cease and desist...from a competitor

grinner

grinner

Carbonite Member
Seriously. Been at this for many years and have nevr heard of such a thing.
I recently went with a group of paranormal inverstigators and spent the night in a building well known for paranormal activity. I was doing it as a thrill-seeking vidiot at the time but it was cool enough I now am gonna start a new tv series called Disbeliever. The pilot, if you will, turned out awesome and I sent it to the owner of the hotel via email as a thank you for being so cool to us.
Well yesterday I get this email in legal jargain babbling about ceasing and desisting production and distribution. I called my boy the hotel owner who said he got the same email from "legal" and just wanted to make sure I'm doing nothing with my footage.
I researched the sender of the email, only to find she is a phycic who charges for her services, has a production team that follows her around, is starting a new show, stayed at his haunted hotel last November and was simply claiming, or attempting to claim exlusivity.
whaaaaaat?
I think I've seen it all now.
I'm gonna call the other editors in town and tell em to cut it out.
lol
 
See if she really is a psychic, and ask if she can read your mind for the answer... which should be "Step off B*tch! I want my TAPS money just like everyone else!"
 
Send her back a de-ceased letter. Duh!

Seriously, if someone tried to sideline my production I'd have my attorneys tare them apart.

It's illegal to practice law without a license so if this was not sent by an attorney on her behalf she could be in some serious trouble.
 
She's making lot's of friends in the business, NOT! I'm working on a project that there are similar other type projects going on (wasn't the first and won't be the last one to do this) but all our crews are friends with each other and everyone helps everyone out.

This is going to 'Haunt' her. Duh!
 
They are not worth sickin the pitbulls on. I have to pick my scraps at my age and this aint gonna be one of em. I just responded letting her know any other contact from her or the company she represents will be considered harrassment and responded to accordingly.
I won't hear from her again.
You'd think being a great phycic, she would have seen that coming.
Hotel boy actually tried to shake me down for money. wtf? lol
He was all "I didn't sign any release so you have no rights to that footage." so I was like "I just need a release for your likeness. I'll blur your face, call ya a ***** and youtube it."
then he was all like "nuuu uuuhh, you don't have permission to use footage from the building!" so I laughed and with "ever see the news ask the burning building for permission? Buildings can't sue people. I was on private property with your written permission."
he hung on me for some reason.

lol
man this is gonna make an awesome follow up episode.
 
I know a girl in KC who was an AP (maybe a co-producer, I forgot) on a haunted tv series, I think it was a haunted prison actually. She's a sharp gal with lots of experience, PM me if you'd like her info. She's within a 3 hour drive from you.
 
Ummm, grinner, you might want to tread a little more carefully where the hotel is concerned.

While the psychic nutjob doesn't have a leg to stand on, did your "written permission" from the hotel specify filming and distributing footage of their private property? Or was it just permission to be on the premises?

Is "hotel boy" the actual owner of the property, or just the manager?

To be honest, your attitude in your most recent post doesn't paint your attitude as being much better than the psychic whacko.

Just my .02c worth.
 
I'm not sure on the location releases if a manager can sign them or if the property owner has too but it's something I need to find out soon.
 
He's the owner and I had him sign nothing at all. Wasn't going there to make a tv show the first time I went out. We just responded to his ad on craigslist welcoming parties (we paid the first night there) and welcoming video cameras. He walked us in with more than 7 recording devices. A week later when we had found something on tape, he let us in again to shoot for another night. He simply saw dollar signs after seeing the pilot I made night one.
I'd have to blur out his likeness if I thought I could air this pilot but I've been at this a long time and have never had a show pilot air. I don't need a release for me to pitch this as a demo and I don't need a release to air footage of a building, private property or not.
Physco chick was just mad because my company turned around a finished episode in 4 days and hers couldn't in 4 months.
I'm finishing up episode 2 today. While we won't be going back to the hotel that haunts weeks after the fact, I already have pitches in the works with networks for a new series. This pebble in the road alters no course for me.
 
grinner said:
He's the owner and I had him sign nothing at all. Wasn't going there to make a tv show the first time I went out. We just responded to his ad on craigslist welcoming parties (we paid the first night there) and welcoming video cameras. He walked us in with more than 7 recording devices. A week later when we had found something on tape, he let us in again to shoot for another night. He simply saw dollar signs after seeing the pilot I made night one.
I'd have to blur out his likeness if I thought I could air this pilot but I've been at this a long time and have never had a show pilot air. I don't need a release for me to pitch this as a demo and I don't need a release to air footage of a building, private property or not.
Physco chick was just mad because my company turned around a finished episode in 4 days and hers couldn't in 4 months.
I'm finishing up episode 2 today. While we won't be going back to the hotel that haunts weeks after the fact, I already have pitches in the works with networks for a new series. This pebble in the road alters no course for me.
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I'd still be careful about using footage of the hotel premisis. If what you shot is visible to the general passerby from a public place you should be okay but if you shot from within the private property out of sight of general public view, you very likely are going to need a property release to use any of the footage. Permission for commercial use of the footage is quite separate and distinct from permission merely to enter the premisis and as Judge Judy frequently likes to point out, you're not a mind reader and can't assume what was in the mind of the hotel owner at the time, you can't base a defense on the notion that "He knew that we might use the footage in a pilot when he allowed us in with our camera." If the explicit permission ain't in writing, it doesn't exist.
 
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All this would matter if this footage were to be aired. As I stated to him and here, it's a pilot. It's the demo that will sell the series...at which time we will start to shoot the series that will air.
Had I just stolled through with my miniDV camera like the rest of the people he charges to walk though there, I would not have heard from him. When he saw production value, he saw dollar signs and changed in an instant.
 
grinner said:
All this would matter if this footage were to be aired. As I stated to him and here, it's a pilot. It's the demo that will sell the series...at which time we will start to shoot the series that will air.
Had I just stolled through with my miniDV camera like the rest of the people he charges to walk though there, I would not have heard from him. When he saw production value, he saw dollar signs and changed in an instant.
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Thing is, if he sues, can you afford to defend? Like you said, visions of dollar signs are dancing in his head. Releases only help you if they're needed to mount a defense as well, true enough, and he can sue even if he signed one, but if one exists he may have a harder time finding a lawyer to handle the case if he wants to go for your gold. Not much you can do about it now but next time ....
 
I'd not spend time or money defending it. I'd just go shoot elsewhere, which is what I am doing now.
I have found that rolling in the mud with pigs makes one muddy and smelling like pig.
Bottom line is if he did not want cameras in his place, he'd not have a public ad inviting them.
I see this as a fly trap and I aint playin'. I'd sooner drive back out to Morse Mill and settle it old school style than show up in court spending money.
 
grinner said:
I'd not spend time or money defending it. I'd just go shoot elsewhere, which is what I am doing now.
I have found that rolling in the mud with pigs makes one muddy and smelling like pig.
Bottom line is if he did not want cameras in his place, he'd not have a public ad inviting them.
I see this as a fly trap and I aint playin'. I'd sooner drive back out to Morse Mill and settle it old school style than show up in court spending money.
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If a process server shows up on your door with a subpoena, you don't really have a choice in defending it (unless you just bite the bullet and pay up, of course). Old school style would just land you in the pokey. You need to make nice with the guy. But as far as the "psychic," no way! Not only doies she not have any legal basis for complaint. I have no patience with charlatans.
 
I have an LLC and I keep less than 40 bucks in my business account. If he sues me, yes, I'll just give it all to him.
lol
I'll not hear from em again. I scared her away quick and he's on to his next scam by now.
 
grinner said:
I have an LLC and I keep less than 40 bucks in my business account. If he sues me, yes, I'll just give it all to him.
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Love it!

Maybe you could barter with a quick-cut commercial for hotel guy to help him with local advertising? No money out of pocket besides tape that he can take to the local tv station if he signs away the rights. You already know the footage like the back of your hand, might only take an hour to process. Play down any success you may receive.

If not, screw him and just do a re-enactment with sock puppets. Okay this part is actually for me. I've wanted to do this on several occasions.
 
grinner said:
I have an LLC and I keep less than 40 bucks in my business account. If he sues me, yes, I'll just give it all to him.
lol
I'll not hear from em again. I scared her away quick and he's on to his next scam by now.
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Uhhhh - it's been known to happen that the sheriff siezes and auctions off the business's assets to settle a damage award. You $40 in the bank is only the tip of the iceberg and a LLC most likely won't shield you very well. How much do you like/need your camera?

Not disagreeing at all with your reactions to the jerk - I'm on your side here - just trying to caution against exposing yourself to further risk. Figuring out a way to make nice is likely to be a safer course of action.
 
You may be more worried than I am.
I've moved on to being entertained and complimented by it.
My camera was only worth 5k new and has lots of miles on it. My Avid sucks donkie balls and he'd be doing me a favor by inspiring me to buy a new FCP suite.
There will be no losers in this.
 
Steve... I have to agree with everything you've said. Most people don't realize they're treading on thin ice without proper releases. Besides, you'll never get distribution or a TV pick-up without them. Those people all have legal depts. that demand it for all the reasons you've outlined. On Grinner's side... I too like to make myself as judgment proof as possible. Well, at least I'm doing it on purpose... LOL... not by happenstance.
 
of course, releases are a requirement when airing footage with likenesses. I was not showing up that first night to create a tv show... just to have fun. It was the footage and the fun that lead me to the evolution of the project. I don't need a release to use this as a demo and to pitch a new series and I'm not fool enough to think networks air sizzle reels. They show will be picked up and then we'll begin official production of it.
Hotel boy was not interested in protected his privacy. He was simply trying to shake me down for money.
Ironicly, this made him look like quite the tool in the ole sizzle reel last night.
lol
 
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