Dire Straits

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silentsmith

Member
Hey guys.
For the last week I've been heavily researching and referring to this board to get an idea of how to obtain good sound for a long short I intend on shooting July 11th.

However, there are so many opinions, always differentiating, often contradicting that my head is just swimming. I feel very lost about key gear, the stuff I ABSOLUTELY CANNOT DO WITHOUT.

So...
-$1,500 budget
-I only need one shotgun microphone
(I'm leaning towards Rode NTG-2... affordable, good reviews)

Now... (The cause for concern)
-I need either: DAT recorder/Field mixer/SoundDevice MixPre (All 3?
This is what I gather from my research. It seems that all 3 are necessary for optimal sound and control, but I don't need that. I simply need good, adjustable sound. So please, film bretheren, steer me in the right direction and tell me...

For somebody trying to get good sound, nothing THX-certified, what MUST i have?


(P.S. -- I understand that my post is repititive, but you must understand, the number of dissenting opinions on this board makes it very confusing determining what I need. Just discard this post if the repitiveness bothers you.)

Thank you so much guys.
 
silentsmith said:
So...
-$1,500 budget
-I only need one shotgun microphone
(I'm leaning towards Rode NTG-2... affordable, good reviews)

Now... (The cause for concern)
-I need either: DAT recorder/Field mixer/SoundDevice MixPre (All 3?
This is what I gather from my research. It seems that all 3 are necessary for optimal sound and control, but I don't need that. I simply need good, adjustable sound. So please, film bretheren, steer me in the right direction and tell me...
Click to expand...

You don't need a dat or recorder, just record in camera if your camera has XLR inputs that are line switchable. The mix pre IS a field mixer and will do what you need until you can save up and get an sd302 (mixpre holds re-sale value well).

You need a shotgun and a hyper + wind protection for both. Is the budget $1500 total?

If it were me I would make a choice to favor indoors and have some outdoor options. I would get the blueline hyper, kssm, bbg, jammer and 12' gitzo (also add a rode sm3 shock-mount to mount hyper in bbg on camera if you need to for ambient. Second I would try to get a mixer (either the sd302 or mixpre). Later I would add the shotgun and zepplin (one is no good w/o the other).

Hyper Cardioid: you can get this combo with power supply and capsule for about $350-375
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...icrophone.html

I suggest the k-tek KSSM shockmount with soft bands. $120

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ock_Mount.html

Windscreen is the Rycote BBG $140
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...indshield.html

if you want to shoot outside too, get the furry jammer for $70 more.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Baby_Ball.html

Here is the boom I suggest, a 12' gitzo carbon fiber.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...on_Carbon.html

Here is a good entry level mixer $665 (you really want the sound devices 302 if you can swing it)
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ortable_2.html

Here are some headphones that are the industry standard $99
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Headphone.html

For exteriors get an at4073a $550 or sanken cs3e $1300
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...t_Shotgun.html


In order to use it outside you need wind protection. Rycote S Series $350
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...hield_Kit.html

or the K-Tek K-Zepp $350
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...sion_Med_.html


A few cables (good)
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc... e_Cable.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc... crophone.html

Your mixer will need a bag )and you may as well get the bag for the 302 now).
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Mixer_Bag.html
______
 
Is there a particular reason you're pricing a DAT recorder? Solid-state recorders are cheaper, more reliable, lighter, and integrate far more easily into modern non-linear post-production workflows. Most of them also sound significantly better than comparable DAT recorders.
 
Thank you for clearing up a lot.

My only remaining question:
What am I losing by getting the SoundDevices MixPre as opposed to a SoundDevices 302 that would affect a SINGLE microphone production?


-$1,500 is my TOTAL budget.
-I only need a single microphone.
-I'm shooting approximately 80% outdoors, 20% indoors.
-I just need clean dialogue. Will the MixPre suffice for me?
 
80% outdoors....

k-tek kzepp $300
gitzo boom $300
at4073a $550
cables etc

Have sound blankets on hand to deaden reverberant interiors. add the hyper etc later.

add a mixer and bag if you can, but it would put you over $1500 save up for the rest later. Mix pre is a good starter mixer, should be fine for your purpose. Even look at the SD mm1 if you are really strapped (you would be better off with the mix pre).
 
Thank you for the responses. An additional question:

I know the DAT recorder record into FlashCards and/or SDHM-something, but what does the Field Mixer record onto? The tape inside the camera (HVX)?

I ask because I know I'd need to reserve an extra $150 bucks for flash cards.

Thanks again. And excuse the question if its a novice one.
 
It records INTO your camera, so yes the tape inside the camera, HVX for you. Or if you have the newer SS. Listen to Sane though. And imo budget for a field mixer. MixPre is great inbetween to 302, and 2 channel. The MM-1 I've used the quality is amazing and on par exactly with the MixPre but very limiting with the one channel and options.

(Although if you just use one mic and strapped for cash the MM-1 will be great for this however - it really isn't future proofed if you want to expand, and they do not hold up nearly as well as the MixPre which you can nearly sell for what you bought it for, I've even seen ppl buy one used on ebay for MORE than it is retail, or at least merely 20-50 bucks cheaper (w/o shipping costs).

Anyways you'll be fine with Sane's suggestions even w/o a mixer or recorder many ppl use far less and can get pretty good sound when they know what they're doing. =)
 
silentsmith said:
I know the DAT recorder record into FlashCards and/or SDHM-something, but what does the Field Mixer record onto? The tape inside the camera (HVX)?
Click to expand...
You may want to do a bit more research before you start buying gear, then.

DAT recorders do not record to FlashCards, they record to Digital Audio Tape (DAT). DAT is a tape-based medium that was very popular during the `90's, but has become obsolete. The format used a helical tape feed mechanism that was notoriously prone to dropouts, misfeeds, and other technical nightmares.

Modern solid-state recorders typically record to some flavour of flash media, although a few also sport internal hard disks. While it's not perfect, flash media easily beats DAT in terms of reliability. Moreover, removable flash media can be slapped into a USB card reader, making transfers to editing workstations a breeze. The price of flash media drops almost daily, so $125 should get you started with plenty of recording space, and its all re-writable.

Field mixers, on the other hand, do not record onto anything. What they actually do is take one or more audio feeds (mic or line level), mix them together, and output the mix via a ballanced audio line. Unless you connect the mixer output to the line input of a recording device (eg. a portable audio recorder or properly equipped camcorder) you won't actually accomplish anything.

Field mixers are essential for recording good single-system sound (ie. directly into the camera), since the microphone preamplifiers built into most camcorders are absolutely terrible. A good field mixer such as an SD 302 will even outperform the preamps built into most portable audio recorders.
 
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