Dvx film school

Re: Dvx film school

You bring up a good point -- there aren't any meaningful standards of admission to these private institutions. Anyone can get in if they have the money. It's a problem. I didn't go to VFS but I've heard on more than a few occasions that students coming out of that place are, for the most part, not satisfied with the experience.

Anyone thinking about going to an expensive program should carefully consider what they're getting into. It's a good idea to go to the school and try to get a hold of graduate statistics. How many found jobs, how much do they earn, are they satisfied, etc. The more ambiguous the stats, the more I am suspicious of the school. For example, if 80% of grads find work in a related-field within a year, it's important to know what constitutes a "related-field" according to the school. Is working for minimum wage as a video store clerk or a production company receptionist considered an industry job?

As a question of value, yes, BCIT FilmFLEX at least provides you with gear that has some actual worth. Whether every students really needs their own camera is a worthwhile question. As for that horrendous demo video, well, it speaks for itself.
 
Re: Dvx film school

Regardless of where you attend, if you don't utilize the full resources the program has to offer (studio time, equipment, professors etc) and work hard at what your doing - then any school is pointless - no matter how much you've spent.
You can't put a price on experience, the more time you spend debating instead of out in the field practicing will show in the final product.

Just something to think about...
 
Re: Dvx film school

Has anyone looked at film connection (http://www.filmconnection.com)?

I hesitated for a long time before calling them up. Their own istruction materials are not that great (lots of spelling and grammatical errors, and info that you can find on the web for free), but you also get the ASC manual, and a few other valuable books. The 'tuition' is about 6K (USD), half of which goes to a production company they hook you up with. You don't get a diploma nor a certificate.

It's a bit of a lottery - you may not end up with the greatest production co. if you aren't lucky. The upshot is that if you do get lucky, you get to go on actual film shoots very soon (for me it was three weeks after I started the program), and if your producer is good (as mine is), you'll learn about budgeting, the whole pre-prod-post cycle, marketing, etc. If you want to make films, you'll learn a lot just by being an observant P.A. or a camera trainee (also called 3rd AC). You can start building a network of crew members, and go from there.

Over past year, I've had a few questions about the value I got from these guys, but I lost them quickly by doing a reality check. Going to school full time was out of question (I am a sole provider for a family of four). This arrangement allows me to go on shoots on weekends and an odd day off, and my daughter has one more thing to brag about (her dad doing film and stuff) ;D.

But the most importantly, I met some fantastic people on shoots, people who love making films, and, rather than talk about it (or finding excuses why they don't), they DO IT!

Jerry
 
Re: Dvx film school

Making comparisons to lawyers and doctors education is like comparing apples and kangaroos. Film production is art. How do you teach art? The quick answer is you don't!

You can not beat education, it excelerates the learning experience. BCIT is an accredited technology institution and has a world renown reputation for producing knowledgable grads.

It seems to me that the Filmflex course is offering the best tools and then giving you instruction and real life experience using them. The rest is up to you!
 
Re: Dvx film school

Who's making comparisons to doctors and lawyers? No kidding it's apples and kangaroos. I made a point of saying that it's a mistake to go to film school thinking you'll come out with a professional credential. This is an issue, especially in places like Toronto and Vancouver, where all these institutions are marketing to high school kids that their very costly film programs are the way to break into the industry.

BCIT is a reputable place, for sure. But FilmFLEX has to prove itself. Honestly, you can't look at that demo video and think good things.
 
Re: Dvx film school

You CAN beat education - ever heard of Leonardo da Vinci?

I am not going to use any names, but I know at least one private college in Toronto that charges about 21,000 for their film program. They also have an 'Entertainment Business Management' program of a very poor quality, and can't even get their instructors to post the students' grades correctly and/or on time.

Yes - they target high school students with promises they can never deliver. The catch is - if a student leaves before the end of a term (or a program), they are off the hook (due to fine print in the contract). They even charge you an 'early termination penalty'.

So - if you insist on studying film in Toronto, go to Ryerson or York or Sheridan, but avoid the private colleges at all costs.

Speaking from experience of someone very close to me.

Jerry
 
Re: Dvx film school

i would appreciate it if people stopped plugging for their school when they have no credentials to show for - put together a better demo reel for petes sake then come back here - maybe then you wouldnt be getting so many negative comments
 
Re: Dvx film school

Why not just get a degree in Electrical Engineering?

Not only would you then have a much better understanding of your camera (yes even film cameras - take a few optics classes) you will have a HUGE advantage in your resume and more importantly your way of thinking.

And if you find that you can't make it in the industry or you tire of it, well, you have a nice solid base on which to fall back. You can almost always get a job with that sort of degree.

Yes, film takes knowledge of film but this can be taught to oneself - even by fora such as this! Buy a few books, go shoot some shorts, get a degree and you will much more prepared than most everyone.
 
Re: Dvx film school

Sup Shaw...my sentiments exactly! I graduated with a Computer science degree recently...o **** it was like nuts sometimes how hard the coursework - I think all the problem solving did a great deal of training for my mind that will help me down the line of making films (since making a film is after all one big mother of a problem to solve) - what do you think?
 
Re: Dvx film school

Young-H._Lee... I'm sorta in same boat as you. Got my undergrad in Computer Science 8 years ago, and recently got Master's in Industrial Engineering. I definitely think all the skills acquired in engineering training (and related job, in my case) can be useful in a number of fields (including filmaking).

Now that I've got all the engineering training out of the way, I'm planning to spend more time trying to learn the filmaking craft. I've got a 10 week sabbatical from work coming up in 2 months, and was wondering what would be the best training I could take during that time. The 24p class advertised on this board looks like a definite possibility. How about any of the online courses? Has anyone tried the 'Interactive Film School' CD series (www.interactivefilmschool.com) which cost $60? Might that be worth a try?
 
Re: Dvx film school

oh, come on, if you want to be a filmmaker you eventually will have to shoot the movie...

... i just took a camera (cheapo) asked three of my friends to be my actors...wrote a simple story in one location (Times Square NYC) and shot it in 2 hours ....

...next took it to my friend who knew FCP and told him how I wanted to put the shots together.... he did it and then...

...i asked my frinend who loves making music on his comp to make a score for my 5 minutes short... he dit it...

and ... you know the film was ... i dont want to talk about it...

but then I realized I actually have learned so much about sound, editing, cinematography etc etc in a two hours of shooting and two days of production... even thought the final effect sucked!

Wow, I realized I am on the way.
8)
You know I after a year I almost (!) finished my first feature (30 actors total) - i didnt finish it because i lost my actress (10 scenes to go) but....NOW I HAVE LEARNED SOOO MUCH :)

Anyway, and now I feel great. Even though I dont have anyting to show you.
I am almost done with another feature now. My actors will not fcuk me this time. And the crew. I am crew and the lead :)

;D
 
Re: Dvx film school

I teach college and the one thing I see is that a formal education can force one to be more disciplined, it's that simple. Many film-makers I encounter skip the tough stuff, i.e., interpreting the script with strong pre-visualization ideas that tell the story, etc... film making can be a grueling experience and cause one to question whether they want to do it again.

If you can muster up the discipline then go for it. If not, sometimes a community of other students making films and the pressure to do the dirty work will pay off in the end.

I think a person needs to do both, get the gear, use it & see what happens, & then grab some education where you can and see if it deepens your abilities. We all need to take the path we find most helpful.
 
Re: Dvx film school

ppross

just go out and try it - film school gives you the resources and the connections, but it also costs lots of money - you can achieve about the same results by just trying it out on your own (though it will be harder) - but thats where you can test how badly you want to do filmmaking in real life
 
Re: Dvx film school

Wow, $27K sounds like a lot of money to me for a two-year school, but you do get a complete suite out of it.

If I were just starting out, I think I'd buy the equipment on their list and just get out there and start doing projects. While there is something to be said in favor of a disciplined learning approach, it is really all about the student's drive and determination. And if that is the case, drive and determination outside of a formal school can result in good work too.

I started making movies about 4 years ago. My first effort really sucked. It is unwatchable. But I learned a couple things. My second movie was way better, mostly because I hooked up with a good crew and great writer/director, on the strength of my POTENTUAL from the first movie. (Let that be a lesson to anyone starting out in this business: connections and networking are a HUGE part of getting work.) My third feature length effort is watchable, but there are still a lot of problems with it. However, I am not embarrassed to put it on my resume. My next big effort will be started in the Spring, and although it is a 30 minute short, we are going to devote all our efforts to making it as cinematic as possible.

I've been doing other smaller side projects while working on features, and I learn new stuff every time. The learning will never stop. But would my work be any better in the same time frame if I had gone to flexFilm or some other school?

Hard to say. Probably, it would be *technically* better, but I think the journey I took to get where I am today was what built in the sheer passion I have now for the craft. Going to school, and tackling the subjects *they* wanted to teach, might have resulted in me not having the fire to continue working in this industry. I don't know.

Here's another thing: during work on my last feature, we picked up an intern who is going to a local film school here in Colorado. He had a strong technical background, but he just didn't have the guerilla mentality or habits that me and my crew had developed. I'm sure it was an education for him to work with us. By the way, he survived the fire of our work flow, and I'd have him again on our crew, but I certainly can't say that for some of the students I met coming from this local school.

Finally, I have to say that if you are considering a career in video or filmmaking, and you are not BURNING to do it, just don't go there. Get out of the way of those of us who obsess about it. It torqued me so much to see that girl in FILM SCHOOL who did the short with her mom, when asked what she was going to do after the series, said that it was a nice experience, but she was going to go do other stuff. Gaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh! Pissed me off so bad. I just wanted to bash that slacker's head in with a steel pipe.
 
Re: Dvx film school

I like, "The Complete Film Production Handbook" 3rd edition, by Eve Light Honthaner, Focal Press....it's a book with a CD full of forms and the book tells you how to use them using examples. I understand many Producers use this book.

If you look on the WEB there are a ton of decent FREE forms. try the WEB 1st & save.
 
Re: Dvx film school

OK PEOPLE QUIT BEING STUPID. $27,000 TO LEARN FROM A WACKO WHO CANT GET INTO THE INDUSTRY HIMSELF?

dO THIS:
bUY THE BOOK "FROM REEL TO DEAL" BY dOV sIMMONS $12
BUY "DIRECTING ACTORS" BY JUDITH WESTON $15
BUY "STORY" BY ROBERT MCKEE $20

THESE THREE BOOKS WILL TEACH U MORE THAN ANY SCHOOL THEN TAKE MAYBE 2 PRODUCTION CLASSES THAT COST MAYBE $1000 EACH. THEN WALK INTO ANY BIG FILM SCHOOL AND HANG OUT AT THE CAFETERIA AND MEET FILM STUDENTS AND TEACHERS AND ASK ANY QUESTIONS U MIGHT HAVE. YOU WILL GET HOOKED UP WITH FILM GIGS AND YOU WILL GET ALL YOUR KNOWLEDGE. TRUST ME. YOU WILL GET MORE EDUCATION THAN A KID WHO WENT TO THIS SCHOOL AND BLEW $100,000. FILM SCHOOLS ARE FULL OF WHIMPS WHO DONT KNOW HOW TO MAKE FILMS SO THEY LECTURE NONSENCE AND THEN WHAT HAPPENS. YOU COME OT 4 YEARS LATER AND HOLLYWOOD KICKS YOU IN THE ASS. bEEN THERE DONE THAT AND NOW I HATE FILM SCHOOLS. tHEY ARE JUST A BUSINESS AND WANT YOUR MONEY. ASK ANY FILM STUDENT HOW TO PREPARE A FILM. HE KNOWS FIRST HAND HOW TO PREPARE PAPERWORK BECAUSE HE HAS SCREWED UP BEFORE. ITS ALL SIMPLE PAPERWORK AND ORGANIZATION. IF YOU DO THAT THAN YOU WONT SCREW UP. FILM SCHOOLS INTIMIDATE STUDENTS AND NO ONE ENDS UP MAKING MOVIES.
 
Re: Dvx film school

Here's my problem with art schools and schools in general. Most people take them thinking they will be whatever they went for when they get out.

Hollywood will kick your ass, probe it, burn it, and put it up in a freak show for all to see. If you really do want to make films, get a camera, get on these forums, and get some books to learn some techniques. Just start shooting. There's a hell of a lot to learn, and it will take a while, but experience outweighs schooling. The hardest part is finding someone who knows to nudge you in the right direction or answer questions. This board and others go above and beyond that.

School is for the rich who aren't concerned about money, or the lazy that lack motivation and focus to teach themselves. In my opinion, many of the former suffer from the later.

My old roommate went to USC and paid stupid amounts for "guidance". They provided a camera, but production cost's, film, and developing were on the students. What the crap is the point then...what are you paying for?

If there's a workshop or course you can take for a fair price just to serve as a kickoff, then I wouldn't discourage you, but schools that are tens of thousands are feeding off the delusion that is Hollywood.

School is for careers that require them. Films are made by people who are talented and have something to say...oh and egomaniacs that are glory hounds...but then those folks usually went to film school.  :P

Just my take. No offense to film students, many of my friends are. I just know from going to a makeup effects school that charged way too much for what I learned. When I did get into the shops (all my own doing), I had to throw away everything I learned and relearn what is really going on. I was eventually informed to omit the school from my resume as many places would specifically NOT hire these kids. I know we are talking about different fileds but it's all the same mentality.

I don't have anything against people trying to teach a skill to make a living, but I despise the advertising angle that insinuates or makes blatant promises of success in an unstable and ever changing field.
 
Re: Dvx film school

[quote author=BLUESPIDER link=board=nws;num=1100333019;start=0#1 date=11/13/04 at 00:15:01]yeah, its also $27 thousand dollars to sign up. :)[/quote]

that's $27 thousand CANADIAN dollars, which are like $13.00 US dollars
;)
get it
 
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