EX1 Timecode sync

A

andrechesini

Member
Hi,

I am going to shoot a documentary with 2 Sony EX1 and we are considering sync the timecode of both camera through the remote control function. Seting both in free run/user preset.

My question is how long I can trust in the sync of the tc in both cameras. In the EX3 with jam syncing looks like we have to re-do the operation about every hour. Looks like could have a one second of discrepancy. Do I have the same problem?
Is there someway of check the battery of the internal clock?

Thanks a lot!
 
In my tests checking TC stability I found that EX3 as well as the EX1 models are very steady and run for hours without missing a frame! I've checked 4 different cameras on that before we started our shoot. Just make sure that you do not use the internal clock! That'd be a disaster ;-)

We ended up with 40 EX3 cams jam synced with 744Ts and we had 40 EX1 synced by 'count down' without getting problems as long as it was done right.

We repeated the procedure out of habit every 2 hours - it's a quick procedure. Editing dept. is happy.

Karl
 
:) -- Today's electronics used in cameras are very accurate. They run on clocks (more than one.) Generally, unless you get a bad crystal, the speed of the video should be very constant. The timing is done by the use of a phase-loop servo that runs the tape drive based on a set crystal frequency. Since there is no tape drive in the EX-x series, the timeing of the video should be even more accurate and "drift" should be almost non-exhistant. The best way to "sync" two or more cameras up, is by the old fashoned "Clap-board." used in film for years. If you don't have one, use your hands. A flash or strobe light is another way -- as with weddings. Check the video every 30 min. or so by frame to see if there is visable drift after magnifing it in the edit time-line, then recorrect the sync. Easy to do once you know how! - Carl
 
Thanks a lot, this will make me feel more secure.

We will clap board every take made by the 2 camera to ensrure that this will be synced in post.

Could you give a step by step process. I want avoid make mistakes. How is the process to sync the tc of 2 EX1, this is the first time I have been using timecode syncronization and I had few real tests on that.

:dankk2:
 
andrechesini said:
Thanks a lot, this will make me feel more secure.

We will clap board every take made by the 2 camera to ensrure that this will be synced in post.

Could you give a step by step process. I want avoid make mistakes. How is the process to sync the tc of 2 EX1, this is the first time I have been using timecode syncronization and I had few real tests on that.

:dankk2:
Click to expand...


If it is just a dumb slate, free run, get slate in the frame of all cameras, hit rec, then clap and make sure you are getting sound.
 
speaking as an editor, timecode jam sync is okay as long as you resync every break (i.e. at least twice a day, three or four times is better).

Karl said it, it doesn't take long to do once you're int he habit and even the most expensive of cameras with the built in sync facility tend to drift after awhile.

I'm looking at exactly that right now, nine F900s on a network TV show, cut into a multicam - and two of them are drifting. Not a lot, just a frame or two an hour, but at the end of the (typically 16 hour) day...

And the other camera that took off to follow someone then ran out of battery and had to power down, then up again...
etc.

Yes, a slate is good if you can get it (did you realize I'm cutting reality TV yet?) but if there's hard sync points (a person claps, a car door clams shut, etc) then it's relatively easy to re-find the sync and slide the shots back into place.

However, it is a hassle and it does require a trained post person to do it quickly and accurately every time.

And it does take a little time.

Each group of shots.

Meaning, each time a cameraperson decides to stop rolling, and then start rolling again, sync has to be found again.


So yes, I'm tempted to tell you about the 19 camera shoot we had last year where we had 5 pro cameras and 14 DVXs in the hands of PAs, shooting all at the same time (mostly each other) and starting and stopping at will.

That was last summer and I think the lead AE is still syncing the groups up...

(hint - use a director, who says "roll camera... slate... action" then "cut" and have all your camera people do what the director says - roll when the call comes to roll, and cut when the call comes to cut. Post will thank you for that. And your producer/finance person will thank you too.)

The easiest way: have an assistant stand in the middle of the action area, where all the cameras can see him/her. Call the camera roll, wait until all cameras have replied "A camera - speed" "B camera - speed" etc, then have the assistant clap his/her hands, then leave frame and then settle, and start the action.

You could get fancy with slates and numbers, but if your cameras have been rough synched that day then their timecodes will roughly be the same and the sync clap will take care of the fine tuning.
 
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In the editing software you can find the "clap" sound points by looking at the sound timeline... just look out for the straight bars, for ex:

.,.,..|.,.,..,.,

Another tip: have the board in frame BEFORE the cameras start rolling, this will help if you use a take identifying program (the first frame of the take will always be the board, easy reference).

Boards are useful for multi-camera shooting :)
 
internal clock in ex 1

internal clock in ex 1

hello keenast,

i filmed yesterday with an ex1 (single camera shot) which i am quite used to. and for the first i choose the option clock for time code. ( i usually work free run, 25p, tc preset clocklike, but not the internal clock...
!
the xdcam browser sees a lot of time code breaks. i don't find them neither see them on image or tc counter.
i went to a friend editor who export the files on avid and played the clips. no tc breaks have been seen, but a problem: tc shifted and was different than on the xdcam browser...

just googled ex1 and clock and find your post: internal clock will be a disaster...

what disaster did i make?


thanks.

bella

keenast said:
In my tests checking TC stability I found that EX3 as well as the EX1 models are very steady and run for hours without missing a frame! I've checked 4 different cameras on that before we started our shoot. Just make sure that you do not use the internal clock! That'd be a disaster ;-)

We ended up with 40 EX3 cams jam synced with 744Ts and we had 40 EX1 synced by 'count down' without getting problems as long as it was done right.

We repeated the procedure out of habit every 2 hours - it's a quick procedure. Editing dept. is happy.

Karl
Click to expand...
 
wow. so after reading all these threads i understand that its extremely important to use a slate on a muliti-cam shoots. i'm still not clear on how to set the timecode on the EX1. please explain slowly, step by step.

thanks.
 
keenast said:
In my tests checking TC stability I found that EX3 as well as the EX1 models are very steady and run for hours without missing a frame! I've checked 4 different cameras on that before we started our shoot. Just make sure that you do not use the internal clock! That'd be a disaster ;-)

We ended up with 40 EX3 cams jam synced with 744Ts and we had 40 EX1 synced by 'count down' without getting problems as long as it was done right.

We repeated the procedure out of habit every 2 hours - it's a quick procedure. Editing dept. is happy.

Karl
Click to expand...

Hello Karl,

You make mention of syncing EX1s with EX3s and 744Ts and that you use a 'count down' method.

Which you be able to explain a bit more about this method. Without TC facilities on the EX1 I do not see how it can be sync'd with other cameras.

Thanks,
David.
 
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