Confused

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myfriendimage

Carbonite Member
I dunno I have been reading what Spliff has been saying I am confused, I own an FX1 and use cineframe 24 all the time, I used final cut and just import the clips and drop them into a 29.97 timeline with upper dominance and it works fine, is there a step Im missing or what, what does everyone else do.
 
Well, 1080i50 is my (European) option. Deinterlacing looks a bit better done with fcp and/or Joe's De-Interlacer or even AE plus FieldsKit
 
Am I Spliff? I'm guessing so.

Anyway - I'm a *gasp* PC user, and I use a combination of Premiere Pro 1.5.1 and Cineform's AspectHD 3.3.

In order to get the most out of CF24, your editing system needs to support 2:3 pull-down reversal for HDV... I'm not sure that Fincal Cut Pro does. Once your footage's pull-down has been reversed, as opposed to a piece of 60i footage, you have 23.976 discrete frames per second which you can edit in a frame-accurate manner in a 23.976 timeline.

The folks at DVXuser are very familiar with this, as it's analagous to the 24p (not 24pA) shooting mode on the DVX100. If you understand pull-downs and pull-down reversal, this should make a lot of sense. If not - you should look them up! There's valuable information to be found.

AspectHD has a very useful feature for me in terms of dealing with CF24. Because the Cineform solution involves re-compressing the footage to the Cineform format, they have the opportunity to tinker with the image on capture. For CF24 footage, Cineform's HDLink software will scene-detect, acquire, and reverse the pull-down before writing it to an intermediate file... leaving a very editable 23.976 file on your computer, so that you don't have to reverse the pull-down in real time while editing. It's very convenient.

-Spiff
 
Spiff_2 said:
Am I Spliff? I'm guessing so.

Anyway - I'm a *gasp* PC user, and I use a combination of Premiere Pro 1.5.1 and Cineform's AspectHD 3.3.

AspectHD has a very useful feature for me in terms of dealing with CF24. Because the Cineform solution involves re-compressing the footage to the Cineform format, they have the opportunity to tinker with the image on capture. For CF24 footage, Cineform's HDLink software will scene-detect, acquire, and reverse the pull-down before writing it to an intermediate file... leaving a very editable 23.976 file on your computer, so that you don't have to reverse the pull-down in real time while editing. It's very convenient.

-Spiff
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Hi Spiff,

I have PPro 1.5.1 that comes with the bundled AspectHD, is it worth upgrading to the full version of AspectHD? What benefit is there? When editing HD(V) how do you get an HD monitor out?

I am experimenting with HDV (HC1) prior to getting an HVX and thought it might be better to purchase an NLE that could edit HDV and DVCProHD natively - FCP5 or Avid Xpress Pro HD, I don't want to learn another NLE so I'm not big on FCP, I have used Avid Media Compser on several movies but Avid seems to have a very narrow approved configuration and it appears to be quirky. I like the way AspectHD works in PPro although it consumes considerably more bandwidth.

I was also considering getting the Nvidia FX540 with an analog HD breakout box. Any experiences you can share regarding editing HD with PPro would be greatly appreciated.
 
I have PPro 1.5.1 that comes with the bundled AspectHD, is it worth upgrading to the full version of AspectHD? What benefit is there?
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For starters, PPro 1.5.1 is an HDV patch that includes HDV editing via the cineform codec. This isn't AspectHD at all. If you bought a bundle that includes both PPro 1.5.1 and AspectHD, you've got the full version. You may however, want to check the cineform site for an update if you don't have one. Here are the advantages I find with AspectHD:
- less buggy (the 1.5.1 patch is old. Cineform has corrected a ton of bugs in AspectHD, Adobe is waiting to release PPro 2.0 - probably with a whole new set of bugs)
- HDLink capture utility (also available with ConnectHD) allows me to capture outside of Premiere, with better encoding interface and options (progressive, CF24 pull-down reversal, etc.)
- improved down-conversion/export algorithms (handles fields properly on export)
- copy/paste functionality into After Effects
- real time colour filters and transitions

When editing HD(V) how do you get an HD monitor out?
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I don't have an HD monitor - so it doesn't really concern me. I think you need a video card that supports it.

it might be better to purchase an NLE that could edit HDV and DVCProHD natively
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There's virtually no advantage to editing HDV natively. DVCPRO-HD native editing would be nice (for the first generation anyway)... and I expect the next round of NLE's to support it (i.e., PPro 2.0 et al). The problem right now is that there aren't many readily available DVCPRO-HD codecs out there.

Any experiences you can share regarding editing HD with PPro would be greatly appreciated.
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Well - I don't do a lot of editing, because I haven't had time to shoot many projects. My experiences so far have been varied - from rendering uncompressed files out of After Effects and editing them in PPro 1.0 (PAINFUL), to working with the PPro 1.5.1 patch (BUGGY), to working with AspectHD 3.1 and up (PAINLESS!). Really it's not a whole lot different to me that DV. At any rate, I've shot 60i, CF30 and CF24 projects... and I have been thoroughly satisfied with its performance. At some point they'll pop up online - but due largely to laziness on my part they're lingering on my hard drive (waiting to be wiped out by spontaneous failure?).

It is worth being careful to state though that I don't edit with PPro - I edit with PPro+AspectHD. Saying "HD with PPro" would give FAR too much credit to Adobe - whose solution is frustrating to say the least. The folks at Cineform have been working really hard to update and support their product, and the result is a very capable tool that does as advertised. (This is all unsollicited praise by the way)

-Spiff
 
i dont have a pc.
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I'm completely unfamiliar with Final Cut Pro (or Avid?), but you should be editing CF24 clips in a 23.976 timeline, and reversing the 2:3 pull-down if you want accurate 24p edits. This is exactly the same as editing DVX100 footage shot as 24p (as opposed to 24pA).

Does anyone know if the new FCP supports 2:3 pull-down reversal on HDV footage? This should answer your question.

-Spiff
 
Spiff_2 said:
I'm completely unfamiliar with Final Cut Pro (or Avid?), but you should be editing CF24 clips in a 23.976 timeline, and reversing the 2:3 pull-down if you want accurate 24p edits. This is exactly the same as editing DVX100 footage shot as 24p (as opposed to 24pA).

Does anyone know if the new FCP supports 2:3 pull-down reversal on HDV footage? This should answer your question.

-Spiff
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true but there is no HD 2:3 pull down reversal in final cut, just SD reversal.
 
Do you have any other software that can reverse the pull-down? When I started off I used Adobe After Effects to do this. If you don't have AE, I bet some of the Mac compositing applications can do it too.

Certainly you should be able to do a frame accurate edit on DV down-converted files though.

-Spiff
 
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