Field Dominance? 24p? 1080i? Compressor? I want to kill these terms.

M

machardi

Well-known member
Do you want to know how insanity works?

If those terms had pulses, I would be on death row, and I would plead guilty with a smile. "Does the defendant have any closing words?" ("I regret that I could only kill them once.") The jury gasps. Somewhere an old woman cries 'YOU MONSTER!'.

I have footage that I captured using my HVX200, set to 24P. The ultimate destination of this footage is trifold: the internet (via flash/qt), DVDs (HD&SD), and television broadcast.

When I import into FCP, I use "remove automatic pulldown" because it seems like the sort of thing I should do. The settings of said files then read like this:

Frame Size: 1280x1080
Vid Rate: 29.97
DVCPro HD 1080i60
Pixel Aspect: HD (1280x1080)
Field Dominance: Upper(Odd)

I then edit these in a matching timeline, and everything looks great, of course, because I am wonderful.

The next twenty minutes make me want to throw my computer, my HVX, and then myself out of the window. Given that I am on the first floor this would be less terminal and more humiliating than I would like, as invariably I would land on my HVX and just injure myself.

I choose to output this using Compressor. I have spent the length of four bibles reading various things about using Compressor to output video for various formats, and am thoroughly convinced that I might as well have been reading Penthouse Forum, for all the good that it's done me.

I export 16:9, I export 4:3. I export DVD best quality. I export HD (and create a suitable HD DVDSP project). I increase the bitrate. I try Automatic Field Dominance. I try Progressive. I cry.

No matter what, when I put the resulting DVD in my Powerbook, it looks off in any number of ways. Either there are slight interface jaggies, or maybe it's just "soft" or maybe its pixely. I seem to have purchased a Porsche, but have not the ability to shift out of first gear.

How in the WORLD do I take this footage and export it, and burn it onto a DVD so it doesn't look like Monet sketched it? I've scoured the forums, I've mixed-and-matched, and my complimentary copy of Barry's HVX DVD has yet to arrive.

Have mercy on my soul, and my footage,

Phil
 
Shooting 24P versus 24PN will result in interlaced footage to comply with NTSC standards. So that is why you have 29.97 instead of 24. You should have used 24PA which results in progressive frames.
There is no "Remove Automatic Pulldown" You mean remove Advanced Pulldown. This is where you system may be messing up. You can't remove advanced pulldown in a clip that doesn't have any.
 
Have you tried exporting uncompressed and then pulling it into compressor? Normally I do that and then open compressor and drag it in, but I like it to have a complete, self-enclosed file before I begin compressing.

Other than that, I think it's just options. If it looks good exported as an uncompressed file, then it'll all be in compressor. But if you're outputting right into compressor, there could be an issue along the way.
 
I don't use compressor, but i do use final cut. when i export for dvd, the resulting movie looks pretty bad. Everything is pixelated, and the fonts look like absolute crap. But when i stick that into dvd pro and turn into a dvd, the resuting movie comes out perfect> I think Bgubdu knows what he is talking about, but just in case, make sure to test your dvd on a tv, because i hear that sometimes what looks bad on your computer will look great on a tv and vice-versa.
 
dogcat said:
I don't use compressor, but i do use final cut. when i export for dvd, the resulting movie looks pretty bad. Everything is pixelated, and the fonts look like absolute crap. But when i stick that into dvd pro and turn into a dvd, the resuting movie comes out perfect> I think Bgubdu knows what he is talking about, but just in case, make sure to test your dvd on a tv, because i hear that sometimes what looks bad on your computer will look great on a tv and vice-versa.
Click to expand...
When you put a self contained quicktime file into the DVSP timeline, it uses Compressor, at least it does in DVDSP3. (you can also change the bit rate ect in preferences)
 
bgundu said:
Shooting 24P versus 24PN will result in interlaced footage to comply with NTSC standards. So that is why you have 29.97 instead of 24. You should have used 24PA which results in progressive frames.
There is no "Remove Automatic Pulldown" You mean remove Advanced Pulldown. This is where you system may be messing up. You can't remove advanced pulldown in a clip that doesn't have any.
Click to expand...

Okay, I will try it sans remove advanced pull down, man that makes me wish I hadn't formatted that drive after importing those P2 clips (cough cough).
 
mrWr0ng said:
Have you tried exporting uncompressed and then pulling it into compressor? Normally I do that and then open compressor and drag it in, but I like it to have a complete, self-enclosed file before I begin compressing.

Other than that, I think it's just options. If it looks good exported as an uncompressed file, then it'll all be in compressor. But if you're outputting right into compressor, there could be an issue along the way.
Click to expand...

No, I haven't tried that particular workflow. It looks good in FCP, in the timeline. The .MOV files look fine, in Quicktime. It's when I get around compressor that things get flaky. And yes, I suspect it is the options. Any suggestions on what the options should be?
 
dogcat said:
I don't use compressor, but i do use final cut. when i export for dvd, the resulting movie looks pretty bad. Everything is pixelated, and the fonts look like absolute crap. But when i stick that into dvd pro and turn into a dvd, the resuting movie comes out perfect> I think Bgubdu knows what he is talking about, but just in case, make sure to test your dvd on a tv, because i hear that sometimes what looks bad on your computer will look great on a tv and vice-versa.
Click to expand...

Okay, I have been testing my DVD on my laptop and iMac, via DVD Player, will this yield the same quality boost, or does it literally have to be a TV?

(Thanks everyone for all the replies, so far)
 
machardi said:
Okay, I have been testing my DVD on my laptop and iMac, via DVD Player, will this yield the same quality boost, or does it literally have to be a TV?

(Thanks everyone for all the replies, so far)
Click to expand...
You should watch it on a TV via a DVD player to see what it really looks like. I find that when I watch DVD's on my computer (almost never) it never looks anywhere near as good as watching them on TV via DVD player.
 
You need to remove the pulldown applied when you recorded. This is not advanced pulldown, just the normal 2:3:2:3 cadence. You can do it by selecting your captured footage and choosing Tools>Cinema Tools Reverse Pulldown. That should leave you with 24p files. Once the files are progessive in FCP, you don't need to worry about fields, dominance, etc, since there are no fields in progressive footage.
 
doccutter said:
You need to remove the pulldown applied when you recorded. This is not advanced pulldown, just the normal 2:3:2:3 cadence. You can do it by selecting your captured footage and choosing Tools>Cinema Tools Reverse Pulldown. That should leave you with 24p files. Once the files are progessive in FCP, you don't need to worry about fields, dominance, etc, since there are no fields in progressive footage.
Click to expand...

Whoa. How come I've never ever heard of this? I didn't have a Cinema Tools Reverse Pulldown, but I do have Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine. And I did that, and it changed my footage from 29.97 to 24p.

Thank you so so so much. I know I will find out by checking, but will this make my output files look better?

Thank you.
 
machardi said:
Whoa. How come I've never ever heard of this? I didn't have a Cinema Tools Reverse Pulldown, but I do have Cinema Tools Reverse Telecine. And I did that, and it changed my footage from 29.97 to 24p.

Thank you so so so much. I know I will find out by checking, but will this make my output files look better?

Thank you.
Click to expand...

Similarly, do I have to do this WHENEVER I shoot with an HVX? I thought it was just "24p" by default, using P5? Or did I do something wrong, to make this footage show up as 29.97?

Thanks!
 
You should shoot 24pA (like F6), not 24p, and then you can use the "remove advanced pulldown" to get beautiful, pure 24p footage.
 
another format q

another format q

bgundu said:
Shooting 24P versus 24PN will result in interlaced footage to comply with NTSC standards. So that is why you have 29.97 instead of 24. You should have used 24PA which results in progressive frames.
There is no "Remove Automatic Pulldown" You mean remove Advanced Pulldown. This is where you system may be messing up. You can't remove advanced pulldown in a clip that doesn't have any.
Click to expand...

Hi there,

Have a question for you. I am a bit of a newbie as well


The HVX200 is set to 1080i/24p

When I import my clips into p2log it says in the stat information that
the frame rate is 59.94i which someone had previously explained to me that it's still 24fps but that's 24fps in a 59.94i basket so to speak.

When I then view it in P2 Log and on the bottom of the P2 Log screen in the right hand corner it says: Video Format: DVCPRO HD 1080i60, 29.97 FPS. Now that's making me nervous. What's going on, am I shooting in 24p or what? Is P2 Log
converting the frame rate for viewing?

I've done a test clip in 24P in f6 and 24pa on F5 and F6 and get the same results when I import into P2 Log (DVCPRO HD 1080i60, 29.97 FPS). All I know is that I got to deliver in 1080i/24fps and uncompressed.

Please help---in the thick of it. Thanks
 
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