GH4 GH5: Seems they haven´t thought about DR at all. Awful DR?

joe12south said:
Sorry, I was speaking specifically about the V-LOG L clips he made available for download. They are all fairly low contrast shots that fit comfortably inside of 10 stops.
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The download clips included the sun-lit woman looking out over an ocean vista that looked to be pushing V-log to it's maximum DR range.

Luke's new SpeedBooster footage also shows good DR with some contrasty subjects.

From some of Luke's footage it appears that we are definitely getting the full 12 F-stops of DR with the GH5.
 
joe12south said:
Please understand that I'm not trying to say that 12 is bad, or that you can't make beautiful images with 12. I'm just saying that there are valid reasons for pushing to 14-16 stop acquisition systems. Capturing that much DR will yield great creative freedom, and will increase in value as HDR displays become the norm.
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Panasonic and Fuji have been collaborating on new organic sensor tech for more than 6 years now. This new tech is designed to deliver 20 F-stops of dynamic range. So it's definitely coming, but it still might be 3-4 years before this new sensor tech shows up in a camera.
 
With the dismal forewarning last month that Panasonic will not meet their earlier earnings forecast to the tune of about 20% lower earnings for FY2016, they continue to be in a position of needing to preserve cash and limit non-essential expenditures. So while this sensor technology appears to be a major breakthrough, there may be spending issues that prevent them from progressing. There may also be fundamental technology issues that they can get past.
 
Paul F said:
With the dismal forewarning last month that Panasonic will not meet their earlier earnings forecast to the tune of about 20% lower earnings for FY2016, they continue to be in a position of needing to preserve cash and limit non-essential expenditures. So while this sensor technology appears to be a major breakthrough, there may be spending issues that prevent them from progressing. There may also be fundamental technology issues that they can get past.
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The former, for sure. The latter, I doubt it. The processes don't require wholly new tech, just commercialization, and others have already implemented similar techniques in shipping products.
 
I think the future is bright for M43 thanks to the technological possibilities. Even WITHOUT organic sensor tech, some future possibilities that are highly likely:

- Next gen sensor with the usual small improvements
- Backlit sensor allowing for more light & DR @ sensor level
- A video tuned version with lower megapixel count (12-14 vs 20) = larger photosites
- Continual processing improvements like we see every generation in terms of how the electronics process
- More & More bandwidth with continually smaller, cooler running chips and interfaces (Internal RAW)
- Software tuning of gamma and log profiles
- Smart software and in-camera compiling of HDRx modes (largely a software & throughput problem at this point)

Literally, that ALONE could bring a future GH6 or M43 camera to FS7 levels of lowlight and DR, if not beyond.

Add in the fact that how the image is electronically processed can change the look alot. Most of us associate M43 with the Panasonic processing look, but there's a lot of variance in what can be done electronically. Look at Blackmagic - it's not just the colors, the entire aesthetic is totally different. Nothing at all wrong with the M43 sensor size, even if Panasonic's particular rendition isn't to your liking for whatever reason.

After all this is considered, things like organic sensor tech take it to the next level. I have little doubt that M43 sensors will be complete beasts in 5-6 years.

In the meantime, I'm pretty impressed with the results TODAY.
 
filmguy123 said:
In the meantime, I'm pretty impressed with the results TODAY.
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combatentropy said:
Waiting for new technology is like watching organic photoconductive film dry.
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;)

The point is, knowing what's down the road can inform your investment decisions today. Some claim M43 is capped out, or dead, and is a temporary solution or stepping stone to larger format. This may be the case depending on where companies invest, but with the trend towards small and light and what is in the tech pipeline, the future of the format looks very promising.
 
TheDingo said:
10-bit 4:2:2 is going to give me a lot more options in post, and that is the biggest thing I look forward to with the GH5.
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10bit is getting attention, but nobody is really talking about the benefits of the 4:2:2 resolution bump. I wish one of the lucky testers would release some sample footage to key.
 
I'm very excited about the combo of that robust codec with high ISO because the net result in made even greater with those two things in place.

I also think the 5-axis is a really huge deal for anyone not working in a studio setting. And 180fps really blows open the options. There's a ton to be excited about here!
 
Jim Simon said:
That's partly why I'd like to see someone come up with a DCI compliant m4/3 camera. With the sensor having only the necessary 8.8 million pixels (4096 x 2160), the photosites can be larger and more sensitive to light.
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I'm not sure it would make a massive impact. 16mp was only slightly larger than a sensor that only needed 4096 pixels. The size of each photosite would go up but not by a massive amount. This concept works well on the Sony A7S because the sensor is larger so the 12mp made for some big honking photo sites.

we are talking photo sites that are 422 microns wide vs 374 microns wide, in theory of course. I'm sure it would help but I doubt it would have that big of an impact to increase the DR to 14 or more stops. Well thats compared to the GH4. To the GH5 that would be 422 microns vs 322 microns so that might have more of an impact. One thing I will say about 422 microns is the Nikon D500 has pixels that are 422 microns and it does get 14 stops...

I highly doubt we will ever see such a camera however. Panasonic really seems to be invested in over sampling like they are doing on the DVX200 and GH5. Creating an 8.8mp sensor would have a very limited market share and could be a bad investment for Panasonic. I would love to see a theoretical GHX but if the DVX200 didn't go this route I'm not sure if we will ever see it.
 
Thomas Smet said:
I'm not sure it would make a massive impact. 16mp was only slightly larger than a sensor that only needed 4096 pixels. The size of each photosite would go up but not by a massive amount. This concept works well on the Sony A7S because the sensor is larger so the 12mp made for some big honking photo sites.

we are talking photo sites that are 422 microns wide vs 374 microns wide, in theory of course. I'm sure it would help but I doubt it would have that big of an impact to increase the DR to 14 or more stops. Well thats compared to the GH4. To the GH5 that would be 422 microns vs 322 microns so that might have more of an impact. One thing I will say about 422 microns is the Nikon D500 has pixels that are 422 microns and it does get 14 stops...

I highly doubt we will ever see such a camera however. Panasonic really seems to be invested in over sampling like they are doing on the DVX200 and GH5. Creating an 8.8mp sensor would have a very limited market share and could be a bad investment for Panasonic. I would love to see a theoretical GHX but if the DVX200 didn't go this route I'm not sure if we will ever see it.
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We will never see it. Panasonic publicly confirmed that they are racing to 8K by 2020.
 
Thomas Smet said:
They better hurry up with that organic sensor then. That is 225 microns per photo site.
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Panasonic listens. While I do want 8K capture for 4K delivery, we need to keep reminding them that better DR is at least as important (more important at this point) as spacial resolution.
 
Thomas Smet said:
I highly doubt we will ever see such a camera however. Panasonic really seems to be invested in...
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To be honest, I'd actually rather see it come from Blackmagic. I think they have the better color science. BM colors and skin tone are just gorgeous. The difference is significant enough to weigh heavily on my decision to stick with the Pocket or switch back to the GH5.
 
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