GH1 Motion Picture settings (Beginner's Question)

[pmk396]

Hi all,

I am a beginner to the world of amateur film making although I have acted in one or two. Anyway, I've had the GH1 for only a couple of weeks now and I'm still getting used to it. After a lot of research as to what camera to get, it is my first ever purchase that I have made for the purposes of amateur film-making.

I have tested a few things out with the motion picture and can't seem to satisfy myself as to which settings (apeture setting, shutter speed, lens type/size and even video format [avchd or mjpeg]) to use for various shots in a feature length that I plan to make over the next 18 months. The film is basically an action feature with everything from
i) outdoor night time scenes,
ii) indoor scenes,
iii) action scenes (with fast movements being filmed),
iv) in car scenes.

I was wondering if anybody could suggest what are the best settings (f-value, shutter speed, lens type) to use on the GH1 for the different scene types listed above. As I said I have tried and tested some already (some I like and some I don't) but seeing as I am only a beginner, I would appreciate some input and suggestions from the more experienced GH1 users.

Thanks

 

[Homunculus]

listen I'm an amateur at this stuff just like you are and recently got my own GH1 but I have been researching the same questions so I'll share some of the answers I've found with you though take them with a grain of salt as I said I am not an expert.

-Many resources say to just stick your shutter speed at 1/50 and leave it there. The reason for this is if you plan to do 24fps for the film look then the shutter speed needs to be the closest possible interval of that in order to get a proper film cadence in editing.

-However from what I've read you will probably want to put your shutter speed higher for the following reasons 1. action scenes with fast motion so that there's not the 'choppiness' effect and 2. if you plan to do slow motion scenes you need all the frames you can get so you will want to do much faster shutter

-the lens aperture (f stops) is completely based on what type of scene you're shooting. The wider your aperture (the lower the f number like f5 or f4) the more light the lens can take in, however the more shallow the depth of field it also makes. So this will have to depend on what scene you're shooting. If you're shooting at night for example with minimal lighting then probably no lens over F/2 will gather enough light. You'd need probably an f/1.4 or 1.8 etc to shoot in really low light.

-lens type also depends what type of shot you're trying to do. A wide shot, where you want to have as much stuff in the screen as possible (like a big landscape shot) you'll need a lower focal length lens like 20mm or 40mm etc. A close up shot you might want higher focal lengths to be able to be zoomed at someone's face.
Keep in mind that a "normal lens" is 50mm and is called normal because it is the closest equivalent to how a human eye sees, so for "normal" sort of shots that are not wide and not up close, you'll need a roughly 50mm. However keep in mind that due to the cropping effect of micro 4/3rds dslr's like GH1 apparently canon/nikon lenses etc act as twice the focal length than what is printed on the lens. So to get a 'normal' 50mm lens effect on a canon/nikon lens you'd need a 25mm canon/nikon. Whereas a 50mm canon/nikon would act as a 100mm sight

 

[pmk396]

Thanks Homunculus,

I appreciate the reply.

I had a basic understand of the f-value of the aperture and I probably would use f1.4 lens for the night shots. I wonder what kind f-value to use for action shots. Basically, I have the lens kit which is good and I'll probably get a Canon FD 50mm 1.4 or a Lumix 20mm 1.7 for the night shots but would those two lens be enough for me for all other shots?

As for the shutter speed, I read somewhere (maybe in the GH1 manual) that the lower shutter speed while filming fast movements can cause some discrepencies or the "choppiness" that you describe. To overcome any choppiness, by setting a higher shutter speed cause problems for me later in post production? Ideally, you say a shutter speed such as 1/50 is close to the 25fps so we should keep it there but fast movements such as a choreographed fight scene or a speeding car might cause this choppiness. So what would be the best shutter speed to film an action scene?

 

[Homunculus]

hey. I'm not 100% sure so I'll wait til an expert replies though perhaps it should be at least perfect intervals of 50 like 1/100 or 1/200 etc not sure....but what I do know is that be careful because the faster the shutter speed, it also means the less light you're taking in unless you have a 'fast lens'. So if your lighting conditions are not optimal (dim light, night time etc) you won't be able to get away with fast shutter without a super fast lens because your footage will be dim as hell.
And yes the canon fd 50mm 1.4 and lumix 20mm are good choices that I too am looking at (wait are YOU the guy that just outbid me on the canon on ebay? LOL) but like I said apparently the canon 50mm 1.4 will be equivalent to 100mm on the gh1 due to cropping, so keep that in mind that's not exactly a 'wide shot' that's like telephoto territory. The lumix 20mm 1.7 on the other hand seems amazing and I want that badly...just seeing first if I can get it for cheaper somewhere used but no look so far so I'm going to have to buy it for full price which is pretty high for a beginner ($399) as you probably know.

Also remember it's not just as simple as aperture because there's many lenses out there like nikon 1.8 I think that are very cheap and can be had for like 90$ used, but problem is if you read the reviews they are not very sharp at their highest aperture. So the image according to some people at their f/1.8 value is unusably "blurry". You get what you pay for so I'm just saying, don't think that all lenses are equal just because they have the same aperture value, do research and read reviews etc ...it seems for example the Lumix 20mm 1.7 I keep reading is exceptionally sharp and clear at its highest apertures unlike some of those cheaper lenses, so that's one of the reasons it's so expensive is because the optics are just much better, etc.

Also as per your question what kind of aperture to use on action shots? Well remember this, aperture also controls depth of field not just light so your question must be answered with depends on the scene you're shooting for example if your action scene is at night then you probably have no choice but to shoot at much higher aperture like 1.4 to 2.0 etc...if it's during the day then obviously you can shoot with lower aperture like f4 or higher and use aperture to also control your depth of field, depending on the type of shot(s) you're doing do you want just the subject(s) to be in focus or everything to be in focus etc etc you have to think about the design of your shot. So in day time you may want a real open aperture if you want shallow depth of field, however this may take in too much light so then you compensate that by either increasing shutter speed which reduces light (which you'll probably want to do during action scene anyway) or lowering ISO, or using a filter on the lens perhaps, etc, etc...

 

[iain.bason]

if you plan to do slow motion scenes you need all the frames you can get so you will want to do much faster shutter

It turns out that frame rate and shutter speed are unrelated (except that you can't have a shutter speed slower than your frame rate). To get smooth slow motion you need a high frame rate. Using a high shutter speed is not sufficient.

That being said, it is possible that a higher shutter speed would allow fancy motion detection software to do a better job creating slow motion footage. The software tries to figure out which parts of a picture have moved between one frame and the next, and creates an intermediate frame accordingly. I can imagine it might not work as well when there is substantial motion blur. I haven't experimented, though, so I can't say for sure.

 

[iain.bason]

As for the shutter speed, I read somewhere (maybe in the GH1 manual) that the lower shutter speed while filming fast movements can cause some discrepencies or the "choppiness" that you describe.

Actually, a higher shutter speed will look more choppy. It's kind of like seeing motion under a strobe light (except without the flashing). A lower shutter speed will look smoother, but blurred.

Either way is OK. It depends on what look you're going for.

 

[pmk396]

Thanks again for all the replies.

Just one more question.....

For what kinda shots would I use the 1080 avchd format and when should I use the 720 mjpeg format?

I read that using the 1080 avchd format [fhd] when recording fast-moving sujects, some after images or distortion may be noticable in playback.

Would I be right in guessing that I should use the 1080 avchd format when filming shots that have little or no fast moving subjects in it, and use the 720 mjpeg format for fast moving scenes??

And which format is best for night time shots?

 

[Shinobi Productions]

The general rule I have observed is Shutter speed=2X frame rate. So, if you are shooting 24fps, you would aim for closest to 1/48th, 60 fps with 1/120th and so on.