Documentary Workflow with HVX?

doondoon

doondoon

Well-known member
I'd like to get a accurate idea of how a three month documentary would go with the HVX, several Firestores and a couple LTO's. This project shoots in Michigan but is being posted in LA. At the end of each shooting day (or couple days), I'll need to Fed-ex footage (LTO) back to LA so it can be redigitized and strung out for viewing/dailies.

Question 1: How long would it take to offload an 100 gig Firestore to LTO? Or from LTO into FCP? How is the footage saved?

Question 2: Do I need a laptop as an intermediate or can I go DIRECTLY from firestore to LTO?

Question 3: Will I be able to get the footage back OFF the LTO in full resolution exactly as it was shot in camera before going to LTO.


Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Also, we need two LTO drives. Which make/model are people thinking about using for this application?

Thank you!
 
How long would it take to offload an 100 gig Firestore to LTO?
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Depends on the LTO drive you're using, but it should be about comparable to any disk-to-disk transfer. An LTO3 drive can be as fast as a P2 card, running 80 megabytes per second (640 mbps, or 6x faster than realtime). At 80 megabytes per second, 100 gigs would be transferred in about 15 minutes or so. However, the FireStore would be the bottleneck in that circumstance; I'd expect the firestore probably can't transfer more than maybe 30 megabytes per second, so you're probably looking at somewhere around 45 minutes or an hour to back up a 100gb firestore to LTO-3.

How is the footage saved?
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Exactly like a hard disk would save it. It's data tape, after all, so it's an exact bit-for-bit clone of what you have on the disk.

Do I need a laptop as an intermediate or can I go DIRECTLY from firestore to LTO?
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A computer intermediary would be necessary.

Will I be able to get the footage back OFF the LTO in full resolution exactly as it was shot in camera before going to LTO.
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Yes, bit-for-bit identical.
 
Hi,
I’ve been, researching LTO drives. What I propose may not be LTO3 but it’s portable and maybe just as fast or even faster.

You might want to check out this equipment work-flow.

Tandberg 420LTO Tape Drive
http://www.inostor.com/products/products_420LTO2.htm

Adaptec Mac PCMCIA Slim SCSI Adapter
http://techstore.doit.wisc.edu/product.asp?login=D&itemnum=C23015

EMC DANTZ RETROSPECT
http://www.dantz.com/en/about/news/detail.dtml?id=263

Apple G4 PowerBook
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APP...AZ1enZQNax/0.SLID?nclm=PowerBook&mco=7256EE37

This system is fairly mobile, now all you have to do is build a 12v battery power source with a 300w inverter and away you go.

I hope this helps

:beer:
 
If LTO's run $5000 thats a bit much. Im looking at getting the HVX200 for sure and have looked at different options in P2 cards. I found out through a buddie of mine who works for Boeing that they suposedly told Panasonic to supply them with a generic formater so they can use inexpensive P2 cards. Another friend said that 2 companies are coming out with cheap cards as well in 5,10, 20, 50gig range. I also have looked at the Mac Mini. Slap a 400 or 500gig in it and use a 9" screen with it. Should cost about a grand and it will run on 12 volts built into it. but it depends on wether firewire can feed out the recorded card while recording to the empty one? Or wether firewire can handle dvcpro 50 or hd. It would have a lot more recording time than the Firestore offers. I think you could go into Imovie with dvcpro and for sure with FCP. Even hooking up a P2 card reader to it would work. Just a thought.: :happy:
 
Hmmm. $1799, and it writes at 24 megabytes per second -- that's still twice the speed of DVCPRO-HD tape, yet 1/3 the price of the LTO3. Looks very interesting indeed!
 
Barry_Green said:
Hmmm. $1799, and it writes at 24 megabytes per second -- that's still twice the speed of DVCPRO-HD tape, yet 1/3 the price of the LTO3. Looks very interesting indeed!
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Yes, and it's portable, and I believe runs on 12v power as well as A/C
 
For $300 (or less) you can buy a PC/104 single-board computer with IEEE1394 and USB 2.0 than runs on 12V.

Install Linux (already has 1394 DV capture software) to the flash ROM, add a laptop HD, and for less than $500 you have your own portable recorder.

Only problem is, someone will need to tweak linux's "libdv" driver to capture the DVCPROHD stream. Assuming that Panasonic freely provides the stream information, this should be fairly simple (note that you don't need the DVCPROHD codec to capture the stream, you just need to know how the data is formatted).

You'll need a suitable enclosure for the SBC and hard-disc. I suggest:

arrihvx.jpg



:thumbsup:
​
 
I am sure that Apple will show how you could work with HVX at Macworld — San Francisco, Jan 9-13, something similar like a presentation with Sony's Z1 the last January. Maybe even Steve Jobs personally will show the latest Apple-DVCPRO HD-HVX solution...shoot-capture-edit...Waiting...
 
interesting, SJuser
Yes, Hopefully the new Intel iBooks will be this type of monitor/disk recorder for the HVX,
Merry Christmas
 
Sorry -- I am totally unfamiliar with LTO / LTO3...How is using an LTO a better option than using a PowerBook to burn data-DVDs for backup / sending to your editor in LA? Seems much more expensive -- is it a lot faster?
 
Bono said:
Sorry -- I am totally unfamiliar with LTO / LTO3...How is using an LTO a better option than using a PowerBook to burn data-DVDs for backup / sending to your editor in LA? Seems much more expensive -- is it a lot faster?
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Bono,

Using LTO / LTO3 isn't necessarily better its just a different workflow. LTO transfer of data is faster, (24 MB/sec min) and the tapes hold more information, (up to 400 gigs) and a client who is used to walking away with a tape at the end of a shoot day can feel more comfortable because they will have a physical backup that's familiar to them.

Banks use LTO as a backup system. LTO 3 is fairly expensive while I think LTO 2 is affordable. The difference here is 4-5K compared to 1600.00 for LTO 2 external portable drive. And at about 67 dollars for 200 Gigs of uncompressed data it slightly cheaper than dual layer DVD's and could also be a little more convenient to use in the field.
 
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