GH1 vs. HV40 30 - 20- etc.

M

mikecazzx

Well-known member
Just started using the HV40 and I am wondering what its pros and cons are vs the GH1. I figured some users here may have had the HV series and moved to the GH1.

I want the shallow DOF for interview footage, but also want to capture action in mountain biking. I know about the mud issues on the GH1 and would combat that with tripod pans, homemade steadycam and panning with rider rather than having rider move through frame.

Is there a compelling reason to switch or is the motion issue enough reason to avoid it?

Is the larger sensor really that much larger?

Final output if good enough would be up to bluray.
 
jonE5 said:
plenty of people using DOF adapters on HV cameras.

For a good example check out this film done with a home made DOF adapter and an HV30.

http://vimeo.com/6407379
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Sorry, I forgot to adress that. With the added cost, I believe that brings the HV40 to or above the cost of the GH1 right? Also there are many posts saying aftermarket adapters ruin the image or cause issues on their own. Unsure about the clips you mentioned, they seem to be 4:3 and have artifacts in them around the riders. I will try from a better pc and check again.
 
mikecazzx said:
Is the larger sensor really that much larger?
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The HV has I think a 1/2.6" sensor, yes? Which puts it about halfway between 1/2" and 1/3", which means that it's in the ballpark of about 6.5mm wide. The GH1's sensor is 18mm wide, so ... factor that it's almost 3x wider, and almost 3x taller...

The GH1's sensor is about 8x as large as the HV camera's. So yeah, it's "that much larger." :thumbsup:
 
Well all the information you need are in these forums if you just do a search for it. I personally think having the ability to do quality stills and quality HD is way more exciting than an HV40.
 
mikecazzx said:
Just started using the HV40 and I am wondering what its pros and cons are vs the GH1. I figured some users here may have had the HV series and moved to the GH1.
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Had an HV20, now have a GH1 among many others...

The GH1 is the most video-camera-like of the DSLRs, but it's still a DSLR first. The HV has things like, oh, a headphone jack, timecode, zebras for exposure monitoring, the ability to execute a power zoom, and an alias-free image. The GH1, on the other hand, will utterly destroy the HV for low light sensitivity (you can go to about 400 ISO on the GH1, whereas the HV series are about 80 ISO), so if you put a fast lens on the GH1, the low light sensitivity will be substantially better.

I want the shallow DOF for interview footage
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GH1 wins huge here.

, but also want to capture action in mountain biking. I know about the mud issues on the GH1 and would combat that with tripod pans, homemade steadycam and panning with rider rather than having rider move through frame.
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Neither is ideal for that situation, because they both use rolling-shutter CMOS sensors. The GH1's codec is not as robust as the HV40's, so you'll see more degradation on fast action.

Is there a compelling reason to switch or is the motion issue enough reason to avoid it?
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Only you can answer that. For pure video purposes, I think a pure video camera will do a better job, but there's no denying the sensitivity advantages and the DOF advantages. If you're only shooting outdoors daylight, the sensitivity advantage is pretty much a non-issue, but if you're doing interior interviews, it'd become a factor.
 
Nitsuj said:
Well all the information you need are in these forums if you just do a search for it. I personally think having the ability to do quality stills and quality HD is way more exciting than an HV40.
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I agree, as good as the forums are though, it can quickly become overwhelming. I read about 7 hours worth before finally just asking via my post.
 
Thank you, I certainly did not how to find that math on that. At nearly 3x larger it is a very compelling reason to look into the GH1.
 
Barry_Green said:
Had an HV20, now have a GH1 among many others...

The GH1 is the most video-camera-like of the DSLRs, but it's still a DSLR first. The HV has things like, oh, a headphone jack, timecode, zebras for exposure monitoring, the ability to execute a power zoom, and an alias-free image. The GH1, on the other hand, will utterly destroy the HV for low light sensitivity (you can go to about 400 ISO on the GH1, whereas the HV series are about 80 ISO), so if you put a fast lens on the GH1, the low light sensitivity will be substantially better.


GH1 wins huge here.


Neither is ideal for that situation, because they both use rolling-shutter CMOS sensors. The GH1's codec is not as robust as the HV40's, so you'll see more degradation on fast action.


Only you can answer that. For pure video purposes, I think a pure video camera will do a better job, but there's no denying the sensitivity advantages and the DOF advantages. If you're only shooting outdoors daylight, the sensitivity advantage is pretty much a non-issue, but if you're doing interior interviews, it'd become a factor.
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Thanks again. With the larger sensor/lense, I assume that means much better picture overall vs the HV series. Lower light performance could be important for shooting near dusk or night and certainly interiors.

I tested a low cost Vado HD actually on the bike helmet and I am acutely aware of rolling shutter issues due to that. This time however the GH1 would not be on any bike at all. I was "hoping" with careful panning, tripod etc that the codec or rolling shutter might be an issue just following action. But...in the woods you have a constantly busy background of trees and leaves to contend with.
 
mikecazzx said:
With the larger sensor/lense, I assume that means much better picture overall vs the HV series.
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Never assume, because ... well, you know the rest of the phrase...

A 1/4" video camera like the HMC40 can put out a substantially sharper image than a huge-sensor DSLR like the GH1 or 7D. Not all things are equal, and the DSLRs don't use their full sensors, so you can't just say that because one is bigger, it inherently = better.
 
Barry_Green said:
Neither is ideal for that situation, because they both use rolling-shutter CMOS sensors. The GH1's codec is not as robust as the HV40's, so you'll see more degradation on fast action.
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I am new to video world, Barry i'm just wondering how what you said above hold to the two videos on the other thread http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=196892 how fast should the action be for degradation to become an issue?
 
Not sure what videos you're referring to, but codec degradation is a well known issue with the GH1. It's not necessarily due to how fast the action is, it's due to how much detail is in the shot and how much change there is per frame. A very shallow-DOF shot could have a lot of action and still hold up just fine. A very deep-focus shot of a forest doesn't need much action at all before the codec shows substantial degradation.

It's all about the amount of detail and how much changes from frame to frame.
 
Barry_Green said:
3x wider -- but also 3x taller, so effectively almost 9x larger.
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Exactly! That's a considerably larger amount of sensor space and even makes me dream of the full frame cameras. It makes me want to adjust my shooting plans just to get work with the camera and make it work.
 
Thanks alot, i now get it, many factors come into play.
Sorry i pasted the wrong link, i've now corrected it ... the Henryciullo submission.
 
mikecazzx said:
I agree, as good as the forums are though, it can quickly become overwhelming. I read about 7 hours worth before finally just asking via my post.
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How about just buy and try? Buy both, try them, and the cam you don't like, you sell on e-bay. Of course you will lose some money because you'll have to sell it for less money than you buy it for, but then at least you're sure you made the right decision. Someone on here is selling his GH1 by the way so you could buy his. Also when comparing prices are you taking costs for the lens for the GH1 in consideration? The kitlens might be good enough for what you're doing. You'll also need a handheld grip for the GH1 for proper shake-free operation.
 
Wow, I've been struggling with this for a month now. I have 2 HV30 and Olympus E500 and E300 and I just bought a GH1. I bought the GH1 because I'm looking to get out of wedding Videography/Photography as a hobby. I wanted to sell my equipment and get a all in one camera. I really love my tape based camcorders (mini HDV) and my Olympus cameras. I was very disappointed with the GH1. My Olympus picture quality is way better than the GH1 and my HV30 has better video quality than the GH1 in good to descent light areas. I like the HV30 24p better than GH1. But the GH1 has way better low light and DOF than the HV30. Where as the HV30 show a grainy image in low light ( which looks fine and film like to me), the GH1 has this nasty vertical banding and brown like smudges in low light using the 14 140 HD lens. Low light with a 24mm 2.0 om mount lens looks allot better. Low light looks good in 24p mode (GH1), but the nasty banding shows up in low light in the other recording modes. But again Low light is way better on GH1, but the nasty stripped and smudges looks terrible.
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah people are going to say use proper settings for lighting, exposure blah blah blah in order not to get the banding, but I prefer grain over that banding stuff.
I reason I stated earlier that I was torn, was because I love the HV30 (quality and tape based recording) but I like the all in one recording of the GH1 (low light with a fast lens, not the 14-140. DOF). $1400 for the low light banding crap, makes me kinda mad. The Gh1 is really small, pretty nice. I'm going to spend some time over the next couple of months and try to mix the 2 camera footage together to check out the results. Oh yeah another killer problem with the GH1, is flashes used by other cameras in a room ( during wedding events). Other flashes pixelate the video, really sucks.
Good luck, I'm really trying to like this camera. Sorry I don't have time to proof read
 
Barry_Green said:
The HV has I think a 1/2.6" sensor, yes? Which puts it about halfway between 1/2" and 1/3", which means that it's in the ballpark of about 6.5mm wide. The GH1's sensor is 18mm wide, so ... factor that it's almost 3x wider, and almost 3x taller...

The GH1's sensor is about 8x as large as the HV camera's. So yeah, it's "that much larger." :thumbsup:
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I have had a question, that I can seem to find a technical answer for... ok, so the sensor of the GH1 appears, for 'stills', to be about 4000x2000 (round numbers)... the Video is at 1920x1080... do they just 'skip' pixels, every so often, or do they average 'groups of pixels'...

On the topic of 'jaggies'... I've seen mention of 'low pass' filters, perhaps optical filters, to 'minimize' this effect on video cameras. Since the GH1 is a still camera, at the afore mentioned spatial resolution, any 'optical' filter would be for that resolution and not for the somehowsubsampled video image. Is there some post-sensor dsp processing to effect the low pass filtering?

As a note, note, in most digital stills I've been in the habit of running an unsharp mask over the image to sort of 'clean up' a certain softness that digital images seem to have. Is this a process that is of benefit to 'video' from the 'still camera', or would that just increase the jaggies and not add to the overall psychological evaluation of 'sharpness'.
 
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