Colors change when exporting out of FCP

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Ok, so I know tons of people have had this problem, but I have yet to find the ACTUAL solution.

I am working in FCP 6.0.6
Qucktime 10.0 (90.3.1)
Mac OS x 10.6.2

I am working with footage from the P2 camera HPX500 1080p 23.98

when I export my footage out at ANY setting, YES ANY setting be it prores HQ, h264, mp4, uncompressed... anything... The color changes. Its slightly different for each one. Not one of them being right. the closes is prores hq BUT its still very off. The reds are pink.

I have read over and over and over again reasons why this is happening, but no one has an actual REAL solution to this. Is there anyone who can help me get this right? It's starting to bother me like you wouldn't believe. I purposely have to color correct things wrong and export it tons of times, before the final export matches closely to the colors I want. Its just ridiculous. I know others are doing the same thing I am doing too and haven't found an actual solution.

Is there anyone who can help ?
 
Are you exporting with the "Export using quicktime conversion" option? Or are you using "Export quicktime movie"?

The former has problems for me and will change colors/ contrast. I use the latter to make a master file using current settings, and then export an h.264 from quicktime pro and there is no color shift.
 
Believe it or not, I use both, I have actually sat for hours and exported in just about every way possible, using compressor, using export quicktime movie, using quicktime conversion, they all change the colors in one way or another. Some come out darker, some lighter, I tried just about every codec, they all have their difference, but not one will ACTUALLY match my timeline colors. Yes I am checking everything calibration wise. I have a 1080p monitor as my main video view. and a secondary that has the timeline and all that. I will watch the whole thing, and it looks perfect on my screen. I export it using every single thing, and when I play it back on the same monitor in all the same conditions the colors are off.

I just don't understand it. How can this be such a problem and no one knows how to fix it. By the way are you 100% sure your colors arent changing?

anyone else with an in site to this?
 
Bump: anyone else ever have this problem and solved it, or have a better work around?
 
bigbossbmb said:
are you doing color corrections with a calibrated broadcast monitor?
Click to expand...

yes all of my monitors are calibrated, either way it wouldn't matter if they were or not, because i'm viewing it on the same monitor, not a different one, this isn't a problem with screen to screen, the color's are actually being changed within the same screen. once exported the contrast ratio is changed and the colors either get washed out a bit, or shift in the red channel happens.

I found the closest setting that isn't that much of a difference, but how can this be broadcast quality editing, if my colors aren't matching.

Even with NO color correction added and straight export from the native prores footage, the colors shift.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to make dumps at a different place just to get accurate color.

It's not my video card, because this is happening on 3 different machines with different internal cards.
 
Problem Still Unsolved?

Problem Still Unsolved?

Hello,
I am having the same issues on an FCP 6.0.6 system. Is there a fix, a reason, or does this problem disappear in FCP 7 (I will test this soon and report back)?

Thanks
 
I got the impression that the OP was not using a broadcast monitor and just calibrating computer screens (which isn't good enough to judge color).

If your exports don't look same on a broadcast monitor as your original video, then you have a problem. This isn't a matter of upgrading FCP, you just need to properly view your material with an I/O card and a broadcast display.
 
double check your quicktime settings and make sure you have match to fcp gamma selected, double check your FCP settings and double check your gamma in there too, i set mine to 2.2 because that is broadcast standard. Quicktime isn't a perfect science, your gamma inside of FCP will always be 1.8, no matter what you do where it comes from, you can't trust what you see in your canvas. When you export via quicktime conversion it sets the footage to the gamma that you have your preferences set at.

It's the same thing when you send your footage to apple color, it will look different there but it's actually proper inside of Color and it looks different inside of FCP with the send back because of this exact issue.
 
Okay, I have the same issue. I know it is because the canvas in FCP will always be 1.8 no matter if it is calibrated correctly. So that's the past, same with this guys situation. We have out product ready for out put and it has been graded for delivery.

When we export it, the QT will be a whole step lighter and desaturated a little bit than the image we see in FCP.

Is there any way to make the quicktime file that we output look exactly like what we have in our canvas. The only way I have seen is compensating in compressor setting it to .22 gamma correction.

The exported product's gamma is correct, but it looks a little bit blotchy and desaturated from the FCP Canvas.

So how can we do it any other way with the footage we have?
 
Dillon Novak said:
When we export it, the QT will be a whole step lighter and desaturated a little bit than the image we see in FCP.
Click to expand...

Are you saying that the exported QT on a calibrated computer screen looks different than the image on a calibrated broadcast monitor in FCP/Color? Or are you saying that the QT looks different than your FCP Canvas window?
 
It seems to me that you have gotten it all backward. My understanding is that the canvas image is only a reference image, and contains only a fraction of the original's actual signal quality. It is only representative of your video's "business". It is a reference only signal for editing purposes and was never intended to represent your original image's signal quality.
The only way to evaluate and/or grade your video is by visually referencing to a calibrated broadcast CRT monitor ( not a flat screen monitor). Canvas viewing is totally inaccurate viewing and will never visually match the actual output as seen on an external monitor.
Grading and evaluating should be done with visual reference to the external broadcast monitor, only . . . not by viewing the canvas. At least that's what I understand.
 
Ok to bring up this matter again, not to sound rude, but you guys are clearly not paying attention to what I've said. This is not due to a calibration issue. Its due to compression settings within FCP. Even in color I'll have it set and once exported to a different format, the color shifts slightly or the contrast gets washed.

I've experienced this issue for many years and its always the same answers that are always the wrong answers. I also know TONS of others who have the same issues and post this same question but no one ever has a clear answer only the same response "calibrated monitor".... Its not a calibration issue when you've been viewing on the same monitor.

This is a codec thing for sure, but no one can tell me what the best way to export for the most accurate color... The only way I've been able to retain color to be EXACTLY the same is doing a JPEG2000 export which is well... not even video, its hundreds or thousands of jpeg files you can view as an animated sequence in QT.... Huge folder filled with huge files. NOT something useful for web or downloads.

Does anyone anywhere have the most optimum settings for exporting out of FCP without color loss or shift or gamma issues? All the codecs seem to react differently. MP4 is different than H264 which is different from MOV which is different from PRORES.. they all should be different, but they are all also wrong too. Is there any where posted on the WWW that someone put together the best settings for FCP exporting?

Having the colors change other than having the output from my timeline go directly to an HDCAM deck is ridiculous. I know there are better ways, I just cant find them. Anyone else have an Idea?
 
Giuseppe Pugliese said:
Ok to bring up this matter again, not to sound rude, but you guys are clearly not paying attention to what I've said. This is not due to a calibration issue. Its due to compression settings within FCP. Even in color I'll have it set and once exported to a different format, the color shifts slightly or the contrast gets washed.

I've experienced this issue for many years and its always the same answers that are always the wrong answers. I also know TONS of others who have the same issues and post this same question but no one ever has a clear answer only the same response "calibrated monitor".... Its not a calibration issue when you've been viewing on the same monitor.

This is a codec thing for sure, but no one can tell me what the best way to export for the most accurate color... The only way I've been able to retain color to be EXACTLY the same is doing a JPEG2000 export which is well... not even video, its hundreds or thousands of jpeg files you can view as an animated sequence in QT.... Huge folder filled with huge files. NOT something useful for web or downloads.

Does anyone anywhere have the most optimum settings for exporting out of FCP without color loss or shift or gamma issues? All the codecs seem to react differently. MP4 is different than H264 which is different from MOV which is different from PRORES.. they all should be different, but they are all also wrong too. Is there any where posted on the WWW that someone put together the best settings for FCP exporting?

Having the colors change other than having the output from my timeline go directly to an HDCAM deck is ridiculous. I know there are better ways, I just cant find them. Anyone else have an Idea?
Click to expand...
general information that may help.

if you are not changing the color space, bit depth, gamma. and your not interested in the final look on other computers, tv, projectors, and the monitor your using is not a cheapest off brand you could find, and it's somewhat color accurate (just by looking), and you can actually see a gray scale (just by looking). you never need a "calibrated broadcast monitor" to check a shift in color or contrast from encodes. but the OS gamma and color needs to be close (some video and image formats may use the color space of the OS or monitor)

with that said,
1- when you say you view the footage, you could clarify if it's in the canvas, viewer, or output(full screen) (could be same monitor, other monitor, or tv, broadcast monitor....etc).
2- can you playback the exported video format on something other than quicktime player (another player like vlc and maybe exported dvd and play it back on tv (does not need to be 100% calibrated, just not factory setting) )

maybe it's just the quicktime player, it's really not that good when it comes to color (not to mention the gamma shift problem). or maybe someone played with the color setting in the quicktime player one time and it got stuck like that ever since.
 
Hi Guiseppe, I perfectly know what you´re talking about.
I´ve asked this same question in the past and 99% of people didn´t know what I was talking about and they blame us for not having calibrated screens (stupid answer, because even in an uncalibrated screen, if there is a shift in the gamma or colours or black levels, you can still tell the difference).
The only way I´ve been able to solve it was by using Aja QT 10bit RGB codec. That´s the only codec that seemed to stay the same accross all platforms and software (FCP - AE - Vegas, Mac and PC).

I´ve noticed so many times in post facilities that after some hours of colour grading they go back to FCP to add the sound and export for TV, and when they do so,I can see how the highlights are clipped or the gamma is raised just by converting to prores. And they don´t even see it!
 
Or switch to Avid, Premier or Vegas for complete control of the image. I gave up on FCP for that, even after paying for it.
 
Facts of life for any computer or NLE system in the world:

Transcoding between codecs can effect gamma. Capture footage in a codec, stick to it through the full workflow.

Different applications handle video gamma differently. FCP can be set in preferences to handle color in various ways.

In QuickTime 7 player go to Preference, look at the setting at the very bottom of that window.

A calibrated computer monitor is NOT the same thing as a professional Production Monitor. You will NEVER see the true colors of a video image on a computer monitor, ever, period. If you plan to deliver video to a broadcast facility, and you do not have a professional broadcast monitor, you're in trouble. Personally I run an AJA Kona LHi with a FSI LM-2450W.
 
Hi Guiseppe. This probably won't solve your issue, but one thing I've noticed is that IF I transcode to Prores and grade in Apple COLOR, send it back to FCP and export out of FCP via quicktime conversion (usually h.264), the end result matches *almost* (if not exactly) the color grade I see in the preview monitor when I'm in Apple Color. I just use a computer monitor for grading (I know that's a sin, but I'm producing for the web, and I rely on the scopes more than anything). Does that help?
 
I used to have the same problem. Not anymore. Don't really know why. But i think it has to do with the .mov file itself. Here's my story.

Used to export h.264 as .mov and always had the problem. Then, in Compressor, I changed the file extension from .mov to .mp4 (as per client's requirements) and the shift went away.

It solved my problem anyway. I also don't use FCP's canvas as a means of judging color accuracy anyway. I use Apple Color and an AJA box to an external monitor.
 
I have best luck using the Animation codec. It gives me the best color match and very little (if any) color loss.
 
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