Cheap Redrock M2 copy from India?

Milezee said:
On a side note, cheap labor does not necessarily mean sweat shop. Its not always like that. India can be quite a modern progressive country, just from the outside we tend to stereotype.
Click to expand...

I agree, it doesn't always mean but if multinationals like Nike, Duracell and Microsoft have problems making sure that their suppliers in India are paying a fair wage and are not abusing workers, I would suspect that an unbranded low rent product like this is probably not being built by workers who are getting a fair shake.

I have been there and seen typical factory and sweatshop conditions there and used to work with three guys who were all Indian and educated me on how things work over there, at least in Madras. It would be different if these products were advertised and promoted but the fact that they are no name products showing up on Ebay means that someone is probably knocking these off in a small facility that would be very interesting to see from the outside.

Did not mean to stereotype, I know that there are legitimate and quality products made all over India but I suspect that these video products are probably not made under optimum conditions.

Best,

Dan
 
O.K. I confess it!

--"comming out" mode on --

I lost my nerves and scored one on ebay today (and while at it a Follow Focus)

--"comming out" mode off --

I do a review as soon it arrivers.

:D Frank
 
puredrifting said:
It would be different if these products were advertised and promoted but the fact that they are no name products showing up on Ebay .....
Click to expand...

That´s the point.

You know how much a - let´s say - Matte Box, Railmounts, Follow focus etc usualy are, right?

Why can they charge us $800 or more for a simple plastic lens hood with aluminum flaps and a bit machined metal worth $25?

Why can they charge insane prices for a simple mechanic gizmo like a Follow Focus, wich would cost $15 if it would not be for a camera?

Why do they want us to pay $70 for one simple stainless rods than can be bought at any metall supply for $20?

ahhh you get the point..

I have no problem to pay for quality but I hate to get ripped off.

And I felt ripped off pretty often when I bought "Brand" stuff.

Brand means on a $1000 product you pay

$400 for advertising and commercials
$400 for the name/brand sticker
$200 for material and labour

So you pay $1000 for a $200 Product did you get what you payed for?

Come on, $600 or more for a fist full of gears in a Follow Focus? :angry:

I can buy a 90 deg industry grade gear box wit herdened gears here in Germany for $19. Even with the mount, knob and whatnot 100 Follow Focus boxes can be made for $50 each. So if one makes 50% profit in selleing them they would go over the counter for $75 - and that would be a fair price.

sorry, I don´t want to offend somebody here, but I just had to vent that off.

Frank
 
Last edited:
Guess what happened?

I got a mail from cinecity this morning, regarding my DOF Adapter order and that I stressed to them, that the comunity is waiting for real footage.

"We are working on it. There is one offer for you, if you will send us 3-4 clips for 2-3 minutes of : assembly , how to use and results of this DOF adapter, I will provide you refund for the cost of DOF adapter after receiving the clips "
Click to expand...

Ha! The best things in live are free :D

Frank
 
I bought their VOCAS knock off mattebox. I felt dirty doing it. Got what I paid for. Materials suck: soft aluminum that you can bend into and out of shape, trays that only hold a filter when it's in the mbox but love to fall out when out of the mbox, etc.

Real crap construction. Don't expect anything better with their 35mm Adaptor.

Tim
 
Indian Epain seller

Indian Epain seller

I had a good look at this indian powerseller and am not surprised some buyers had a bad experience:
if you look at his epain shop he says:We are an eBay Powerseller with a 99.9% positive feedback rating.
We have thousands of satisfied eBay customers.

but he has only 299 positive feedbacks ! where are the thousands ? he only has 299!

So for starters: they cant count!

in this german forum you can read of 2 buyers that actually bought and were sent typically indian quality **** !

http://www.hackermovies.com/83950/N.../10127//?sid=2e1cb4afd0bf15db7dc95c2ccbf436d8

one buyer says : the lens has 2 scratches, the motor doesnt work, the rods or the holes were not round, a cable was loose the whole thing was typical epain crap and you got what you paid for.

One has to say its a marvel this is not the typical epain fraud and somebody in Chennai actually send a parcel but the content is as usual the typical epain experience!
 
I worked in India for about 3 months. I oversaw an animation team in Chennai...

...India has tremendous potential, but their culture doesn't understand nor value quality yet.

- I've been in Indian offset print companies that spent millions on Heidelberg presses and yet they didn't understand the point of using a loop to make sure the colors were printing in proper alignment.

- Animators would SWEAR to you they were capable of doing Pixar quality work, and yet they didn't understand the fundamentals of animation. They only understood how to use the software.

- The heads of animation studios would scream from the rooftops about their dedication to quality. And yet, they wouldn't dedicate any time to development or pre-production. They'd also swear to you they believed in a healthy work environment...and the bathrooms would be filthy and the smell of dead rats in the ceiling would permeate the office for weeks.

- I had hats, t-shirts and posters manufactured for a TV series I was developing. Often, the merchant would show up with an amazing sample but not be willing to manufacture my item to the same standards of the sample. Everything was rush-rush-rush.

India, as a business culture, values our Western currency but not our Western standards. Their VERY best is in our bottom 25%

Will this change? Sure...some day. When I'm very old. When the NRI's (Non Resident Indians) move back to India and educate the 1.5 billion citizens that if they want to be true global players they have to meet the highest standards in the world. Or, when enough Western-owned corporations make everything there.

Its just like China and Mexico. If it is a Western-owned company with Western managers (Australia, America, Canada, Great Britain, etc) then buy from them. If it is local, forget it...they don't mean to screw us, but they can't help themselves. Their owner doesn't see the upside in high standards. To them, meeting our standards of quality is simply lost profits.

Don't buy from this company. The low prices are awfully tempting, but overall this country has huge blind spots about Western quality manufacturing, service and entrepreneurship.
 
At least they send you the money back in no time if you are not satisfied.

I mailed them because the scratched lens and motor.
I got the money back in half an hour. No questions asked, lot´s of appologies.

Im quite happy with the indian made Follow Focus and Mattebox.
The Adapter is almost an 1:1 copy of the Redrock.
But the GG is crap.

I posted some grabs: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=121326

Frank
 
Hello Frank,

I totally agree with what you say about film equipment being totally overpriced!

You say you are "quite happy with the indian made Follow Focus and Mattebox."

I am considering buying an Indi(an)-Follow Focus. How good is it? Does it have much play? Is it well built? Could you please describe it a little bit more?

"There is a guy in Germany that makes a promising 35mm adapter.
http://www.jetsetmodels.info/adapter.htm
But for some reason he is not selling them in Germany."

I guess this is because P+S have a patent which is valid only in Germany. I have read that Redrock (and probably also the other adapter manufacturers) ship anywhere in the world EXCEPT Germany.

Greetings,

Atilio.
 
Der FF ist O.K.
Er hat ein bisschen Spiel, aber mein Focus Puller hat meistens mehr ;-)
Ist nicht der Rede wert.

Ansonsten ist er mit dem Indiefocus oder dem von Cavision quasi identisch.
Die Zahnräder sind sehr breit, was ein echter Vorteil ist, wenn du Objektive hast die beim Scharfstellen vor-und zurück gleiten. Die Zähne und der Anschluss für die Verlängerung sind Industrie Standard, d.h. es passt auch alles von anderen Herstellern.


Selbst die indischen Teile sind immer noch zu teuer für das was es ist,
aber die beste Alternative zum selberbasteln.

Ich habe gehört, daß die Stadycam recht ordentlich ist.
Wenn ich wieder mal 800 Euro übrig habe bestell ich eine.

Ja ja, hier regen sich alle furchtbar auf das die Inder irgendwelche Patente ihrer geliebten Hersteller verletzen, aber gerade Redrock hat da selbst Dreck am Stecken - kümmert aber irgendwie keinen.

Ahh was solls.

Ich hab den indischen Adapter mit einer anderen Scheibe ausgestattet, seit dem kann man damit arbeiten, ich bau aber gerade einen eigenen mit ner statischen Faseroptik Scheibe.

Beste Grüße aus dem sonnigen Bayern,

Frank
 
Danke für die schnelle Antwort!
Ich werde mir den indischen FF holen. Der könnte natürlich noch günstiger sein aber was solls.
Ich habe mir letztes Jahr ein Windjammer bestellt (bei dvshop23). Er wurde extrem schnell geliefert und ist mehr als ok für den Preis.
Das mit der statischen Faseroptik Scheibe klingt sehr interessant, ich bin gespannt...
Viele Grüße aus Berlin,
Atilio.
 
timbook2 said:
I had a good look at this indian powerseller and am not surprised some buyers had a bad experience:
if you look at his epain shop he says:We are an eBay Powerseller with a 99.9% positive feedback rating.
We have thousands of satisfied eBay customers.

but he has only 299 positive feedbacks ! where are the thousands ? he only has 299!

So for starters: they cant count!

in this german forum you can read of 2 buyers that actually bought and were sent typically indian quality shi* !

http://www.hackermovies.com/83950/N.../10127//?sid=2e1cb4afd0bf15db7dc95c2ccbf436d8

one buyer says : the lens has 2 scratches, the motor doesnt work, the rods or the holes were not round, a cable was loose the whole thing was typical epain crap and you got what you paid for.

One has to say its a marvel this is not the typical epain fraud and somebody in Chennai actually send a parcel but the content is as usual the typical epain experience!
Click to expand...

For the majority of the post in here, I agree. "You get what you pay for". Due to my budget I didn't go with a Chrosziel matte box, follow focus, and Zacuto rail system. Instead, I went with a much cheaper version. I won't give names but they're not from third country. In fact, they're in the North America hemisphere.


The side flaps/wings and French flag were all plastic with all the screws very loose. And it is hard to tighten the screws because if I use enough force it might just "screwed" up the thread. So when I use my matte box, the two side wings is flapping in all direction. And yes, the French flag cannot tilt up or down due to the inflexible of the latch that locks on the French flag.

As for the rail system, it is NOT a one snap or quick release system. If I want to adjust any thing on the rail system such as the riser or the plate that goes between the Bogen tripod head plate and the rail rods, I have to use a certain Allen key to loosen it. After I loosen the screws, I still have to use a hammer of some sort to pound on the plate to loosen the grip so it becomes apart and then I can move the plate to a different location on the rods.

As for the follow focus, that white round thing that you mark the focus on, well, it was a piece of white plastic that is not well cut. It's not perfectly round. Anyone look at it and can see that it was not done professionally. And the speed crank, well, that was a joke. I thought it was one of those professionally well design speed crank. As it turns out, it's a combination of one Allen key, plastic ball, wrench socket, and some hot glue.

I'm not disappointed or regret that what I purchased are not top of the line or close to professional quality. However, I want to stress the point that what I paid for is what I got. I wish have more money so I can buy better ones but don't we all are.

Anyway, I'm using Chrosziel as an example but I've never seen a Chrosziel set so I'm not sure if it is top of the line or professionally well designed.

Just my two cents.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top