DVCPRO HD vs HDV

O

olemgr@online.no

New member
This is my first posting at the DVX forum, and I hope someone will cast some light on my query. I am a photographer that just recently has moved to the world of video.

I am running a fairly big video project that will run for the next three years, documenting an industry production process. I will do most of the filming myself, and I have decided to buy a HVX200. (I am currently using a Panasonic DVC30)

I the capture process I will also rely on video shot by the project managers. I have agreed to buy two cameras and give necessary training. For cost saving reasons, I will not buy an additional two HVX 200 cameras. Another reason for this is that I believe that the HVX will be a too complex camera to operate for the ”amateurs”.

The question is then: What additional cameras should I buy and what format should I aim at for the final product? Obviously I have to step down in quality from the top capabilities of the HVX, or is there a way to “upgrade” HDV till DVCPRO HD or make them play together? Should I then go for the HDV format and subsequently two camcorders that support this format, or should I go for the good old DV and hope that this will hold up even three years from now?

If I go for HDV, is there still a reason to shoot DVCPRO HD with the HVX?
What camera is the best +/- $2000 camera out there? Will there be any problems editing HDV in Final Cut Pro?

A lot of question revealing the confusing state I am in right now.
 
You've got a lot going on here, so we might be going back-and-forth for awhile.

First, what's the need to shoot this in HD to begin with? If there is a need, fine. If not, why bother? I'm not discouraging you, just asking the ?.

Secondly, you realize the HVX does NOT capture HD onto tape, right? If people are gonna have these camera for 3 years, are you going to supply them P2 cards for that length of time?

HDV and DVCPRO HD are different in that HDV runs a 5 to 1 compression scheme (I believe) and DVCPRO HD comes in a couple of different flavors with DVCPRO HD 50 and DVCPRO HD (which is basically uncompressed HD). You'll get about 8 minutes on a 8 gig P2 Card.

There are consumer/prosumer grade HD and HDV cameras coming on the market. At this point, I can't personally recommend one over the other.

You would do well to stick with a single format to avoid the headaches of mixing formats down the road. If this is for industrial video, and you want to use HD, I might stick with HDV that is acquired on tape, or disk. I would stay away from the P2 workflow for a project like this.

My thoughts.

Tim Scarpino
 
Thanks for the answer. My initial thought was that in three years time, ”everything” is HD, that´s why I aim for HDV and not DV. (Right or wrong?)

To be quit honest, I did not realize that the HVX did not record HDV on tape. Is the tape just for DV capture?

I can see that the P2 workflow is not easy, thats why I want the ”amateurs” to use tape.
 
First, answer the question "Why HD ?"

Consider quality requirements and final output. Is it to be played on DVD? Is it for broadcast or for a Kiosk? Are there HD requirements? Will it play on an HD-only broadcast or cable channel? Will it be used in commercials?

If this is going to play on laptops or online, perhaps for training, then DV should be fine for some time.

You already have a DVC30 that shoots in DV. If you buy an HVX200 and shoot in DV to tape, then you only need one more camera. And it could be another DV camera like the DVC30 or perhaps even a consumer DV camera.
 
Yeah I think if they are amateurs you might want to consider getting 1 Canon A1 and 2 Canon HV20's. If they won't really be able to use all of the features that the pro cameras offer then why get them pro cameras? The HV20 can still shoot hdv at 24f if that is what you need and has some simple controls. I assume they will be auto focusing and auto white balancing so I would go with 2 HV20's and 1 Canon A1. And I am not just recommending it because it is cheaper but with less buttons they will have less knobs to hit on mistake.
 
Tim Scarpino said:
HDV and DVCPRO HD are different in that HDV runs a 5 to 1 compression scheme (I believe) and DVCPRO HD comes in a couple of different flavors with DVCPRO HD 50 and DVCPRO HD (which is basically uncompressed HD). You'll get about 8 minutes on a 8 gig P2 Card.
Click to expand...
  • DV is about 5:1.
  • HDV is about 27:1 up to 47:1.
  • There is no DVCProHD 50. DVCPro50 is about 5:1 (twice the bitrate of DV, twice the color sampling)
  • DVCProHD is NOT uncompressed, it uses a ratio of about 6.7:1.
 
One correction: DVCPRO50 is 3.3:1. It's twice the bitrate of DV, and twice the color sampling, but also significantly less compressed.
 
The HVX is easy to learn even for an amateur. My first shoot with it is ending up as bonus material on the upcoming Front Line Assembly DVD. The color and clarity of the footage looks just lush compared to the DV that the local cable station guys shot of the same show.
 
Thanks for all input. My customer have not given any directions regarding quality of media, so DV / DVD might work also in a few years from now, as Nik suggests. On the other hand, some of the material might also be used in commercials etc. It might then be a good idea that the material I shoot will be in "future proof" HD or DVCPO HD. For this project I can then downscale my material to DV and match with footage from the "amateurs". Is this good thinking?
 
THoff said:
  • DV is about 5:1.
  • HDV is about 27:1 up to 47:1.
  • There is no DVCProHD 50. DVCPro50 is about 5:1 (twice the bitrate of DV, twice the color sampling)
  • DVCProHD is NOT uncompressed, it uses a ratio of about 6.7:1.
Click to expand...

Gracias!

Thanks for clearing me up!

Tim Scarpino
 
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