Deinterlaced 50i vs. Cineform C25p

[bourbonst61]

Hello,

I think all of us who are shooting drama with goals for high-end projection would rather dump our Sony FX1/Z1U's in favor of an all-progressive 24p HD camera or would even blow our DVX 24p footage up to 720/1080 if it would look decent (IMO, even Red Giant's "Instant HD" product looks like crap). Wouldn't a completely progressive resolution with all available pixels be sexy?

But with most of our budgets, all we can afford to do to be able to afford the extra equipment we need (some need a 35mm adaptor or extra stabilizers) is our FX1's and we have to make the best product we can with them.

I'll use the example I am most likely going to purchase: an FX1e with a Beachtek XLR adaptor and a Red Rock M2 (which I have already ordered).

Having spent a couple of hours looking over articles on deinterlacing ("instant sex", "smart deinterlacing", "deinterlacing with a fox in a box") and reading about products like Red Giant's "Magic Bullet", "DV Filmmaker", "Nattress", and all of the other programs used so frequently and reading about the potential capturing methods I will be using (most likely to be Cineform)... I have arrived at a point of confusion.

In your valuable opinions, would the method of achieving 24p through, say, Magic Bullet's deinterlacing solution by converting 50i to 25p be any better than recording HDV using the FX1's Cineframe 25 (which is supposed to have much less resolution loss and not be as stuttery over CF24) to get a good idea of the kind of motion I want and then have Cineform perform a conversion to 24p for me?

Your opinions would be welcome.

 

[hawkmankt]

I hear that using a software solution and shooting in the highest resolution possible (60i for my FX1) is the best solution. I've not heard otherwise out here on the internet anywhere.

If you look at the films shot with the camera (Broken Arrows for example), they all seem to be shooting in the highest HD resolution and then converting using software to deinterlace and bump it to 24P. It looks good too.

Good luck man!

 

[rawfa]

Check out Macgregors' videos. He shoots with a FX1E+G35 and uses Cineframe25. He has shot some of the most filmic videos I've seen here (I think he studied cinematography for years and started out as a DP). I always use Cineframe25 and I think it works just fine and it saves you lots of rendering...people say it looses resolution but so does deinterlacing on post. I think you're making a good choice. You'll have a nice combo with the M2 (there's some kick ass FX1+M2 videos on their site)

 

[zoostory]

deinterlacing in post, with something like natress, does not cut your resolution in half like CF25. Sony's algorithym for coming up with 25 progressive frames leaves you with 540 lines of rez, where as with natress, it interpolates, giving you 1080 lines at 25p. Granted, it's not a perfect interpolation, not as good as capturing a true progressive image.

However, if your final outcome is standard def, CF25 is a great option. It will save you a lot of time deinterlacing in post, and in my testing experience, it looks a little more filmic, temporally speaking.

I have a Z1U and I haven't left PAL mode in months. I often use CF25 for projects not requiring a high def final and the results are quite good. Keep in mind, conforming to 23.98 will slow down you footage roughly 4% and require you to adjust your audio accordingly in something like soundtrack pro.

personally, I have now seen a lot of examples from all sorts of cameras, I have seen good HVX footage and very bad HVX footage, I have seen good Z1 footage and bad Z1 footage. Which leads me to my personal belief that composition, lighting, performance, story, are far more important than the camera. Also, using a 35mm adaptor will seriously bring home a filmic look. However, keep in mind the light loss, the FX/Z1 rate around 160ASA, so it's tough to lose that stop! You need a lot of light. And with a wide open lens, your DoF is VERY limited. So focus is a BIG issue. Not every shot is an ECU on someones nose, sometimes you want the trees in the background in focus!

 

[Dremmwel]

Well, I shoot FX1E and cineframe25... I have now been working for months on adapter etc and trust me, you can achieve great depth of field without any adapter.

As it's already been said, it's nice to have everything in focus, and if you watch a lot of movie like I do you will see that shallow depth of field is used for only one purpose...focusing you mind on something precise.

so here what I have done, I purchase a set of close lens +1 to +4, that allow me to have a strong depth of field without being 10 miles away from the subject, I also have the sony wide angle 0.8 and still I can zoom in a bit and get a shallow depth of field...

why cineframe, because when the sony deinterlacer is doing it's job, it does it on a clean image which in uncompressed, nw if you deinterlace in post because of artifact due to comression I don't find the result that great but that's a personal opinion....

for post I use edius pro, which give me everything real time with no hardware, I put a bit smooth blur(3-4%), I use the color correction to boost the contrast (9-15) and then use the white babalnce to give a warm feeling and I can tell you that I now have a great result.

So don't ask yourself to many question, people (including myself) have spent the last 2 years talking about the problem of each camera, and thay are still, trying to find solution with adatper but trust me, there is not that many people who did produce a decent short. So I gonna go back to my desk and work on my script, and accept that my FX1 is maybe not the best, but it's what I have and I gonna do what I like wioth it which is making a movie....

 

[avr]

In my last short I shot FX1 E in cineframe mode.
For my taste the image lost sharpness. Is a bit soft to me but you win the film look. I don´t know how it works if i desinterlaced the footage in post, maybe you won more detail, more sharpness and less filmic look, but I´m not sure i only know this cam about two days and like you i want to know learn more of this cam and how can I archieve great footage...