FS7: Gratical from Zacuto for my FS7 - necessary ???

S

sly

Member
Hi!
Just had a shoot where I really had problems seeing the focus - did not trust the peaking.
Because with Slog3CineIE - it is hard to judge and with luts - the waveform is gone.
I also saw really good reviews about the gratical from Zacuto and
now - since only a few days left to get it 900$ less, I was wondering what you guys think?

Is it worth and necessary for the FS7 ?

SeeYaa
Sly...
 
I've had one on pre-order since November. Sick of dealing with Sony's half-assed implementation of waveforms, histogram, LUTs, etc. This will hopefully be reliable, it works correctly (waveform always reflects the input signal--Slog3 for example--and not the LUT) and can be used on any camera.
 
Don't know about the zacuto, but Alister chapman suggests shooting slog with the 709(800) LUT in VF (not recording it ). He says its easier to see focus, you can eyeball exposure pretty aren well and using the High Key/ Low Key set on a button, you can spot check your highlights and shadows for the real exposure . It works pretty well I think. Then you can still sue 709Type A in post.
 
Lenilenapi said:
Don't know about the zacuto, but Alister chapman suggests shooting slog with the 709(800) LUT in VF (not recording it ). He says its easier to see focus, you can eyeball exposure pretty aren well and using the High Key/ Low Key set on a button, you can spot check your highlights and shadows for the real exposure . It works pretty well I think. Then you can still sue 709Type A in post.
Click to expand...

As I pointed out, (in the thread you are referring to), that's fine for Alister in a workshop, but it has many drawbacks in every day usage and simply doesn't work at all in S&Q mode. I certainly wouldn't recommend using this method for anything critical.
 
I used it on location and was pleasantly surprised, but to each his own. I can't focus any zacuto viewfinders - don't know why, maybe its my progressive glasses. maybe this one will be different. i'll try it NAB.
 
Lenilenapi said:
I used it on location and was pleasantly surprised, but to each his own. I can't focus any zacuto viewfinders - don't know why, maybe its my progressive glasses. maybe this one will be different. i'll try it NAB.
Click to expand...

Tried what on location, the Gratical HD?
 
Does it look like a good EVF?

Yes it does.

Is it necessary?

Of course not.

Shooting mostly Cine-EI with a little bit of custom and purely recording and monitoring internally I've now shot a bunch of paid for content and had nothing back but happy smiley faces and more bookings for some big clients.

If in doubt, and if run and gunning in S-log, expose until the histogram on a composition with no obvious extremes of brightness is flattening out and clipping, and then gradually drop it down until it's not and a balanced frame sits nicely in the middle of the histogram.

It might not be nailing preferred perfect exposure across the full extent of the camera's latitude like you'd want in more controlled environments but there's plenty of tools for that. This way you're just making sure the info is in there somewhere for when you get back home. :)

NB: I now await a million people telling me how I'm doing it wrong. :)
 
Last edited:
Ben Scott said:
ND: I now await a million people telling me how I'm doing it wrong. :)
Click to expand...


I'm a slave to my waveform. Well, I glance at it every now and then...

I agree, graticule looks nice, but it's not essential, despite what the bloggers and other snake oil salesman might say.
 
If the gratical interfaced with a super ergonomic finger focus button (off centre) then i would be interested, up to that point it is still only showing you one pixel in four.

Im also interested in the Transvideo little monitor - seems like 'cheap' in comparison and their stuff is awesome - even records lutted proxies for 1300EU

S
 
Ben Scott said:
NB: I now await a million people telling me how I'm doing it wrong. :)
Click to expand...

You're not doing it wrong... but I'll throw in my two cents:

Flat profiles can sometimes be a bit misleading on a waveform because they actually won't let the signal get below/above certain IRE values and the waveform itself is usually pretty smushed together. So when I just see a flat blob across the waveform, it can be hard to tell if a certain part of my image is actually at 30 IRE or 40IRE, which can end up getting mapped to pretty different places when pushed into Rec709. On top of that, flat profiles can be hard to focus with. I've been shooting on the Odyssey7Q (without using the LUT) for over a year now. Focus and exposure is easier with that because the screen is big and great, it has great focus zoom, the waveform is big (and can be expanded)... but pulling it off with the FS7 LCD screen? It's a lot harder. The waveform is tiny and lags, the LUTs help for focus/exposure but are wonky and are sometimes greyed out, they disable the exposure tools, etc.

To me, a LUT is key for getting good ballpark exposure and helps nail focus, but the FS7 has a half-baked execution. Fingers crossed that the Gratical nails this and then I'll have an EVF that works great on the FS700, FS7, GH4, A7s, and more. My buddy ordered one for his Epic Dragon and will also probably use it on his A7s.

If your only camera is the FS7, I can understand hesitancy to buy the Gratical. But if you're jumping around to different cameras and have come to expect those tools (as I have, I've been spoiled by them in the Odyssey7Q and I love having LUTs on in the FS7) then it's a pretty great piece of gear that is independent from your camera.
 
As I said it's not the best way to achieve perfect and precise exposure in a controlled environment, and there are other tools I would use in that working environment, but if I need to go film something tomorrow and right now I don't know what it is going to be and i have zero prep time (which has happened a lot recently) then if I expose how I mentioned go over or under until the wfm flattens and then back off until it's a proper signal on an 'average contrast' frame - as long as I know I have all the information in there somewhere I'll sort it out when I get home :)

Will be much improved when WFM with LUTS etc come into play but for now most certainly you can go pick up the camera and record with it and get excellent results without needing a $3000 EVF.

Not run into massive focus issues yet but I appreciate that will be aided when LUTs gets sorted too.
 
Luts with waveform are my #1 request at the moment. I find Slog to be harder to focus so I've been using a REC709 Lut and eyeballing it with Zebras. If I have time I use the hi/low button to check my highlights or shadows. So far I've managed to hit exposure decent but its far from ideal. Even if only the histogram worked with Luts on I would be fine enough. I'm still trying to work out my exposure methods under R&G situations.
 
I'm looking forward to receiving my Gratical mainly for the FS7. The selling point for me was interfacing it with basically any camera and not being tied into replacing a Sony LCD stock VF with a broken cable or end terminal while on location. I believe only the Sony (4,500.00) OLED stock VFs have an option to change the cable only. On the Gratical 4x3 screen there is much more real estate under the 16x9 image for larger displays of WFM or Histogram viewing.
 
I think it really depends on how much time in a month you spend looking into a VF. If you have 5-10 Days in a month of which you might be shooting using a monitor half of the time maybe it is indeed an unnecessary luxury item. I am booked in average 15 -20 days/month or more and use an EVF 90 percent of the time for me its a necessity to have a better viewing experience less strain etc. So getting one is a no brainer.
 
I think Phil Bloom's review said it perfectly; it's not for everyone, but for people who need a high quality EVF with real monitoring features - there's now one available. I'd be all over the Zacuto if I could get someone to buy my Sony OLED (which is superb visually, but severely lacking in monitoring features).
 
icarusfilm said:
I think it really depends on how much time in a month you spend looking into a VF. If you have 5-10 Days in a month of which you might be shooting using a monitor half of the time maybe it is indeed an unnecessary luxury item. I am booked in average 15 -20 days/month or more and use an EVF 90 percent of the time for me its a necessity to have a better viewing experience less strain etc. So getting one is a no brainer.
Click to expand...

Fair comment.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top