Good omnidirectional mic? And question!

R

raycheerache

New member
Hi,

Just started doing sound at the beginning of this year after graduating from film school. I only have a 302 mixer, an AT897, and boompole and such. No recorder. Yet. ;)

I'm planning on getting an omnidirectional mic. Any advice?

Is there somewhere i can hear comparisons of different mics like the ones that they have for the shotguns?

By the way, i'm going to be shooting a feature soon and i'm not too confident in my AT897. Do you think i should rent a better mic?

Thank you!

-Rachel
 
Cool! Thanks..

Which hyper-cardioid would you recommend? I'm still shopping around anyways..

Thanks again for replying!
 
That sounds pretty good. I'll look into it. I just want a mic that will be sticking with me for a long time. Unlike, my AT897, which i'm starting to doubt it's capabilities. But it was a pretty good starter mic.

Do you think the MKH 40 would be good outdoors as well?

Sorry for all the question and thanks so much for replying, again! :)
 
The only omni mics typically used for film/video dialog are lav mics (body mics) and handheld interview mics like the ElectroVoice RE50. All boom mics are varying degrees of directionality. If you are planning to replace your AT-897 short shotgun then I suggest replacing it with another short shotgun (if you can have only one pattern to cover most of your bases: short shotgun.) such as the Sennheiser 416, Rode NTG-3 (nearly identical sounding to the 416), Sennheiser MKH-60, Schoeps CMIT, or Sanken CS-3e, etc. Saving a few bucks by buying these mics used is usually a safe bet. If the AT-897 is doing what you want a short shotgun to do, then adding a mic with a different (wider) directional pattern like the MKH-40 (tight), MKH-50 (tighter), or Schoeps CMC-641 (tight, similar to the MKH-40) will often be preferred for interior sets and stay with you for the next 20+ years.

Glen Trew
 
Thanks, Glen!

That makes perfect sense. I do like the NTG-3 and the price is really reasonable.

Will the sound quality vary if I use different mics for interiors & exteriors?
 
Don't get an omni unless you are using it for a specialized purpose, and the MKH 40, while a great mic, is cardioid. The Supercardioid is the MKH 50. Respectfully, I feel that the MK41 from Schoeps has a very different pickup pattern than the MKH 40. They also sound very different. The MK41 is much drier and has longer reach, and is more detailed. These qualities, in particular the reach of the mic, make it very useful for video. The MKH 40 has better insulation from the sounds in back of it, but has more coloration of off-axis sound sources.
There is unfortunately no substitute for auditioning the mics (well, you could buy them all). You will know right away if you like it. Find a dealer who will let you compare them, you will save money in the long run even if you have to pay a bit more for a real dealer. And, of course, never buy anything the dealer recommends. Mics are a bit like golf clubs, you will find different ones work better in different rooms, so it is nice if possible to have a selection in your case to choose from.
 
raycheerache said:
Thanks, Glen!

That makes perfect sense. I do like the NTG-3 and the price is really reasonable.

Will the sound quality vary if I use different mics for interiors & exteriors?
Click to expand...

Sound timbre may vary with different mics but that would fit naturally with what you see on the screen. One expects someone to sound differently between indoors and out and so the audience accepts it as a natural consequence of being in two visibly different locations and ignores it. Using two different mics for wide shots and closeups that need to intercut within a scene, OTOH, would be noticable.
 
raycheerache said:
Thanks, Glen!

That makes perfect sense. I do like the NTG-3 and the price is really reasonable.

Will the sound quality vary if I use different mics for interiors & exteriors?
Click to expand...

It is common practice to a use a shotgun mic for exteriors and a shorter cardioid or supercardioid mic for interiors. (But there is not a hard-and-fast rule, as sometimes shotguns are used for interiors and sometimes short mics are used for exteriors.) Generally, shotgun mics are used to deal with noisier environments or greater distances, or both, which are typical of exterior locations and framing. Interior locations are usually more controlled and quieter, so a less directional mic is used which can have several advantages, including more natural ambience and more natural perspective. However, there are plenty of times that short shotgun mics are used in interior locations, with preferred results.

If you can only have one mic, I suggest a short shotgun such as the models mentioned previously. If you can only have two microphones, I suggest having a short shotgun and a supercardioid or cardioid. When you can have three boom mics, we'll start another thread :).

Glen Trew
 
The new Sennheiser MKH 8040 (cardioid) or 8050 (super-cardioid) are the same quality as the MKH 40 & 50 but are a lot smaller and quite a bit cheaper - and although the overall diameter is much smaller, the diaphragm itself is the same size - both MKH 40 series and MKH 8040 series have a 16mm dia. diaphragm.
 
Where are you finding them for cheaper, John? I can't find the 8000-series capsules for any less than the MKH40, and the power section is another $300.
 
JordanBlock said:
Where are you finding them for cheaper, John? I can't find the 8000-series capsules for any less than the MKH40, and the power section is another $300.
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The UK retail for the MKH 40 is £1,495.43 +VAT
The UK retail for the MKH 8040 is £925.00 +VAT

So the MKH 8040 is about one-third cheaper.

Same with the MKH 50 and MKH 8050.

The MKH 8040 price abve is the complete mic.:- head, XLR, clip, windshield and case.

By the way - there is no "power section" in the MKH 8000 series - the head is the complete microphone - the bottom end is just an XLR converter with no electronics in at all.
 
JordanBlock said:
Where are you finding them for cheaper, John? I can't find the 8000-series capsules for any less than the MKH40, and the power section is another $300.
Click to expand...

In North America there is very little price difference between the 40/50 and the 8040/8050 (with the XLR adapter. Also, the end piece of the 8000 series mics is not a power section, but only an XLR connector that is adapted for the front of the microphone. Rycote has a new system that allows the 8000 series mics to be used without their accessory XLR module, saving some money, length, and weight.

There is a related article that I just posted about this new Rycote system, which also finally makes it feasible to use the 8040 or 8050 outdoors. The article can be seen here: http://www.trewaudio.com/audioflow/ (titled "Rycote Does It Again".

Glen Trew
 
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