GH4 GH4 for filming football from top of pressbox

BrandonT

BrandonT

Well-known member
Hi everyone. I have a project coming up where I'll have two cameras filming high school football. One will be on top of the pressbox to get a medium shot of the plays. And one handheld on the sideline. I'm considering using a GH4 for the top of pressbox shot. My buddy has it and the 14 - 140mm lens. Do you think that will have enough reach to get a medium shot of the players? Basically, to get the play in the shot.

Do you think that the GH4 will do well for this kind of shot (with a good fluid head tripod)? I think I would have him shoot in 4K. That way, I could punch in, in post, if I needed to. And it wouldn't be filming it all straight through. He could start and stop shooting for each play. It'll be for an end of year highlight reel, with highlights from each game.

And this is a more general question, but what shutter speed would you recommend? I'm pretty sure it would have to be a multiple of 1/60 in order to not get flicker from the stadium lights, right? I normally shoot at 1/60. But I'm guessing 1/120 is better for football, right?

From the top of the pressbox to the sideline, it's about 120 ft. To the very center of the field, it's about 200 ft. And to each goalpost, it's about 270 ft.

Thanks!
 
The purest in me says no, not a good fit. After 20 years in remote TV covering mostly sporting events, this does not seem to be the tool I would chose. That said, you need to get out there at night with the lights on and see if it will work for you.
 
Greg_E said:
The purest in me says no, not a good fit. After 20 years in remote TV covering mostly sporting events, this does not seem to be the tool I would chose. That said, you need to get out there at night with the lights on and see if it will work for you.
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That's what I was thinking at first, too. But I was considering it again. I will have one cam op on top of the pressbox, and one cam op on the sidelines (handheld). I have (or have access to) a Panasonic AC130A (22x zoom 1/3" sensor camera), a GH4 with 14 - 140mm lens, a Canon C100 Mark II, and a Canon G20. Only I can operate the C100, and I won't be at most games, so it can't be a dedicated camera position.

So that leaves me with three or four possible shooting scenarios. The Panasonic is a great fit for either position-- too bad I don't have two of them. When I'm there with the C100, I'm going to use it on the sideline. I don't really want to use the G20 because footage I've seen from it doesn't look great. It doesn't look terrible, but still not great.

How about the GH4 from the sideline? I've watched some good stuff filmed that way. The Panasonic would just be easier to operate on the sideline. Though I bet the GH4's footage would look a lot better (if shot correctly), even with the 14 - 140mm.

All said, I definitely have to get out there and see how it looks at night with the lights on. But I wanted to get viewpoints from here to help me decide on my setup beforehand.
 
The ac130a would certainly be easier to use, no budget for a second one?

For sidelines you really need something that can be shoulder mounted, maybe monopod to help steady the shoulder. At some point, you need to get out of the way fast! Don't want people crashing into your tripod. What about an AG-AC8PJ or something similar? Cheap, HD, should get the job done, and if it gets crushed it is cheap enough not to cry over. It is sports coverage after all, no need to shoot with 65mm for oodles of quality. The lens is a little lacking, but should work out OK, be better if it had a 55x zoom, but then it wouldn't be that cheap.
 
Top of the Press box, 200 feet?

I'd say yes.

That 14-140mm on the GH4 acts like a 280mm would on my Canon 6D. That's probably not EXACTLY as close as you might want to get, but you won't be far off.
Also, if you shoot in 4K on the GH4 you can zoom in even further and still keep the output at HD or better.

Is this a day or night game?
If it's a day game you're set, but if it's a night game then they better have full stadium lights as that lens isn't the fastest thing in the world.

Here's something I shot a few years ago with that lens on just a GH2 at MLB spring training in Goodyear Arizona.
As you can see, the nighttime shots were fine, and although much of it was captured close up, a fair amount was shot from higher in the stands, so you can get a little idea of the reach at a sports stadium.

 
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Greg_E said:
The ac130a would certainly be easier to use, no budget for a second one?

For sidelines you really need something that can be shoulder mounted, maybe monopod to help steady the shoulder. At some point, you need to get out of the way fast! Don't want people crashing into your tripod. What about an AG-AC8PJ or something similar? Cheap, HD, should get the job done, and if it gets crushed it is cheap enough not to cry over. It is sports coverage after all, no need to shoot with 65mm for oodles of quality. The lens is a little lacking, but should work out OK, be better if it had a 55x zoom, but then it wouldn't be that cheap.
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Thanks for your suggestions. I actually have a pretty good budget, by my standards. But buying another used AC130A would eat up about 45% of my profit. And it's August to December, so I can't rent. I need to use what I have or have access to. That's a good suggestion on the cheaper Panasonic with the shoulder rest. BUT, I've used the predecessor to that model and I really hate that camera. Besides having the shoulder rest, I would think that the Canon G20 would be comparable.

I would never use a tripod on the sidelines. And I might consider using a monopod myself, but I wouldn't allow someone working for me to use one. I've been broadcasting football since 2006. In that time, I've had two people get knocked over by players. They were paying too much attention to the screen, and not to their surroundings. Fortunately, no injuries, but they each got banged up. These were college students, not professionals. And this particular project isn't associated with that. It'll be a different shooting scenario and much higher quality, with experienced camera operators.

So sideline is handheld only. I've always had really good success with a camera like the AC130A handheld on the sideline.



DPStewart said:
Top of the Press box, 200 feet?

I'd say yes.

That 14-140mm on the GH4 acts like a 280mm would on my Canon 6D. That's probably not EXACTLY as close as you might want to get, but you won't be far off.
Also, if you shoot in 4K on the GH4 you can zoom in even further and still keep the output at HD or better.

Is this a day or night game?
If it's a day game you're set, but if it's a night game then they better have full stadium lights as that lens isn't the fastest thing in the world.

Here's something I shot a few years ago with that lens on just a GH2 at MLB spring training in Goodyear Arizona.
As you can see, the nighttime shots were fine, and although much of it was caputed close up, a fair amount was shot from higher in the stands, so you can get a little idea of the reach at a sports stadium.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that was my current line of thinking. Pretty much all of the games will start during daylight, and will be night time before they end. It's high school games from August through December. But all of the stadiums should have good lighting. I know that all of the local ones where we'll be shooting do.

Thank you for sharing the video, that was helpful.
 
I use a smart phone app called pCAM to show field of view for shots like this. It's a pretty good way to figure out which focal length lens to use to get the framing you are after.

Good luck with your project!

Dave
 
I think the GH4 or C100 can work for 50 yard line shots but the end video might look a bit stilted. As you probably know, there is a lot of micro zooming during a football play. The manual zoom just won't be great. So you will have a lot of post pan and scan work to make it look good which does not sound fun. How about buying a 2nd AC130 camera and selling it in Jan? How much is you time worth?
 
I shot a dozen college games anywhere from the 4th floor to the 6th floor in 3 stadiums last year with my GH4 and the 45-200 lens with no problem. Granted, the lighting in college stadiums tends to be better, but it could still work. Just make sure you turn OFF the electronic shutter. I had tons of issues with light-banding until I figured that out.
 
DigitalBard said:
I shot a dozen college games anywhere from the 4th floor to the 6th floor in 3 stadiums last year with my GH4 and the 45-200 lens with no problem. Granted, the lighting in college stadiums tends to be better, but it could still work. Just make sure you turn OFF the electronic shutter. I had tons of issues with light-banding until I figured that out.
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same here the 45-200 is an awesome lens for the sports job.
 
I remember this photographer on youtube testing photos and a little video at a high school football game and he had plenty of light so that lens could work. If too dark maybe get the olympus 40-140 2.8? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uPSmGxhNWQ

You will def need a practice run before getting it correct but I find the zoom better on the non DSLR so I would use that from the bleachers where you can have smooth zoom in and outs while the gh4 could get the close up action shots with easy run and gun.
 
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