Dialogue editor
- Thread starter dre83
- Start date
Well it takes 6 "chapters" of "preparing" before he gets to the "real dialogue editing". And still those aren't there...(yet ?)
But maybe it's a way to show that you have to realy prepare yourself and that spending one whole day (like one hole day, like... 10 hours like in "you didn't do anything else, you didn't even did some crossfades between two scenes), well that kinda spending is important so at the end you win time.
But maybe it's a way to show that you have to realy prepare yourself and that spending one whole day (like one hole day, like... 10 hours like in "you didn't do anything else, you didn't even did some crossfades between two scenes), well that kinda spending is important so at the end you win time.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
This guy is speaking as a big budget dialog editor. A lot of this is going to seem crazy to folks working on low budget films. And even at his level things vary a bit place to place. We always had ADR editors and didn't have dedicated BG editors.
Dialog editors tend to be kind of OCD. The Felix Unger's of sound post. But that is key for them on a big budget. A lot of what his prep is about is critical if you are a big budget dialog editor and want to keep working. But a lot also makes sense at all levels. And even in the "wild west" of FX editors there is a LOT of organizing that goes on.
But a good part of that is because you have a large team and they all have to be on the same page AND the film is in constant flux while people are working so you have to be able to "conform" to what ever the new cut is. For FX that is usually moving some things around and maybe adding a bit. For dialog it may mean having to start over for some section.
If the director decides to use a different take for some cut the FX probably have to move around a bit but most will still be used and maybe you need something new. For the dialog editor it means starting from scratch for that cut.
Also the book is a bit dated. With digital dubbers and digital work prints some of the track layout stuff is not as critical anymore. When it was Mag and Film you had to leave a good amount of space for the mixer to get in and out of any piece of sound. Now they still like some room but almost all of the stages are playing off Pro Tools machines with virtual premixes so if it's too tight they will just have the editor (who is manning the playback machine) move the clip to a new track. When you had recorded premixes it was a big problem to move a clip, you had to take the premix apart and redo it from there.
The book is really for dialog mixers so like a auto repair manual it's probably very hard to get through for non mechanics.
I don't own it because I know a lot of what he's talking about and it's $$ so I got it from the library, but I have it on my list to pick up used.
Dialog editors tend to be kind of OCD. The Felix Unger's of sound post. But that is key for them on a big budget. A lot of what his prep is about is critical if you are a big budget dialog editor and want to keep working. But a lot also makes sense at all levels. And even in the "wild west" of FX editors there is a LOT of organizing that goes on.
But a good part of that is because you have a large team and they all have to be on the same page AND the film is in constant flux while people are working so you have to be able to "conform" to what ever the new cut is. For FX that is usually moving some things around and maybe adding a bit. For dialog it may mean having to start over for some section.
If the director decides to use a different take for some cut the FX probably have to move around a bit but most will still be used and maybe you need something new. For the dialog editor it means starting from scratch for that cut.
Also the book is a bit dated. With digital dubbers and digital work prints some of the track layout stuff is not as critical anymore. When it was Mag and Film you had to leave a good amount of space for the mixer to get in and out of any piece of sound. Now they still like some room but almost all of the stages are playing off Pro Tools machines with virtual premixes so if it's too tight they will just have the editor (who is manning the playback machine) move the clip to a new track. When you had recorded premixes it was a big problem to move a clip, you had to take the premix apart and redo it from there.
The book is really for dialog mixers so like a auto repair manual it's probably very hard to get through for non mechanics.
I don't own it because I know a lot of what he's talking about and it's $$ so I got it from the library, but I have it on my list to pick up used.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
As I kind of mentioned for a big budget dialog editor that IS real editing, just as getting in and turning the ignition is part of "real driving".
On his level you can't start cutting till the rest is in place or you wont be working long.
ryanjf
Well-known member
John's book is great! I still look over it and read it as a refresher. This book is a recommended read by a lot of industry professionals. Keep in mind that a lot of it is "luck" in a sense that you're lucky getting good audio to begin with.
Also, with the Field Recorder Workflow, which was introduced in an earlier version of Pro Tools, is now more apparent in PT10. In PT10, you can define a Field Recorder Guide Track or something with those terms. This workflow would take away the need for auto-assembly software like Titan, which Purcell mentions, as long as the metadata was embedded correctly/accurately during or after production. The production sound mixer would also need to send the pic editor a mono guide track derived from the polyphonic BWF that contains the metadata. Might I add that this only works in Media Composer since FCP strips the metadata when exporting an OMF :/ If anyone knows a way for FCP to NOT do this, please let me know!
There's a whole CAS document on this that's a great read. I've tested the Field Recorder Workflow with PT10 and a trial version of Media Composer and the workflow was flawless... I was able to auto-assemble 8 channels of audio from one mono guide track that was sent over from MC.
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
Well you probably won't have to worry for long since FCPX doesn't do OMF at all...
I think the solution is to use something like Automatic Duck to export from FCP. Love it or hate it FCP never really supported film work very well. Editors made it work because they disliked AVid more than they disliked Apple, but it was always a bit like pulling teeth with FCP. With FCPX basically killing any post workflow I think you will see a lot of folks moving to Avid or Adobe.