film schools

Steve Laramie

Steve Laramie

Veteran
what film schools have you guys graduated from and which ones do you think are the best? (best as in most likely to land you with a nice job as a DP)
 
I don't think you should be getting a job as a DP right out of school, but I went to the SF school of digital filmmaking. I liked it because it was only a year long program and it gives you a chance to work on a feature film that they produce with people already working in the bay area. Gives you a good taste of what it'll be like to actually work in film.

I'm sure there's plenty of threads about this though. I think anything that's hands on and allows you to actually shoot a good number of films is a program worth going to. Otherwise it's just a lot of thinking and not a lot of doing.
 
Film school doesn't land you jobs. It lands you opportunities.

I go to Ithaca. I have an extensive resume for pro shoots. My friends don't. If you network well - it's fantastic. If you don't - it doesn't help you one bit.

And I do more doing than thinking actually. I've only had two theory classes. Well three. One on the history of hollywood. One of film aesthetics. And one on the history of animation. All the rest is practical stuff.
 
I went to San Francisco Academy of Arts University and finishing up at Las Vegas Art Institute. I don't think landing a job right off the bat as a DP on a major shoot is realistic. My plan is to network and try to get in on any job relating to pre or post.
 
what do you think is more important to get into those schools (nyu ucla) experience a really nice resume letters of recommendations and reel or grades....
 
lairhair said:
what do you think is more important to get into those schools (nyu ucla) experience a really nice resume letters of recommendations and reel or grades....
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A guy I sort of know who got a full scholarship to USC film school got in because he was a national merit finalist and he wrote good essays. He said his grades were mainly B's and he didn't have any film credits.
 
well I have a decent amount of film credit but I only have about a 3.0-3.5 and I dont think Im going to do so hot on SAT's
 
lairhair said:
[...] and which ones do you think are the best? (best as in most likely to land you with a nice job as a DP)
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None.



Film School isn't about landing you a job. It builds a porfolio and helps you make connections, gives you access to facilities and equipment, but that's about it. If you have a good reel/portfolio, they don't give a flying rats ass if you learned to handle the camera by filming with your moms super 8 camera and reading a few books, or if you went to the top film school.

However I'm learning at Concordia University. Currently it's pretty good, a bunch of theory that 90% of it I don't see any use for, but the production classes are pretty good. I've heard it's a top Canadian and North American School for film and communications (which I'm in). But hey, have no comparison.
 
I go to Art Institute of California, but like everyone above has said, no school will land you jobs in this field, ESPECIALLY in the film industry.

Unfortunately, you must do a great deal of free work to develop your reputation and start climbing the ladder.

If you are serious about becoming a DP, you really need to learn everything about lighting, optics, and camera operation. A Film school will help you learn, but keep in mind, your competing with a lot of people who are more or less dedicated than you. Be the most dedicated, volunteer, and NETWORK. You remember how we grew up hearing our parents tell us how important it is to go to college and get a good degree, because nobody gets a job without a degree? A degree really doesn't mean anything in this field, unless maybe a basic post production job that requires a certain degree, but for cinematography, get your experience.

If you move to the LA area, go to Mole Richardson Studio Depot and talk to Larry Parker. Show him that you are interested in learning everything there is about lighting. He teaches free lighting courses every week. This is Mole Richardson's grandson and currently the owner of Studio Depot. Volunteer for him and he can get you small gaffing/gripping jobs here and there.
 
So which school will teach you feature filmmaking by actually making features and building courses around that?

Some of these places will charge over $80k per student. So a class of 20 students brings in a gross revenue of 1.6 million.

Tell me that 1.6 million isn't enough for a teaching place with all the gear and actual expertise couldn't possibly make a feature for that amount?

If a school really has the teaching talent, then they could easily mentor people like the old hollywood system while the supposed "expert instructors" show everyone how its done for real, including marketing and distribution!

Wouldn't having your first film credit on an actual released feature be stronger that some crappy short student film? If they can't make features themselves why would you spend good money to learn from such a place?
 
Its not about learning its about impressing employers and getting conections. I guess I should refraise my question to... If you want to be the next Roger Deakons what film school would be the best bet for you.
 
Where you graduate from means nothing.

Honestly - most people I've worked with don't hire film students because they tend to have immense egos. No schooling will teach you how to be a cinematographer. No film school will tell you how to actually be good at what you are doing. It gives you the background on film production - but doesn't get you any good at it.
 
Its not about learning its about impressing employers and getting connections. I guess I should refraise my question to... If you want to be the next Roger Deakons what film school would be the best bet for you.
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First you could stop spelling his name wrong...lol Roger Deakins.

Second, your talent will impress employers. Many industry people like their alma mater, and some might even be biased towards hiring along those lines, but ONLY if that person is highly qualified. Wherever you go, you need to work hard, play nice, and make connections. If I were you, I would base my pick on the students and equipment. Find the best equipment, and then make sure those you work with will be talented. If you have these two elements, your personal ambition will take you a long way.

The "classic" film schools are goodies, but I am afraid the day of their monopoly on being the only good film schools is over. These NY and CA schools are only still on top because they pull in local industry people to teach or lecture. These days one can log online and read interviews, watch lectures, and other materials which makes learning an advantage towards those in the past.

When I was looking at film schools I wanted to go to USC so badly. I had a 3.5 gpa, good SAT, ACT scores (top 95% in some sections), was Student Council President (also taught at workshops for fellow students across the state about leadership skills), member of National Honors Society, competed in two varsity sports, and was taking Advanced placement classes for college credit in highschool.

I had my own three chip ccd camera and a demo reel which was very good at the time. I had even won thrid prize in a C-SPAN documentary contest and had been aired multiple times on national television.

USC told me they didn't want to even see my reel.... They said they wanted to give everyone 'an equal chance'. Basically they told me my reel would have an advantage over inner city kids who could not afford a camera or editing software. They would rather take a blind chance on a disney movie story of rags to riches over an obviously 'on his way' film maker from highschool. (p.s. I'm not super wealthy, it was the panasonic AG-DVC10, the inferior equivalent of the XL-1 at the time. A nice camera but kind of like owning a HV20 right now.)

Needless to say I didn't get in.

I ended up going to a non-"top school" but really worked hard, taught myself everything I could, and took advantage learning from the professors who weren't full of it, and who knew their stuff. In the end, I made good contacts and had a pretty good reel. Sure I didn't meet the next PT Anderson at my school, but I'm here in LA and there is no limit to where I can go as long as I continue to try hard, keep learning, and meet people. While I was there the schools reputation has sky rocketed, and although not competing with USC, NYU, etc, it has been climbing the ranks at aggressive speeds.

Don't ask yourself how to become Roger Deakins. He was invented in a laboratory in England to be a cinematography machine. He's not even human! Plus look at Conrad Hall. In college he failed a class, didn't want to retake it so he changed his major. Out of sheer lazyness he went down the list of majors alphabetically and chose "Cinema", an early choice only in the C's. He also didn't necessarily want to be a cameraman and just happened to choose the job out of a hat, when he and his friends were picking roles for a film.

As you see, some of the greats ended up DP's by chance and luck, some had silver spoons, while others worked hard to climb the ladder.

My best advice: Learn everything you can. Knowledge will make you indispensable, talent will make you desirable. Combine the two and you'll be a great.
 
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Honestly...

slim. Many people need to work their way up from the bottom. While DoP might be your ultimate goal. How will you get there?

Very few people get picked up on large budget (AKA. better than 250 a day). The indie film world largely doesn't pay and doesn't pay well. Higher productions won't even look at you till you have some real credit.

And the films on your reel don't exactly count as real films in the eyes of UPMs and Producers. So while you might have shot something. So did everyone on this site. I work freelance when it comes up. Maybe 4 - 5 times a year. Can't make a living doing it. And that is for Assistant direction. Which is a niche market in and of itself.

There are thousands upon thousands of people claiming to be a DoP. The film industry is one of the most saturated markets in the world. To make it anywhere you will need to basically start off at the bottom and work up. Or team up with an award winning feature if you are lucky enough to get on a film that does decently.

The film market is hard. It really is. And even if you are working. You can just about scrape by until you hit the upper echelons.
 
A lot of people will do many years as a loader and don't even come close to a camera until they move up the ladder. And usually these people have come out of a technical school or university program. It takes many years of dedication and hard work to even be considered to becoming a DP in hollywood. Now if you can learning everything a gaffer knows as well as specializing in doing certain camera work ( IE Underwater, Steadycam, or high action shots then you will be more desireable for employment. If you live in LA then you might pick some heads over at the Local 600 office on what they have to offer. Don't be surprised that they may look down on you but remember everyone starts from the beginning.
 
I know the typical way to become a Hollywood DP is to start low and work for many years until you become a DP if you're good. Isn't there the other option though, where you start out as a DP and as your films get better you get higher paying jobs on better shoots?
 
Well there is always other ways..and I'm not saying it can't be done that way...but where jobs for DP is scarce...maybe doing a lot of networking with gifted future directors will get your first DP job ahead of the game.
 
Drew Ott said:
I know the typical way to become a Hollywood DP is to start low and work for many years until you become a DP if you're good. Isn't there the other option though, where you start out as a DP and as your films get better you get higher paying jobs on better shoots?
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There's more than one way to skin a cat, but having a good looking reel will typically only take you so far if no one has ever heard of you before. Trust is probably the most important asset you have and if people haven't worked w/you it's hard for them to trust you. Can they trust you to do a good job working w/in the budget and schedule? Can they trust you not to be a PITA? Can they trust you to fit in well w/the rest of the team? This is why working your way up from the bottom is so common. You spend years building working relationships w/people in every aspect the process from directors to rental houses.

I don't know how it is for DPs, but for experienced editors just switching to different types of work can be very difficult. For example, it can be hard for feature editors to get documentary work and vice-versa. There are so many people in LA that you can always find a 'specialist' so why risk the dough on someone who's not experienced in the genre you are working in? I also know guys who were editors in other markets that moved to LA and had to take jobs as AE's until they built up their LA connections.


-A
 
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