FS700 with Atomos Shogun recorder

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ebsseattle

Active member
I'm thinking about getting the Atomos Shogun 4K HDMI/12G-SDI Recorder and 7" Monitor but wanted to find out if anyone knows a bit more about this.

Can the Shogun record 120fps slow motion video straight from the camera without needing to sit around and wait for the render time that the FS700 normally requires? If not, anyone know of an external drive that offers this option?
 
ebsseattle said:
I'm thinking about getting the Atomos Shogun 4K HDMI/12G-SDI Recorder and 7" Monitor but wanted to find out if anyone knows a bit more about this.

Can the Shogun record 120fps slow motion video straight from the camera without needing to sit around and wait for the render time that the FS700 normally requires? If not, anyone know of an external drive that offers this option?
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The Shogun cannot currently record anything higher than 30p from the RAW output of the FS700.

The Convergent Design Odyssey7Q+ can record 4K RAW in a 120p burst for a short 440 frames (4 seconds realtime, 18.5 seconds played back in slow motion). This is currently a RAW recording but will soon be available as a direct capture in 4K Apple ProRes.

The Odyssey7Q+ can also record 2K RAW up to 240p and can do this continuously until running out of memory (up to 40 minutes with currently available media -- with a playback time of 400 minutes!) At 120p that would be a continuous runtime of 80 minutes with the same 400 minutes playback. This again is in RAW but will soon be available as a direct processing into Apple ProRes, which will then yield about three times greater record time and no prost processing. The Odyssey7Q+ is the only device to offer this.
 
Thanks for the info. That's what I was hoping to get, something like the 7Q+. So there's no lag on real-time recording/rendering of the slow motion content? That is, is there a rendering period needed once the camera cuts at the end of recording these clips, or does the whole process happen real time?
 
ebsseattle said:
Thanks for the info. That's what I was hoping to get, something like the 7Q+. So there's no lag on real-time recording/rendering of the slow motion content? That is, is there a rendering period needed once the camera cuts at the end of recording these clips, or does the whole process happen real time?
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4K high speed is simply too much data to push out of the camera's single 3G-SDI port at live speed. So the camera uses the internal memory buffer to save 440 frames, and then outputs them to the Odyssey7Q+ at the equivalent of 4K60p (but it is captured from the sensor at 120p). So that methodolody goes as follows: Set camera to 4K120p with END TRIGGER. Hit trigger on camera and the memory buffer of the previous 3.7 seconds (440frames@120p) takes 7.3 seconds (440frames@60p) to offload to the Odyssey7Q+. It's ready for another take in about 2 additional seconds. That take played back at 24p lasts 18.3 seconds.

At 2K120p or 2K240p, the data fits across the 3G-SDI connection, so the signal is recorded continuously. You shoot like you would at normal speed, starting and stopping using the record button.
 
I'm looking at shooting max 2K, but when shooting web content am happy at just 1920x1080. One followup question I have is, aside from the time-saving I'd have with the 7Q+ by not having to render slow motion footage, is there that much of a noticeable difference of shooting native ProRes instead of shooting using the FS700's internal codec and later rendering in FCP? If so, do you have any head to head samples you can show to show me what I'm missing out on?
 
ebsseattle said:
I'm looking at shooting max 2K, but when shooting web content am happy at just 1920x1080. One followup question I have is, aside from the time-saving I'd have with the 7Q+ by not having to render slow motion footage, is there that much of a noticeable difference of shooting native ProRes instead of shooting using the FS700's internal codec and later rendering in FCP? If so, do you have any head to head samples you can show to show me what I'm missing out on?
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It absolutely makes a difference. Philip Bloom made a nice comparison video. It's about a year and a half old, so the differences are even more acute now, but I think this illustrates the differences nicely.

https://vimeo.com/90469354
 
I'm a little confused because in the samples, the only major difference in clarity seemed to come when jumping up to the 4k image. Of course at a 300% zoom the 4k images will be crisper, but I don't see how that would be affected by the 7Q+. The AVCHD and the ProRes versions look almost identical. Am I missing something?
 
I believe there are 4 modes the Philip is comparing:
1. AVCHD Internal - Recorded on SD Card from FS700
2. PRORES HQ from 8 bit SDI - An option if you want the Odyssey but don't want to pay for the RAW upgrade. I would consider it a waste to have a FS700 and a Odyssey 7q and be recording in this option.
3. PRORES HQ from 12 bit 4k RAW Signal - AKA 4K2HD. This is the one that FS700 users routinely use. The FS700 sends a 4k raw signal to the Odyssey, and the odyssey down-converts it into 2k or 1080p. You need to pay for the RAW recording bundle from CD first though.
4. 4k RAW to PRORES HQ 4k in Resolve - Recorded 4k raw and then did the conversion in post-production.

It is #3 that FS700 users are so excited about when it compares to #1, and the difference in clarity and resolution is remarkable. Since PB posted that video, the Odyssey will now do #4 directly in the Odyssey, skipping the RAW conversion step in post all together
 
Now I understand. I was assuming it was recording at 4K which, for the project I have in mind, is overkill and just complicating life (it'll be a web broadcast). But if I'm able to get that clarity in a 2K or HD image, that's great. Thanks for the explanation!

Do you what Sony's turn-around time is these days when sending in your camera for the 4K upgrade? Cost?
 
It depends on Sony Service's current backlog, and you can simply call them to ask. I imagine 1-3 weeks, tops. I believe the fee for the upgrade is $400, but again you should ask them.
 
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