F55: F5 vs F55 (as of 2017)

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wsquar3d

Member
I'm a bit lost. As I research these two cameras I find it difficult to understand the differences as of today. Most threads are from 3 or 4 years ago. Please include info of internal recording (codecs, color, etc.) as well as with the raw recorders.

Thanks
 
I don't think a lot has changed in the last few years, in regards to differences in the two models. The biggest recent differences are really frame rates with the new R7 RAW recorder-120fps @ 4K RAW & X-OCN 4K. The 5 tops out at 60fps. Of course there is still the global shutter, which to me, is the biggest and most important difference and the main reason I went with the 55 over the 5.
 
In 2017, over the F5 the F55 "OUT OF THE BOX" has: 4K & QFHD internal recording, recording XAVC in 4K and HD simultaneously to same SXS card, outputting 4K via 3G-SDI or HDMI, wider color gamut, ITU-R BT.2020 color space in Custom mode, global shutter, higher frame rates in full 4K, silver ring mount.

With $1000 paid update, you can have these on the F5:

Enable XAVC 4K & QFHD Internal Recording
Record XAVC 4K & HD to Single SxS Pro+
Output via 3G-SDI or HDMI

With $12,000 paid update (last I checked price) you can turn your F5 into an F55 (sensor and all functions of the F55).
 
Thank you both. Definitely can understand the perks of a global shutter in many situations.

I think I was primarily confused because
With $1000 paid update...
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puts them quite close. So the F5 (with the software upgrade) and the F55 are identical other than wider color gamut, ITU-R BT.2020 color space, global shutter, 4k frame rates and mount ring color?

Has anyone shot with both at their highest resolutions in 24/25 practical circumstances and colored the images? How did you find the wider color gamut serving the work? For the $12k difference, I have trouble imagining how much that wider color gamut is giving. BUT I'm not a colorist by any means.
 
Yes, with the paid update there is really not a lot of difference between the two. I've intercut F55 with the FS7 (and colored them) and you're going to be hard pressed to know which is which. Even though the F55 has "more color" since most people's displays are limited (sure that's slowly changing but...) you are not going to really see it.

The downside to the F55, is the ISO is lower then the F5 by almost a stop. At times I wish my f55 was 2000 ISO natively but not a huge deal depending what you shoot.

$12K is a huge difference no doubt. I'd say you're not going to be missing anything major. Save your money, also if you don't need SR codec (limited to HD anyway) and full 16-bit RAW then consider the FS7. Save even more money.
 
starcentral said:
Yes, with the paid update there is really not a lot of difference between the two.
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I based my reply on most people(that I know) having done the paid update to allow 4K internal recording, which really closes the gap between the two models.

Sony really did a good job with this line. They started out a little lacking(from a user standpoint), but by the time they released the v7 firmware, they had transformed them into great cameras.
 
The global shutter, wider gamut and 4k @ 120fps are the big draws for the F55. Certainly if you're shooting super-saturated colours from neon or RGB LEDs, the wider gamut of the F55 really comes into its own (where the F5 can run into some weird colour clipping and artefacts).

If you're not shooting rock concerts or more carefully posted work like narrative or commercials, I think the F5 is more than sufficient. For the more visually demanding projects though, the F55 does have a definite edge.
 
Thank you all for your help.

Grug said:
The global shutter, wider gamut and 4k @ 120fps are the big draws for the F55. Certainly if you're shooting super-saturated colours from neon or RGB LEDs, the wider gamut of the F55 really comes into its own (where the F5 can run into some weird colour clipping and artefacts).

If you're not shooting rock concerts or more carefully posted work like narrative or commercials, I think the F5 is more than sufficient. For the more visually demanding projects though, the F55 does have a definite edge.
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Great points Grug.

It's great to have the option to upgrade from the F5 to the F55 if it becomes necessary.

Has anyone found a preference for the global shutter in non obvious (high speed sports, flashing lights, filming trains...) situations? For example, noone seems to talk about the way the global shutter image moves when the camera is on the shoulder. Does anyone have any thoughts here?
 
wsquar3d said:
Thank you all for your help.



Great points Grug.

It's great to have the option to upgrade from the F5 to the F55 if it becomes necessary.

Has anyone found a preference for the global shutter in non obvious (high speed sports, flashing lights, filming trains...) situations? For example, noone seems to talk about the way the global shutter image moves when the camera is on the shoulder. Does anyone have any thoughts here?
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Ive used the f5 (I have one) and the f55 handheld many times.. and never noticed any difference.. in theory there would be some moves that the global shutter would be an advantage.. but for me personally.. hand held.. Im either moving.. doing camera moves.. very quickly ,or slowly (following the action) to change the shot..and dont believe the GS or lack of has made any difference ..

Not 100% sure but I think the f5 is now pretty much universally sold with the 4K internal upgrade.. or at least added into the price.. :).. be crazy to buy one new now, without it being part of the deal .. for TV work the wider color dyes has no meaning IMHO.. no display can ever show them.. I think the higher ISO is a much better deal there by a long way.. end of the day the only difference is the GS now.. which for some peoples work is a big deal.. and if your shooting Raw alot.. with the R7 recorder.. the big difference in the first place was the internal 4K recording.. the F5 was basically an HD camera.. but we f5 owners all got lucky with the famous "hack" and then got 90% of a f55 for $1k up grade, you didn't even have to send the camera in for ..
 
wsquar3d said:
Has anyone found a preference for the global shutter in non obvious (high speed sports, flashing lights, filming trains...) situations? For example, noone seems to talk about the way the global shutter image moves when the camera is on the shoulder. Does anyone have any thoughts here?
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Having moved from the F5 to the F35, I definitely noticed motion advantages to the global shutter, particularly for handheld work or long lens work.

In fact, it's become such an important factor for me, that when I sold the F35 and bought my Alexa, I invested substantially more in order to get the Alexa Studio, which uses a mirror shutter for a global shutter and optical viewfinder.
 
I have to agree about the global shutter. To me the global shutter alone is worth the price. Once you have the freedom afforded by a global shutter it‘s indeed difficult to set for something else. When you think that just a very selected few belong to the exclusive global shutter club, the F55 becomes an obvious player. If I was out to buy either a F5 or F55 and could afford going for the F55, it wouldn‘t even be a question. F55.
 
Aaveum said:
I have to agree about the global shutter. To me the global shutter alone is worth the price. Once you have the freedom afforded by a global shutter it‘s indeed difficult to set for something else. When you think that just a very selected few belong to the exclusive global shutter club, the F55 becomes an obvious player. If I was out to buy either a F5 or F55 and could afford going for the F55, it wouldn‘t even be a question. F55.
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Im not saying its not a good thing.. but if you look at all the fantastic footage shot on non studio Alexa..Amira .. or F5 for that matter.. its all non GS.. esp in Alexa,s case.. from big budget feature films..to just about every high end TV series shot today.. they all look pretty good to me..
If you don't specifically need it for your type of work.. the extra cost of a f55 over an f5.. you could buy a very nice lens or two.. with refresh rates of any of these "higher" end cameras Sony f5 is same as Arri.. it usually not a problem I feel.. Amira looks good.. its not GS or even 4K..

But each to their own.. I guess the best answer is the OP should rent or go to a rental house and shoot a bit and see if he can see the difference.. then decide ..
 
^ I kind of wanted to also say the same thing. Yeah it's cool and great , etc.. but there's lots of stuff at high levels being shot without GS.

Then I also agree with Grug that yeah you probably gonna notice it more on longer focal lengths though, even if its just for narrative work versus high speed motor sports, trains, etc..

Best thing is test it for yourself, see if you notice and if you care.

Here's a test I did way back when I first got my F55. this is with a 500mm lens following traffic. Was kind of neat looking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUpa9-_Riok
 
Thanks for the varying insights. My original question comes from renting the F55 and using it in half a dozen different scenarios and beginning to prefer it over any digital cinema camera other than the Alexas. Though, as I dig into it, it seems the F5 (which I've never used) is the fully adequate cheap alternative. But - this is why it's important to consider the differences. Because they are still $12k off and being touted as numbers 2 and 3 of the Sony Cinealta line. I'm interested if there's a subtle quality that the electronic GS brings in normal use. It's fascinating to consider the intangible (and not practical) feelings that each of these two cams brings as, for all intents and purposes, they're otherwise the same. Perhaps only someone who has used both intensively can speak to this.
 
Personally.. and I film some pop venues crazy LED shows.. I would not want a camera costing F5 money that would not work in some situations.

Id either keep it 'cheap' (Ursa FS7 C200) or get into 'the proper' club
 
If after tests you are still not sure, I agree with Sam, go big or go home. It's not like you are going to regret getting a camera with global shutter and wider color gamut.

Also are you up on HDR standards? As that may influence your decision.

Despite the FS5 offering HLG and the ability to record REC2020 in effort to meet the new Rec2100 standard for HDR television, it can't record anything past REC709 color... but the F55 can and HLG can easily be converted to from slog gamma.
 
Run&Gun;1986717895) frame rates with the new R7 RAW recorder-120fps @ 4K RAW & X-OCN 4K. The 5 tops out at 60fps. [/QUOTE said:
Been wondering recently if that could be hacked too - I always assumed that it was a hardware limitation in the F5 that meant it couldn't go to 120fps, but didn't they say that about internal 4k and got found out? Quite obviously the serious hardware is in the R7.
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A component parts list could at least confirm if the internal boards are different between the F5 and F55. Then there is programming/firmware which I suspect poses any limits on the F5 regarding frame rate, etc. The 4K all file hack was a simple loop hole and surely if anything similar exists on the F5 by v9 it has been closed up.

Right now is a great time to buy a used F55. I've seen them as low as $12k USD on eBay as many F55 owners sell off their cameras moving over to the new Venice. It's created a bit of a buyers market right now, something to consider if you want what is really a great swiss army knife camera with features & specs that still rival many camera's on the market today. Personally I think the people ditching the F55 for Venice are making a huge mistake and will be disappointed when it is not a full camera until 2019 and beyond.

F55 big pluses TODAY:

120fps full 4K no binning & no crop with R7
Full REC2020
Global shutter

For skin-tone aficionados its a bit of a thing of the past. ACES or color space transform options really strip Sony away from its native looks. sgamut3.cine will be 5 years old this December and most people are now comfortable and use to it,. in fact some people are asking for slog3/sgamut3.cine so its a good sign.
 
starcentral said:
Personally I think the people ditching the F55 for Venice are making a huge mistake and will be disappointed when it is not a full camera until 2019 and beyond.
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I agree completely. I smell the F65 debacle for owner/operators shaping up all over again. I won't say that I won't own a Venice some day, but right now, I have absoultely zero interest in giving up my F55/R7 any time soon.

BTW, if anyone is interested in a good deal on an R5 and a couple of AXS cards, please send me a PM. If you've got an F55 or F5 and don't have a RAW recorder you are missing out on the best part of your camera.
 
starcentral said:
Right now is a great time to buy a used F55. I've seen them as low as $12k USD on eBay as many F55 owners sell off their cameras moving over to the new Venice...Personally I think the people ditching the F55 for Venice are making a huge mistake and will be disappointed when it is not a full camera until 2019 and beyond.
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Do you really think F55 owners are selling for Venice? They are totally different cameras. The Venice is a high end cinema camera. The F55 is a broadcast camera. The Venice won't do what the F55 does. It's ISO 500 for starters. I can see F65 owners selling for Venice as that makes sense since the Venice replaces it. But the F55 is made for a different thing. So yes F55 owners will probably be disappointed. Unless what they always wanted was a cinema camera and didn't want the F65 because of the weight, and were making due with the F55 till now. Otherwise Venice is like Alexa. F55 is like Amira. Different purposes.
 
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