slow-paced (but not in a good way), devoid of any emotion and entirely unengaging. The cinematography is alright, but also not as good as it's made out to be. The film seemed to hinge on the 'Rosebud, rosebud" utterance, but by the time it came around I cared so little about its meaning. I was just excited by the thought of the film ending.

John - nice list. There are a few I haven't heard of and will check out. Also a huge Tarkovsky and Willy Wong Kar Wai fan. Stalker is on another level!
 
I don't hate Citizen Kane at all, but I am also not jumping up and down and doing backflips over it either. I recognize the historical and technical cinematic importance of Citizen Kane, but I don't think I'd put it at the top of my personal "best of" list. I guess in terms of a commonly loved and acclaimed film that sits near the top of my personal best would be Blade Runner. Maybe not as revolutionary across the cinematic landscape as Citizen Kane, but is probably one of the most influential films of the past 30 years, both in the science fiction genre and in neo-noir and maybe even in terms of action and thriller movies too.

I think my favorite film just in terms of pure enjoyment factor might be Aliens. I will never tire of that one. It will probably never reach the top of most serious film critics top film lists, but it has so much good stuff in it, and just delivers... humor, action, terror, suspense, drama, iconic characters, great world-building.

As for The Godfather, I am going to have to disagree. Great film. The Godfather II is even better. I do love some good mafia movies. As others have mentioned, Once Upon A Time In America is another great one.

On to David Lynch. I appreciate his originality, but he gets too abstract and surreal sometimes. Visually, Eraserhead is great, but it isn't the most entertaining piece of cinema. It really does feel like being in a strange dream-state when watching it though. I'd say my favorite thing that Lynch has been involved with is Twin Peaks. Blue Velvet is probably my favorite film of his. Of course, in a way Blue Velvet feels like a thematic and conceptual precursor to Twin Peaks.

I love earlier Cronenberg stuff. Scanners, The Brood, Videodrome, The Fly, The Dead Zone, just to name a few. Naked Lunch was interesting and visually pretty cool, what with the typewriters that turned into talking bugs. Thing is, I kind of feel the same way towards Naked Lunch as I do Eraserhead, basically interesting and unique, but not much fun and not all that fulfilling beyond and academic "what the hell does all this mean" sense. Just because it was an semi-indie arthouse adaptation of a William Burroughs book doesn't make it better or more worthy of praise than say Cronenberg's brilliant but much more accessible remake of The Fly. I also enjoy his newer stuff, and thought that Eastern Promises was more interesting than the more acclaimed A History of Violence. I wish Cronenberg would go back to making some of the crazy body horror stuff he did in the late 70's and into the 80's. The last film like that from him was back in 1999 with eXistenZ (which now feels like it should be the name to some erectile dysfunction pill... hmmm... a Cronenberg horror/thriller about erectile dysfunction, could be something there?).

As for critical darlings that I never loved, let's start with Quentin Tarantino. I think Reservoir Dogs is superior to Pulp Fiction. Actually, I never got super excited about Pulp Fiction. Sure it is good, but it isn't the masterpiece that people make it out to be. Call me crazy, but I'd say From Dusk Til Dawn is as good as Pulp Fiction and Reservoir Dogs as well. Yes, I know Tarantino only wrote but didn't direct From Dusk Til Dawn. It still felt more like a Tarantino film regardless. Personally, I prefer Inglorious Basterds and Kill Bill over Pulp Fiction and Reservoir Dogs.

I am also going to have to call out No Country For Old Men. I can appreciate the acting and technical professionalism of it, but the film just didn't do much for me. I certainly wouldn't say it sucks, but I guess it is just one of those critically acclaimed films that didn't click with me and left me cold.

Now for guilty pleasures and/or cult films. I am a huge fan of Paul Verhoeven's crazy over-the-top satirical filmmaking. Especially his sci-fi trilogy of RoboCop, Total Recall, and Starship Troopers. Oh yeah, as you can tell by my sig, I am also a fan of the bats*%t crazy psychedelic sci-fi trip known as Zardoz.
 
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The film I come closest to hating, because I think the pubic love for it so far outweighs its quality, is Black Swan.
 
Nektonic said:
Personally, I prefer Inglorious Basterds and Kill Bill over Pulp Fiction and Reservoir Dogs.
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That sentence really freaks me out.

Pulp Fiction is film of the nineties for mine and one of the top fifty films of all time.
 
Pulp fiction, heck anything this guy does is top for me. Guy Ritchie I can't stand though. And I can't stand it when it's compared to QT's style of filmmaking I don't see any resemblances.

Aronofsky, can't stand him. Pi even wore off and now it ticks me off thinking about it. The Fountain was a disaster. I realized one day it was never Aronofsky I liked, but rather was getting a kick out of Libatique.

Lynch, never got it, but can't say I hate it, maybe I'm not there yet. Jarmouch. No way I can sit through one of those again. Which brings me to the two I doubt I'll ever get, and just plumb don't like how I'm supposed to take em, Fellini and Godard. I just don't get it.

I'm one of those guys that likes Spielberg, but not Bay. I like Lucas. I like John Williams. I like Thomas Newman. I like Rob Richardson ASC. Not necessarily directors all the time, there are some heroes on leagues of their own. I like Morricone.

I'm scared to hit enter after admitting I just can't stand Fellini and Godard, I'll say in my 'intellectual' self's defense that I dig Melville, trying to think of others I've studied and actually liked that came out before I was born. Maybe the fact that I wasn't around when they came out kind of insists this obligation to appreciate those films/works of art without really finding an honest part that likes them. I remember the talk after Breathless but seriously, when I saw my boys after that weird movie night I just said it was painful to sit through.

There's no defense to my statement, just what I think, and I know (and have heard) that I'm a moron for saying so. And yes, I'd still like to make movies, I just use more of what came out when I was around as a reference. I like the 90's cause in 40 years they'll make awesome classics and I can say I was there.

So yeah, Spielberg, Lucas, Fincher, Leone, Those guys yes.

Aronofsky Godard Fellini Lynch Jarmouche I just can't do.

and QT is a fine artist, whole other level in my book. Yes I'm a groupie die hard fan.
 
Just for the record, I do like The Godfather. Totally agree about Black Swan and No Country For Old Men, neither did anything for me.
I really like Tarantino, even though I think he gets more praise than he deserves. I wouldn't put him down as one of the greats, but his films are always worth watching. I can't think of another director whose personality comes through so prominently in their films.
 
I'm going to drop a bombshell here... I hated The Shining. I thought it was badly directed, badly acted, and badly shot. And I can never forgive the helicopters shadow in the opening sequence. Even Stephen King never liked it. I just don't think a respectable film/series adaptation of that book has ever been made. In fact, the only Stanley Kubrick film that I've 100% enjoyed was Dr. Strangelove. Yes, that's right... I just said Stanley Kubrick is overrated. And I think the reason so many filmmakers use his name so much in their daily conversations is because his name carries some sort of an association with cinematic knowledge.

I'll leave it at that, as my list of highly-overrated films is very long.
 
kylevant said:
I'm going to drop a bombshell here... I hated The Shining.
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I have to agree that The Shining has problems (I thought it was okay, but wasn't quite blown away). The biggest being that Nicholson already comes across as unhinged from the very start, thus removing the impact of him going insane.
 
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