Director arguments / Debate

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filming

Active member
I have this problem at the moment and need professional opinions on the matter.

I was given a music video to edit and it was 20 mins in total. Not enough time to make it even 1 minute. The soundtrack is 3:35 secs so the video I was given being 20 mins is just not enough footage to do it.

I then got the group together and shot extra footage and directed it which came to 1 hr and 5 mins. Edited all together and looks good, they are happy.


However, the person who is marketing it wants to take credit for directing the whole video. I said to him, he cannot do that because my footage time over rides his one completely. His being the 20 mins and mine the 1 hr and 5 mins. We cannot take co-production because there can never be two directors at once on one project. Yet he insists he directed the whole thing.


What should I do? Please bare in mind that this video maybe played on MTV soon and I do not want someone to take credit for my work. It is my first music video so it may help me even just a little bit if I want to break into the industry.



This is the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baN3Pp-PC7Q

Don't mind the quality and flickering, youtube recommressed it in a weird way.




What should I do?
 
Talk to a lawyer, plain and simple. I am certainly not qualified to give out legal advice and I don't know of anyone here who is (correct me if I am wrong). I can, however, give you my opinion of the matter. You overwhelmingly directed more of the video than he did. That makes you equally (if not more) qualified to take credit for what you did. Since this is a big thing, you should fight it.

Explain to me why there cannot be two directors? I mean, technically speaking, there was two, so why can't it be credited as such? My advice is to talk to somebody who deals with matters like this, like a lawyer, that is where you will get the best idea of how to go about this situation.

Sorry for all you are having to go through, and I hope you can resolve it to your liking. My apologies for not being of more help. Good luck!
 
Thank you for your opinion. I think I will talk to a lawyer to get legal advice.

In a music video or film, there can only be one director and he has an assistant director. Two directors is very very rare like the matrix directors and Alien VS Predator Requiem directors. They took co-director because they are brothers.

I think he wants full credit because he wants to show off and flaunt the name "director" to girls so he can bed them. The fact is, he does not know which camera's we used, what programs we used to create the effects etc...

I thought about the issue and was just gonna let him have his 15 mins of fame and glory because when he is asked all the technical questions and doesn't know, people in the industry will know he is lying.

If people have other opinions I would like to hear them.
 
only the DGA enforces that stipulation about a single director credit. if neither of you are in the DGA an no contracts were signed thru that union, then you can credit both of you.
 
Problem is we are not even in the U.S

We are in the Caribbean and there are no laws here on copyright.
 
...i am confused now.

why don't you just talk to him. tell him you had to take the band back out and re-shoot stuff. and stipulate that you feel you deserve a co-director credit.
 
If you are not members of the Director's Guild of America then there is no reason - legally or morally - that you can't share co-directing credits. End of story.

Talk to a lawyer and fight for the co-directing credit.
 
You were hired as an editor, correct? Then you're the editor. Unless you were hired to be a director or told in the middle of the project by those in charge that you were to direct a portion of it, then you don't have much recourse, IMO.

Lots of DPs "direct" scenes or entire films, that doesn't make them the "director". Lots of actors "direct" themselves and others, that doesn't mean they get a "director" credit. If a key grip suggests a great dolly or crane move, they don't suddenly become a co-director. A lot of editors make great decisions in the editing room which take a worthless pile of random footage and turns it into a story, but that doesn't make them the director either.

Were you hired to direct?
Were you told you were going to be a 'director'?
Were you told you'd get director credit?
It doesn't sound like it. You should be excited that you edited a project which is going to be on MTV. Call a lawyer if you want to, but it's going to be a waste of time and money IMO.


As far as the "In a music video or film, there can only be one director and he has an assistant director" that's bunk and is not certainly true for your situation. It's clear that you're not in the DGA. Additionally, the AD's job is nothing like the director's job, so don't get left with the impression that the "assistant director" is a person who "assists" in the "directing".

"he wants to show off and flaunt the name "director" to girls so he can bed them. The fact is, he does not know which camera's we used, what programs we used to create the effects etc... "
Who cares if he knows what camera you used or what programs created the effects? That is completely irrelevant. A director doesn't need to know either of those things and if you think knowledge of the type of camera or digital effect is what determines the 'director' credit, then I think you're misunderstanding the position.
 
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Texanite, the OP actually does mention that he went back out into the field and SHOT extra footage which he claims makes up for a large portion of the video.

He didn't just edit it into a better piece, he went out and shot a large bulk of footage all by himself. Hence the confusion.
 
I have already talked to him. I mentioned that in the first post.

I am not fighting for a co-directing credit because I was not the co-director. I done most of the work he was supposed to do but didn't because he does not know what to do. He shot 20 mins of the video and came to me asking to edit it. I said to him 20 mins is not enough of footage and we need to shoot more.

He said ok lets shoot more. I told the guy how I want the scenes done, who I want in the video, how I want it to look. He done what I asked but to him he thinks he directed it because I told him how to do it.

Basically he shot 20 mins worth of footage and I shot 1 hour and 5 mins and most of what I shot is in the video. How can I give a shared credit to someone who has done less work then your self?


Poe seems to understand the confusion surrounding this case. I think Texanite just confused the issue even more.

I am willing to just walk away from it and let him have his 15 mins of fame and glory. Next time if it's not written on paper, I won't touch it.
 
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both of you can take credit for the video, look at mtv and you see it all the time, look at the chris brown videos, half of them are shared between chris brown and the real director but chris brown probably came up with some ideas so they both share the credit, I honestly think that if what you are going to see on the screen I mean the final product is a mix bag of what you shot and the other guy shot then the right thing to do is for both of you to take credit
 
poe said:
Texanite, the OP actually does mention that he went back out into the field and SHOT extra footage which he claims makes up for a large portion of the video.

He didn't just edit it into a better piece, he went out and shot a large bulk of footage all by himself. Hence the confusion.
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I understand what he did, my point is that it's irrelevant that he went out and shot more stuff. Just as in a much more extreme situation whenever a DP works on an indie feature and chooses all the shots, finds the locations, hires the crew, and communicates with the actors. If that DP was hired to be a DP, he doesn't then get to choose to be called the director even if he was doing "more work" than the director or things that he might consider to be the directors job.



I think Texanite just confused the issue even more.
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I'm very clear on the issue of how credits work. It seems that you are the one who is confused.

If you are friends with the director and the two of you want to hash out the credits, that's fine. But if you were hired as an editor and took it upon yourself to shoot more footage for the production, that does not somehow magically give you any kind of legal credit as a director.

There are a lot of people in the film world who do a lot of things that might technically fall under the category of another job, but that doesn't mean you get that credit.

There are a lot of people in the film world who have assistants and other people doing parts of their jobs for them, that doesn't make the assistant any more than an assistant. A casting assistant who runs a casting session and picks some talent for a show doesn't suddenly get credit for casting the show. The assistant editor who edits complete scenes together while the editor is out at dinner doesn't suddenly become the editor. Credits are contractually negotiated, not based on what one crew person thinks they contributed to the production.
 
Texanite said:
IBut if you were hired as an editor and took it upon yourself to shoot more footage for the production, that does not somehow magically give you any kind of legal credit as a director.
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I agree with this. You are the editor, he is the director.

I said to him 20 mins is not enough of footage and we need to shoot more.

He said ok lets shoot more.
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It sounds to me like he always had final say, and he's the one who allowed you to get the footage you needed as an editor. I just don't see any convincing argument why you should get a co-directing credit.
 
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