Corrado Part II

I love this discussion. I'll just add one other thing to all this. You better believe in the project/package that you are carrying the flag for. I need to tell no one here how lonely some of these moments are when we are out pitching the projects over and over sometimes getting doors slamed in our face. Add to the fact that money is hard to come by and we have to make tough choices to sustain the process. I am doing a incredibly complex feature documentary and my belief in the story I am telling has sustained me during some rather difficult moments. Completely different financial model docs are but many similarities as well.

When I put a narrative package together I will believe it in the same way. Maybe not for the same reasons, my doc is about a peacemaker who has done incredible work, but I'll believe in the narrative because it is a good story and has talent I believe in, and a budget that makes sense and on and on.

One last note about attitude, I honestly feel like being positive about outcomes, and saying why not, not in a self deluded way, but in an informed way is a major part of it. If there is a universal lesson to Adam's story, it is he said, why not he be the one to make an action film with Sizemore. There were no great indications he might succeed (variable meanings) other than his belief in himself. I know a lot of people that are self defeated before they really even try and that is what I was getting at with my earlier posts.

With that, I am rooting for success stories for everyone here because they inspire me and keep me thinking why not. Cheers!
 
Mickey Munday said:
Jeff just out of curiosity what's been your experience (or any writer you know) when attempting this? Especially if it's a studio buying the script. I've always been under the impression that it's been a shot in the dark, but reading your comments I get the sense you are insinuating that it depends on how much they love the script and if its something they'd risk because they love the scipt that much?

Let's assume it's a script they "love". I won't use great, because great means different things to different people.
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My experience has been that they're open to it, if I can convince talent to do the movie. They'll make offers to actors that we agree on, and if I can close the deal, I get to direct.

I've had this work once, fail once (they were only interested in one specific actor, and he took another movie), and I've got another project where we're out to talent right now.
 
wileypen said:
My experience has been that they're open to it, if I can convince talent to do the movie. They'll make offers to actors that we agree on, and if I can close the deal, I get to direct.

I've had this work once, fail once (they were only interested in one specific actor, and he took another movie), and I've got another project where we're out to talent right now.
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Nice....and good luck with that. It's good hearing Adam's approach, but also hearing this additional approach (which I figured was actually more of a long shot) just gives me an additional route to keep in mind.
 
wileypen said:
My experience has been that they're open to it, if I can convince talent to do the movie. They'll make offers to actors that we agree on, and if I can close the deal, I get to direct.

I've had this work once, fail once (they were only interested in one specific actor, and he took another movie), and I've got another project where we're out to talent right now.
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Been waiting for someone to post this, might of thought I was delusional for even thinking of it.
I would LOVE to read one of your scripts if you'd be comfortable with that.

Anyway, thanks Adam for contributing, best thread on DVXUser by far.
 
Adam, I was wondering if you had any latitude to bring your own team on for the second film or if the producers had final say on cast and crew. I'm re-reading the other thread and you mentioned wanting to carry over Messner and Sizemore from Corrado. Also, your DP David Fox you mentioned working with before.

Was this your wanting to start fresh or it simply not being your choice since you werent the producer on this one?

Good to have you back for a while. When will we be seeing Hangar 14 in stores or online?
 
mentatDUKE said:
Adam, I was wondering if you had any latitude to bring your own team on for the second film or if the producers had final say on cast and crew. I'm re-reading the other thread and you mentioned wanting to carry over Messner and Sizemore from Corrado. Also, your DP David Fox you mentioned working with before.

Was this your wanting to start fresh or it simply not being your choice since you werent the producer on this one?

Good to have you back for a while. When will we be seeing Hangar 14 in stores or online?
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Things change, for sure. What made it change the most was the producer's wish to film the movie under a Canadian tax credit scheme, which dictated that the department heads had to be Canadian, as did most of the principal actors. For this reason, I could not use my DP.

I'm not sure I would have brought other cast onto this project in any case. I was very happy with the ones we cast, very happy. And the DP I used was simply awesome, so no complaints there.

Loved the production for sure.

H14 is supposed to be delivered to the distributor in exactly one month, and I have no idea when it will be out. They will be doing lots of press on it and a great trailer so I'm sure there will be plenty of notice.

Expect the title to probably change (to what I am not sure) since distributors all like to do that.

If I was to wager a guess I'd say fall or Christmas release.
 
taormina;2296025
Expect the title to probably change (to what I am not sure) since distributors all like to do that.
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I could see a slight number change in it's future. (but like the title as is)

How hands on are you with post on it?
 
Staven said:
I could see a slight number change in it's future. (but like the title as is)

How hands on are you with post on it?
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Pretty hands on. Was doing ADR on it most of the day, and will be doing ADR for the next week or so. Today was via skype in Vancouver, tomorrow there is one in LA and also Vancouver, then next week two days in LA, then one in New Mexico all to accommodate the actors.

So yeah, pretty hands on.
 
Ted Spencer said:
Martin, maybe I'm just slow in the head, but could you make a little clearer what you meant with these points? Colloquialisms like "bucked" and "stick the landings" can be a bit ambiguous at times...
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Sorry for such a late reply. Truly experiencing access problems at my office.

I made two statements that I think should be held as general rules about truly indie films, like the ones made by most people here. I numbered them 1 & 2.

My point being that despite knowing those rules going in, you can still be successful and often exceed your own expectations. I "bucked" my two statements with two releases this year as one "bucks" the system.

"stick the landing" Just meant that I had managed my expectations on my movie but still planned for a certain amount of success with the project...namely significant distribution. However, the plan to get there still requires that you come through the process and nail the necessary elements of the plan you set. In other words...we planned to get significant distribution and didn't mess up in delivering a movie that could achieve it. We "stuck the landing".

Hopefully that clears up my colloquialisms.


-M
 
Hey Adam can't you just get Viggo Mortensen and make American Yakuza II - after watching Corrado i reckon you'd be the man for it!
 
wileypen said:
I think you're using the word "great" a little generously. There's competent, and there's work that is mind blowing, that you share with your friends, watch or read again... I see a lot of competence, and not as much greatness.
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I think even *this* comment is highly generous, although commendably unargumentative.

For my more potentially inflammatory (something I apparently excel at) 2% of an argumentative buck, I see a teensy-weensy amount of "great", a fair amount of "competent", and a giant, hulking blob of "sucks". And that's not just on filmmaking forums (and other similar places); the hit-to-miss ratio is certainly better (IMO) in the 'real' world of cinema, but it's still pretty low...
 
Adam: a question for ya:

At the risk of stating the obvious (or restating what you've already said), it seems your brilliant recipe for success in filmmaking (and I mean that sincerely - not in the *least* bit facetiously), only applies to what might be called "genre" films; heavily action/violence-based ones in particular. For what it seems are pretty clear reasons, largely involving foreign market distribution (please correct me if that's substantially wrong).

In any case, my question is: how much latitude is there genre/content-wise within this paradigm? What is the range of script/story ideas that could be (presumably) offered successfully in this manner? It would seem a given from your previous comments that for example, a script that in any way resembles "The King's Speech", no matter how similarly Oscar-worthy it might be, isn't going to cut the mustard with the guy(s) across the table in one of these deal/distro meetings.

So could you please tell us, in as much detail as you're willing, what kinds of stories/scripts *would*?

And what other kinds *wouldn't*?

I think it could be quite helpful to folks who might consider (attempting to) follow in your footsteps.

In your own case personally, I know you are a martial arts enthusiast (and something of an expert one IIRC), and also IIRC, quite conversant with various kinds of weaponry, so it seems you're a perfect fit to pursue this particular success formula where film genre is concerned. For those of us however (like me, for example), who have relatively little interest in the above-mentioned pursuits, how much 'genre latitude' if you will, might there be to be able to still play in this particularly specific film industry/dealmaking sandbox?

Thanks in advance for your comments on this : )
 
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Ted,

Regarding genre, simply put, genre means genre.

I at first struggled with this concept because I failed to see how simple it really was. As a matter of fact, if I had truly understood it before Corrado, I would have had even less story and more action.

Corrado's story was seriously hamstrung by a series of mishaps with the actors, scenes not shot, etc. You can't really call it "action" because there's just not a whole hell of a lot of action in it. It was based on the budget...but my priorities were wrong.

The major genres that sell well today are:

Action
Horror
Thriller

The genres that may sell but are really hit or miss are:

Religious
Children's
Animation
Family
Comedy
Western

The genres that do not sell (perennially), are:

Drama


So is there latitude here...of course. You can have a really great script with full story and real 3d characters, etc, in any one of those genres. As long as the CORE genre trait is present in the movie, it frankly doesn't matter.

So if you bring a movie that is supposed to be action but is instead talky talk with too much story, you will suffer. If you bring a hardcore action movie that has a surprisingly deep and rich story, it will do perfectly fine.

Just be careful NOT to forget the core trait you are selling. If it's horror, scare people. If it's action, make sure there is actually action. If it's thriller, keep people riveted in their seats.

No discussion of genre would be complete without the mention of casting. Cast actors that are well known in the genre you are making. Don't cast a dramatic actor in an action role. Get action actors (tons of them are out there.)

So in my case I'm pretty suited to action films because I am a second degree black belt as well as a military reservist. I can do action.....but it doesn't really matter. All that gives me a slight edge but frankly if you get an action script, you can also use a consultant to help you with the guns/shooting part (i.e. your armorer) and a super stunt coordinator to help you with action sequences...it's what they do.

I used a stunt coordinator on H14, a really great guy that made my stunts bigger and my fights more brutal than they would have been since he knew what we could safely execute. Very important!

As my films mature, I am trying to inject more story into them. I'd eventually like to be at the "blackhawk down" and "man on fire" level. TONS of action, but also a good story as well.

Corrado had too much story, and too little action. Then the story was hacked due to production issues. Hangar 14 has less story, and more action, and my next film will instead have even MORE action, but more story as well.

So I've told you what genres sell, now I will tell you why certain ones don't.


Religious - niche market that could either be huge or totally implode. Not alot of middle ground here. A few notable exceptions in a sea of failures.


Children's - needs a clever and established marketing angle to sell, preferably franchise based.

Animation - Really tough one here. Almost 98% chance of failure, even with the talents of a guy like Ruiari Robinson. Just a really tough genre all around unless you are dreamworks / pixar.


Family - sells well to Lifetime network and Movie if the Week type networks. Cookie cutter, not alot of inspiration, but is kind of like an 'ol reliable genre. Success here depends on pre-sale to the network. Would not make a family movie on spec.

Comedy - tough genre.....American humor is lost on foreign audiences so unless the humor transcends cultural boundaries (i.e. slapstick) and has good names, this genre should be avoided.

Western - If it contains lots of action, it will do okay. If it's a lonesome dove style dramatic romance, it will crash and burn. 3:10 to Yuma is a good example of a marketable western. Appaloosa is not.

Drama - all forms of this are anathema to any sales, be they romantic drama (notebook), straight drama (King's speech), war drama (Hurt Locker)...whatever. Traditionally films that win oscars are money losers par excellence, with a few exceptions. The Academy loves non commercial movies and almost always picks Hurt Lockers and Kings Speeches over Avatars and Inceptions. It's just the way it is.

The Oscars are an exercise in art, and not sound filmmaking principals.

I would love to win an Oscar as much as the next guy, and I have a script that I want to direct that is a dramatic piece that I would make in hopes of doing so someday.....when someone else wants to foot the bill for it. I wouldn't invest a penny in it no matter what actor was in it. They are just money losers, plain, and simple.

Hope that answers......
 
I second Ted's question above, in fact I asked a similar question on FilmSpecific with regard to comedy. Is that a viable genre for this strategy? Does the language barrier preclude comedy and foreign pre-sales? Action seems more universal as it is largely visually driven while comedy is situationally/dialog driven.
 
Ok. Simultaneous post. You basically answered my question above. Great detail. I can't really think of many direct to video comedies that were successful internationally (or domestically).
 
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