GF1 and GH1 low light sensitivity

Z

ZeusFaber

Active member
Hi all,

Readinf all the post about low light sensitivity of these camera I tough that it was far better than the average camcorder.
Then I found thes two test on http://www.digitalcamerainfo.com

GF1

http://images.camcorderinfo.com/ima...c_GF1/Charts/Panasonic_GF1_LL_sensitivity.gif

GH1

http://images.camcorderinfo.com/ima...1/Charts/Panasonic_DMC-GH1_LL_sensitivity.gif

From their test, GF1 is far behind GH1 and GH1 is far behind a HS300 camcorder :(

Is still true with the hack?

I'm planning to buy a GF1 for underwater use (deep dives without lights) and I always read that DSRL in low light are better than average camcorders for their larger sensor

Could you put some light on this?
 
Well...the hack does not change the low light performance of these cams. It increases the data rate which helps alleviate many of the artifacts you see due to compression.
I don't know the HS300 camcorder but I'm guessing it's better due to the slower kit lens that comes with the GF1/GH-1. As nice as the Kit lens is you really need to get faster lenses.

Edit: Are you planning on diving during the day? I've never went diving but I can imagine there will still be some light coming through. You might have to crank up the ISOs (while using fast lens). What i find about DSLRs vs camcorders is their noise does not increase as much compared to cranking up the gain in camcorders. In other words...the images from the DSLRs to me are much cleaner than camcorders when cranking up the gain/ISOs.
 
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ZeusFaber said:
From their test, GF1 is far behind GH1 and GH1 is far behind a HS300 camcorder :(

Is still true with the hack?

I'm planning to buy a GF1 for underwater use (deep dives without lights) and I always read that DSRL in low light are better than average camcorders for their larger sensor

Could you put some light on this?
Click to expand...
A common hardware hack that allows DSCs (Digital Systems Cameras) to outperform common camcorders in low-light performance is the ability to change lenses. As Ian mentioned, it appears that tests were taken with kit lenses which in general a quite slow. With that said HS300 appears to be a well equipped camcorder with an f/1.8 constant aperture throughtout the zoom range. A GF1 equipped with a Panasonic 20 mm/f1.7 pancake or a Panasonic-Leica 25mm/f1.4 or even the manual focus Voigtlander 25 mm/f0.95 will outperform the HS300 in low-light category. However, for your underwater run-n-gun scenario the bigger quesion is managing focus, which may become an issue given quite shallow DoF when shooting with lens wide open on a larger sensor camera. All things considered, a camcorder like HS300 may end up being a better choice because some noise in the footage is a smaller problem than subjects out of focus.
 
Actually, as I said as you put a GH1/GF1 into a uw housing most of the time you have to stick with the kit lenses.
Both the 14-45 and 7-14 aren't too fast: F4 and the same for the cheaper Zuiko 8-19.
A good choice would be
Usually underwater you shoot macro or wideangle. For macro and fish woudn't be problems with the 20mm/f1.7 which becomes 40mm or the Panasonic Leica 45mm f2.8. Actually for macro shoot the max aperture isn't a problem because you always use artificial lights. Wide angle shoots are taken always with ambient light so it's important having a fast wa lens.
Unfortunately all the Panasonic wa lens aren't fast lenses. A good choice would be the Tokina 11-16/f2.8 but it isn't compatible with most housing.
In Land based shooting you have a far wide choices on lens.
This is the reason of my question about sensitivity compared to camcorders.

For photographic use there is no problem because you always use flash lights. Take a look a these wonderful photos:

http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=32112&view=findpost&p=258724
 
I've never been more than a few feet underwater, let alone filmed there, but is that a situation where you would want a shallow depth of field? Because it seems to me, with all those fish moving around, it might be the exact sort of situation where you wouldn't. And if not, maybe it's a case where a small-sensor camcorder's ability to preserve a broad depth of field even at wide aperture would be an advantage.

Otherwise, as has been much discussed, there is a relative lack of wide/fast lenses for this u4/3. With an adapter you could use the Olympus 4/3 14-54mm f/2.8-3.5 which will autofocus (AF-S only) on the GH1 (I don't know about the GF1.)
 
mountainradio said:
I've never been more than a few feet underwater, let alone filmed there, but is that a situation where you would want a shallow depth of field? Because it seems to me, with all those fish moving around, it might be the exact sort of situation where you wouldn't. And if not, maybe it's a case where a small-sensor camcorder's ability to preserve a broad depth of field even at wide aperture would be an advantage.
Click to expand...

No, underwater you wouldn't like a shallow DOF but the deepest one.
AF it's another unnecessary feature. Actually AF doesn't work very well underwater: as you point in the blue the camera starts hunting...

Right now with my sony camcorder and a moderate wa lens (about 28 mm) when I shoot ambient subjects as wrecks or walls I set the manual focus to 5 meter or sometime to infinite. Everything from one meter to infinite result in focus.

With a GH1/GF1 (crop factor 2x) and a 7mm lens focusing at 2 meter will result in a DOF with a near limit of 0,5 meter to infinite.


Otherwise, as has been much discussed, there is a relative lack of wide/fast lenses for this u4/3. With an adapter you could use the Olympus 4/3 14-54mm f/2.8-3.5 which will autofocus (AF-S only) on the GH1 (I don't know about the GF1.)
Click to expand...

Would be nice having a 7/8 mm f2.8. :Drogar-Love(DBG):
I wrote to the housing manifacturer if the tokina 11-16/f2.8 nikon mount with the adapter ring is compatible with their dome port...
 
ZeusFaber said:
No, underwater you wouldn't like a shallow DOF but the deepest one.
AF it's another unnecessary feature. Actually AF doesn't work very well underwater: as you point in the blue the camera starts hunting...

Right now with my sony camcorder and a moderate wa lens (about 28 mm) when I shoot ambient subjects as wrecks or walls I set the manual focus to 5 meter or sometime to infinite. Everything from one meter to infinite result in focus.
Click to expand...
Sounds like the camcorder is the right tool for the job. So why not go for HS300?
 
svecher said:
Sounds like the camcorder is the right tool for the job. So why not go for HS300?
Click to expand...

For the same reason many people switched to VidDSRL: you get a professional tool for 1/10th of the money :)

A GH1 with 8-19mm plus a decent uw housing has a corresponding 16mm at its widest side and complete manual control. A camcorder with full manual controls and a uw housing with all the manual control on it and a wa lens like a Fathom would cost about 10.000 euro.

Now I'm just trying to evaluate the low light sensitivity respect to a camcorder.
 
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