F35 Beginners: The F35 and Lenses

JMtheDP

Veteran
Hi all

I'm not going to be an F35 owner for much longer, but I thought I would post a thought which will be of interest to most people. Perhaps obvious, perhaps not.

The F35, as we know, only takes PL mount lenses (I know some of us have modified theirs to take Nikon mount, this is equally as valid to them).

PL mount lenses are a curious beast. They are generally hideously expensive (thank RED owner-ops for that) and vary massively in speed, size, range, cost, mechanics and optical quality.

It is easy to see the F35 as a "1080P" camera. Whilst this is technically true, you must remember that 1080P is derived from a 6K (or near as damnit) sensor. The sensor resolution is HIGHER than an F55, for example.

Because of this, you must use lenses which are up to scratch! Many people testing their F35s for the first time can be disappointed in the image they get. This is often because the first place you turn it on is in your front room, at night, with the first lens you could get your hand on. You'll be wide open and, possibly, under-exposed. I am guilty of this.

My first feature I shot with the F35 was on the RED 18-50 lens, because it was the cheapest PL mount lens I could find. Some shots looked razor sharp, others were noticeably soft. I eventually realised the lens I had was soft wide open and only looked sharp at T4.0/T5.6. This is the case with many lenses. My standard speeds are a little soft around the edges at T2.1, but very sharp at T2.8 and excellent at T4.0. This is kinda nice, because it gives me options, but you have to realise what is happening!

People using stills lenses, or converted stills lenses, will find this more than others. A Zeiss Master prime, for example, is going to look extremely sharp at T1.3. A Zeiss Super Speed does not, and it is milky to boot.

You have to remember that the camera is always able to resolve the same amount of detail - even when shooting a scene which is saturated with a particular colour (the benefit of a true 4:4:4 sensor).

Perhaps on here, people could list the lenses they are using, have used, and their general thoughts?

I have just purchased a set of Luma Tech Illumina S35s and am very interested in seeing them in action - they seem like a modern-day super speed and look like they outperform the old lenses by a fair bit.

James
 
My day to day lenses are a set of Arri Ultra Primes (available for rent guys!). The whole set opens to T1.9, and are generally sharp wide open, although the best performance will be around T4 to T5.6.

I also own a S16 set of Zeiss Superspeeds, but they don't cover S35, so I don't use them with the F35.

I've used the Illumina S35 lenses on the PMW-F3. They perform excellently, but the Mk I series had many mechanical complaints, and I chose not to buy because they don't have the track record and brand recognition that Arri and Zeiss do, despite the price difference.
 
Hi Viddo

I've only used ultras once myself and had no complaints - but I know many people don't like them because they can see them as "over-clinical". One thing I will be investing in heavily with the f65 is some nice filters - I am really looking forward to being able to filter again (my F35 I rarely did because I needed the space for NDs).

The Illuminas I bought are the MK2s, so hopefully much improved. They cost me the same as one master prime for a whole set, so can't complain!

James
 
Hi Viddo

I've only used ultras once myself and had no complaints - but I know many people don't like them because they can see them as "over-clinical". One thing I will be investing in heavily with the f65 is some nice filters - I am really looking forward to being able to filter again (my F35 I rarely did because I needed the space for NDs).

The Illuminas I bought are the MK2s, so hopefully much improved. They cost me the same as one master prime for a whole set, so can't complain!

James

I've heard the "over-clinical" comment about Ultra-Primes too... generally from people who can't afford to shoot with them. It just seems like the sort of slight one gives when there's nothing really to complain about.

That said, I understand that some people choose lenses that are imperfect intentionally as part of their desired visual conception, as if the lens is one of the filters or post effects, just with it done in glass.

But Ultra Primes are about the opposite approach - shoot perfect, crisp, accurate, and use filters or post to add the look. If you're the sort of person who talks about ACES or LUTs, Ultra Primes will be excellent, because they'll give you a clean and accurate picture to start your post with.

If people didn't swear by them they wouldn't cost $600 a day. And if they didn't cost $600 a day or came in an EF mount, DSLR kids might not refer to them as "over-clinical."
 
I agree - although I do like the option I'll have on the Illuminas of having T1.3 if I want an effect, but a fairly sharp, modern lens at T2 and above. I try and stay above T2.8 when I can anyway - unless for a specific effect.

I have spoken to a lot of DSLR shooters who will always say "but my £800 L series is sharp as an ultra prime and a tenth of the price" - they don't get the point of cinema lenses, and the ergonomic benefits.
 
I agree - although I do like the option I'll have on the Illuminas of having T1.3 if I want an effect, but a fairly sharp, modern lens at T2 and above. I try and stay above T2.8 when I can anyway - unless for a specific effect.

I have spoken to a lot of DSLR shooters who will always say "but my £800 L series is sharp as an ultra prime and a tenth of the price" - they don't get the point of cinema lenses, and the ergonomic benefits.

Simply so. Ultra Prime lenses in the standard focal lengths have the following attributes:
- All T1.9
- All 95mm fronts
- All approximately the same weight
- All approximately the same length
- No telescoping
- No barrel rotation on the front of the lenses
- Long throws
- Accurate marks for iris and focus
- Iris and focus gearing in the same place
- Minimal breathing


These behaviors are difficult and expensive to engineer all in the same lens, and across so many focal lengths. But practically speaking, it means an easier faster experience on set. Less rebalancing after lens changes, quicker mattebox and follow focus setup and such... but such distinctions are easily lost on the kids just starting out on DSLRs.

And yes - under ideal circumstances, a Canon EF lens may perform admirally against an UltraPrime, but it's when you're working in adverse conditions that the optics and ergonomics of the UltraPrimes and other true cinema glass show their true purpose for being.
 
I have PM'd david already about this lens, but just to repeat on here in case anyone finds this - I wouldn't try the above lens on the F35. It looks way over 31.5mm to me
 
I did wonder if it was a 16mm lens, as 10mm is a more normal focal length for that format, but 2.8 is very slow for a 16 lens.
 
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