FS700 Relevance

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anchoricex

Member
How long do you folks think the FS700 will remain relevant? With Sony/Panny coming out with new full frame 4k video/photo DSLR's this year do you think that the FS700 will still continue to hold its ground and value with things like 4k only being accessible by addons? I am interested in whether or not these new DSLR's will come with high framerates like the FS700. I think many of us were lured into the camera because of that reason (though our obsession with high frame rates has seemed to die off a little, it's nice having it there for when you need it).
 
anchoricex said:
How long do you folks think the FS700 will remain relevant? With Sony/Panny coming out with new full frame 4k video/photo DSLR's this year do you think that the FS700 will still continue to hold its ground and value with things like 4k only being accessible by addons? I am interested in whether or not these new DSLR's will come with high framerates like the FS700. I think many of us were lured into the camera because of that reason (though our obsession with high frame rates has seemed to die off a little, it's nice having it there for when you need it).
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I think the big thing is that the FS700 is a video camera with ND's and though the out of the box ergonomics are not great it can easily be turned into a great shoulder cam. DSLRs IMHO are great for stills but basically pretty bad for video, I still have a 5DmkII and a 7D but I only use them for stills now. The FS700 and C100 have replaced them for me as video cameras.

The 2K RAW 240 fps is pretty fantastic and I think will not have much competition for a few years, I could be wrong, we shall see what NAB brings.

The FS700 Odyssey combo is really more manageable and affordable the Sony solutions F5 and F55. And much better than the BMCC solution. I sent my BMCC back, lets not go there.

So yes I think the FS700 is and will be an important part of many shooters kit for a few more years.
 
It baffles me how manufacturers still fail to deliver built in ND filters with their cameras. I feel like this is something that photographers AND videographers beg for on every camera.
 
Seriously? It took consumers about 5 years to make the transition from DV (720x480) to HDV (1920x1080). 4K is facing the same transition time, probably longer because 4k sources aren't readily available. At the time HDV was introduced, computer processor speeds had advanced to the point of being able to handle HDV. The same isn't true for 4K. Processor speeds remain about 3 GHz. Parallel processing hasn't taken off because programs still aren't written to be multi-threaded. And to put the nail in the coffin, storage drive speeds are highly limiting to both storing and passing the volume of 4K data.
I think the FS700/O7Q will be around for a few more years.
 
I think because of the 7Q, the FS700 will last a bit longer. S-Log 2 itself is a huge step up and gives the FS700 a notch over cameras like the C300, not to mention all the codec options. Plus, things announced at NAB often take a long time to come out. Look at the BMCs as a perfect example.
 
4K ist like a SUV (at least in Europe). Nobody needs it, nobody drives off road or is even allowed to - but people are buying SUVs despite more gas consumption, narrow parking space and high prices. I am shure we will see the 4k request quite often very soon. It is already present in events and trade shows. I see the biggest handicap for a long future of the FS700 in lens quality for 4K. But to bridge the next two years it will be a great versatile tool for a reasonable price.

I bought the FS700 in Sept 2012 because ND filters, slow motion and a huge step in quality and handling from a DSLR. I didn't plan to go for 4K with it and it came faster into reality than I expected.
 
anchoricex said:
It baffles me how manufacturers still fail to deliver built in ND filters with their cameras. I feel like this is something that photographers AND videographers beg for on every camera.
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that has changed. Even a C100 has them in the meanwhile.
 
It's hard to say, but I think it will remain relevant as long as we who own the FS700 decide to utilize this fine tool. The upgrade path to 4K is here now, the DR of the sensor is pretty damn good, and frankly, I don't think the clients I work with care which hammer I use as long as the nails get driven well. The FS700 is one fine hammer, IMHO.
 
From my point of view, the FS700 is an extremely unique camera even in this current market of so many cameras. It really seems to do everything, which is great for owners who do different kinds of work and would prefer to own only one camera to keep costs down (I'd rather own one camera that works all the time than two if one will always be on the shelf when I'm working, if you do rental business that might be a different story since there is no accounting for renters tastes in cameras (Disclaimer: I have always owned more more than one camera, but I think I'd prefer not to if I could avoid it*)). Right now it is my most-of-the-time camera which is great for quick shoots, run and gun, lower budgets, slow mo, etc, but I still have a Scarlet for bigger budgets that want 4K, RAW, better color and better image fidelity, also a GH2 and gopro3 for crazy low budgets and B/C-cam and vacation :) . With the 7Q I will be able to get that image quality just by bringing along a monitor (that records 4K) which I'd bring along anyway for narrative/commercial/bigger-budgets and maybe not have to own an additional second camera that is 2-3x the price. Though I may still have to hold onto my Scarlet if the dragon sensor is totally amazing.

Comparing the FS700 to Canon C100/300/500 cameras you'd have to own a C100 and C500 for $30k plus recorder to only do some of what the FS700 will be able to do for $7K plus the 7Q, and the Canons still wont do 240fps or work with a speedbooster even for 4x the price. Blackmagic cameras are a similar comparison only with less functionality and worse ergonomics for a lower price, plus BMPC is 4k but way low sensitivity and low DR, BMCC is only 2.5K and smaller sensor, and BMPCC is very inexpensive but much smaller sensor and only 1080p and practically unusable due to battery/card limitations.

Comparing to higher end cinema cameras including Alexa/RED, what the FS700+7Q will lack very slightly in DR compared to a $100k Alexa or a $30-60k Epic Dragon it makes up for in sensitivity. Not to mention those also don't do 240fps without heavy cropping or work with a speedbooster, though the Dragon sensor gets a bit closer in sensor size to the FS700+SB at 6K. Of course that may not be a good tradeoff for everyone, but considering those cameras are 5-15x the price of an FS700+7Q, it's unclear if that is even worth comparing. Breaking it down, also, RED locks you into 4-6K RAW recording while also weighing more and drawing at least 3x as much power (>3x the expense and weight for batteries), and Alexa is only 2.8K so it doesn't even do 4K and requires even more power and is even heavier and larger, about 5-6x as much which will require that much greater weight and expense. Neither of these are cameras you can really operate without an assistant or run handheld all day or throw in one bag or carry enough batteries/cards in your pocket/pouch to run all day like you can with an FS700, so you'd need another camera if you want to do any of that as a RED/Alexa owner...

There's Sony's F5/F55 too, which are similar in feature-set, but again much more expensive without more features except for internal recording formats and the F55 has a global shutter and wider gamut. And then they cost 2-4x more and don't work with the 7Q for 4K recording and draw more power and the higher cost means you may not be able to bring them on lower budget shoots and the ergonomics necessitate accessories for run and gun shooting which is the main situation where I really would prefer not to have extra accessories weighing me down. I'm sure these make sense for some people who like Sony's particular codecs or RAW workflow or do particular work that can pay for the higher camera cost, but for me a low cost camera that does the same stuff means I can take it on more jobs and not worry about it not fitting the budget of some of the lower paid jobs while also working great for bigger budget jobs once the 7Q does 4K prores with LUT support from raw. But if you need XAVC or Sony 4K RAW and want to pay for it, these will make sense.

I mean what else is there really? Yes there are some compromises you have to make when recording internally (non-7Q), there's the primary colored highlight color shifting unless you use SLOG2 and the black pixels at high contrast edges even if you do, but nothing that's not good enough for web and most HD broadcast. Canon has nicer color and better log gamma for a lower price, but you lose half the big features (highspeed, speedbooster, RAW, 4K) for it and if those are features you ever want to use you can't get them back by buying an accessory for your C100. There are some other interesting cameras out there, some of which have ergonomic/price/DR/sensor-size dealbreakers, but the FS700 once you add the option of a 7Q really will do basically anything you want for the about the lowest price possible and some things no other camera does for any price and there doesn't seem to be any sign of that changing.

*Sorry for the nested parentheticals
 
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After shooting a recent feature, I had fully intended to sell mine to avoid the depreciation that always happens at this point in the life cycle. But due to a recurring gig where I've been using it as an A cam, along with some potential music video opportunities, looks like I'll be holding on. Just one job a month will offset any depreciation. Might just end up getting a 7Q for it to extend it's usefulness even more.
 
nyvz said:
...once the 7Q does 4K prores with LUT support from raw.
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Once CD implement the proposed O7Q features from roadmap to firmware, I will have another look at the FS700. Of interest, shoot 4K to extract 2x anamorphic in 2K/1080p finish. And the E-mount, the short FFD allows for adapters to just about any lens, great for my legacy glass. A robust FZ-mount would be ideal, like on the F5/F55. Then there is NAB 2014. I'm watching this 700 and O7Q space.
 
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