Filming w/o a Permit in NYC - Parks and Abandoned Locations

S

sb2012

Member
I'm looking at some deserted/abandoned areas for a feature film I'm doing next year in NYC. It will mostly be after midnight shoots so most people won't be out in these areas. I'm looking at places like Red Hook and Williamsburg. Also looking to film in some small parks like Battery Park and Prospect Park (after midnight as well). Equipment includes lighting, tripod, DIY dolly, camera, boom mic, and maybe a small portable generator for power. Cast and crew are very small. No explosions or anything crazy like that, not an action film.

This would be without a permit, I know many of you might say that's risky, but one of my friends who is a pro said we won't get in trouble using those particular areas as long as we are not posing any danger to the public or blocking traffic, etc. I know film permits here cost $300 but they want $1 million in insurance, and I'm guessing to get that kind of insurance costs more than $300 (?).

I was wondering if anyone has had experience filming in these areas before? Also, if anyone knows of any abandoned warehouses/buildings that could be used?
 
"Abandoned" properties are still private properties. If you're looking for advice here on how to trespass and stay under the radar without permits, I'm afraid we cannot help.

What happens if something goes wrong during your production? An injury (someone falls, or a piece of the abandoned warehouse falls on a crew/cast member)? A fire (even if you aren't dealing with pyrotechnics, lighting can fall over if it's not securely weighted)? And what if someone happens to call the cops for suspicious activity around the property? Just because it's after midnight doesn't mean you're off the hook.

Do yourself a favor: get permission from property owners, and get it in writing (aka location release). Get insurance; it can be more expensive not to have it. And film permits are generally required for public property (parks), but may not be necessary for private properties.
 
You can get arrested for trespassing on private property. You would be surprised how many owners don't care if you film at a private location as long as the crew is small. I ask a private yacht club years ago if I could film there. Come on, think about it, a PRIVATE YACHT CLUB. They said sure. I didn't need a permit. Just needed to tell them where and when.

Ask, ask, ask and see what you can get for free and without a permit is my advice.
 
Red Hook you are going to have no problem, Williamsburg will be a bit harder depending where you are due to an increased police presence. But it all really depends....awhile ago I was shooting a short and I got a permit for a sidewalk on the Greenpoint/Williamsburg border. I couldn't use that location due to the parked cars obstructing the view, so I went one block over and set up 20 feet of dolly track, and basically took over this empty sidewalk. Cops drove by, gave us a look and drove off. So it really depends how much they feel like screwing with you, and what you're doing. If you're shooting a mob thing with prop guns they will certainly screw with you. The lighting and generator will probably not help your case too....
 
You should also make sure to be nice to any neighbors (if there are any) where you are shooting. I had a scene on my friends rooftop on Grand st in Williamsburg that involved a few big HMI's that I rented and a small trash can fire. A neighbor was pissed off that we were shooting, and called the fire dept on us, who shut us down for the night. So if you have a decent crafty setup invite some of the locals that are hanging around for a donut and coffee (just have a PA watch them so they don't grab any gear, or put themselves in harms way).
 
I see everyone's points. Well, for those of you who shot in NYC *with* permits, would you happen to know how much of a fee it costs to get the $1 million insurance in order to obtain the $300 film permit? Because they don't mention on the website, they do give a list of places that offer the insurance but they don't give like a range of how much it costs to get it. If the $1 million insurance is not thousands and thousands of dollars then I'll probably just pay for it and then pay for the $300 permit.
 
The last time I shot with a permit in NYC and had the full insurance it was around $1400 for a four day shoot. I felt ripped off, but it had to be done. I believe I had my insurance through film emporium when that was still around. The insurance will be better bang for your buck for a feature anyway.
 
You need permission for filming in New York parks, and you might even need a permit depending on what the parks requirements are. Filming on the street in New York is easier than shooting in a park. I actually think filming after midnight will draw more attention than just a small crew in a park during the day time.

http://www.nycgovparks.org/permits/film-and-photo-guidelines

Here's some info about permitting in New York. If your production is small enough it sounds like you can avoid the insurance requirement and not even have to pay the $300 application fee. I would start with this process first and see if you are required to get a permit and fork over cash. If not you could do this then get permission from the parks for free.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/film/html/news/important_info_permits.shtml
 
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I am glad to see that you are looking into getting a permit AND insurance. it may seem like an "un-needed thing" since you probably have filmed guerrila-style "forever".

But if ever have an issue, like some of the examples Alex mentioned, and dozens if not hundreds more reasons, you will kiss the ground you walk on in the thanks that you did.
 
robmneilson said:
The last time I shot with a permit in NYC and had the full insurance it was around $1400 for a four day shoot. I felt ripped off, but it had to be done. I believe I had my insurance through film emporium when that was still around. The insurance will be better bang for your buck for a feature anyway.
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Whoa, $1400 for *four days* only?? So if I'm shooting a feature, let's say 3 weeks (I know it won't be done in 4 days that's for sure) for example, oh goodness I hate to think of the amount. Using your price quote, to get insurance for my film would probably cost me like $7000. That's nuts. Did they just tell you $1400 for four days based on what type of scenes you were shooting? Or was that straight up flat-quote pricing?
 
Doc Bernard said:
I am glad to see that you are looking into getting a permit AND insurance. it may seem like an "un-needed thing" since you probably have filmed guerrila-style "forever".

But if ever have an issue, like some of the examples Alex mentioned, and dozens if not hundreds more reasons, you will kiss the ground you walk on in the thanks that you did.
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Actually, this will be my first feature film. I did a short film earlier this year, it was a 2 day shoot, one day we spent inside someone's apartment and the other one was after hours on Coney Island beach.

I will see if I can afford the insurance along with the equipment and feeding the actors. If I can't though, I would certainly like to find a gray line in between "filming with permission" vs. "filming without permission in areas that won't get you arrested". This is just another reason for me to hate NY, it's not particularly film friendly for the "little people". Kinda makes me envious towards those big film studios that just easily waltz right into any neighborhood with their film permits, insurance, huge trailer trucks, a million gazillion lights and equipment, etc. all up front and ready.

I originally wanted to film this feature on Roosevelt Island after midnight. I talked to the permit department there and they said they only begin the "permit process" two months BEFORE shooting and was unable to give me a price quote for their shooting permit. That's one of the biggest F-You's I've ever heard of, because if Roosevelt Island is my setting and I finalize the script, come two months before shooting and they give me a ridiculous price quote for a permit, then guess what? I would have to rewrite the whole script and cancel everything because they couldn't tell me in advance. So I said to myself forget that, let me just go for areas within the five boroughs instead.
 
sb2012 said:
Whoa, $1400 for *four days* only?? So if I'm shooting a feature, let's say 3 weeks (I know it won't be done in 4 days that's for sure) for example, oh goodness I hate to think of the amount. Using your price quote, to get insurance for my film would probably cost me like $7000. That's nuts. Did they just tell you $1400 for four days based on what type of scenes you were shooting? Or was that straight up flat-quote pricing?
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It was $1400 for four days of insuring 200k worth of gear, and 1 million liability insurance flat rate. For a feature (say you're shooting 20 days) you will get a much better rate. I think they told me that a full week would be $1800 and the rate gets better after that. Of course this was several years ago, and in between then I was able to piggy back off my friends insurance policy for cheaper. If you just need location and liability insurance (and don't cover gear) it is significantly cheaper. But I was renting from a house that demanded insurance (I don't blame them).
 
sb2012 said:
I see everyone's points. Well, for those of you who shot in NYC *with* permits, would you happen to know how much of a fee it costs to get the $1 million insurance in order to obtain the $300 film permit? Because they don't mention on the website, they do give a list of places that offer the insurance but they don't give like a range of how much it costs to get it. If the $1 million insurance is not thousands and thousands of dollars then I'll probably just pay for it and then pay for the $300 permit.
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Check out Fractured Atlas. I get $2 million liability policy through them by Hartford. It costs me $450 a year. I get insurance certificates to location owners the same day right on the website. It prints out a pdf.
 
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