Canon's Upcoming RF cinema camera rumored specs
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Angry Leprechaun
Well-known member
So the person who gave me the heads up about the Canon focal reducer and the vertical shooting mode also confirmed the price is $5299. Don’t know how much the focal reducer is though.
QuickHitRecord
Veteran
You sound almost disappointed. The fact that Canon included the new DPAF of the R5 (though, I think they are calling it DPAF2 on that camera) makes it very hard not to buy this camera as a Canon shooter. Which of course will result in a lot of time and expense and hassle.
On the other hand, this will probably drive down price of used C200s, which is another potential route.
NorBro
Major Contributor
haha, I'm only disappointed that Panasonic and Fujifilm are not allowed to have good AF.
The C70 sounds awesome for anyone looking for a new system. But good DPAF should have been implemented into the cinema cameras years ago. If I owned a C300 or C500, I wouldn't be happy, quite frankly.
But we all know how it works by now...incremental updates every few months.
The C70 sounds awesome for anyone looking for a new system. But good DPAF should have been implemented into the cinema cameras years ago. If I owned a C300 or C500, I wouldn't be happy, quite frankly.
But we all know how it works by now...incremental updates every few months.
NorBro
Major Contributor
If the ND filter is $399, it's probably at least that but I'm guessing more, like $599+.
I agree. No way the focal reducer is less than $599. It says in the release that its only compatible with certain ef zoom lenses. I wonder what that means for other ef lenses like the EF 14mm 2.8L II. Hopefully it can still control aperture on lenses that aren't supported yet. Maybe focus is not as reliable. We will find out soon!
I know it’s a popular idea all the Japanese companies cooperate in lockstep but that doesn’t jibe with what I’ve seen. Back in the day when I worked NAB every year I got to know a number of the people who worked with the various camera companies and I definitely got the sense that Sony and Canon hated each other.
In particular it seemed that more than anything, Sony wanted Canon to fail. From the way their employees talked was like they were in a slow motion knife fight to the death.
I got this impression from multiple conversations over many years not only at NAB but at film festivals and award shows. Of course these were employees from both companies’ US headquarters and never met anyone from Japan but from my vantage point it looked they were trying to bury each other. Instead of you get this feature and I'll get the next one it was more like, "Die, Die, Die!"
NorBro
Major Contributor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keiretsu
A keiretsu (Japanese: 系列, literally system, series, grouping of enterprises, order of succession) is a set of companies with interlocking business relationships and shareholdings. In the legal sense, it is a type of informal business group that are loosely organized alliances within the social world of Japan's business community. The keiretsu maintained dominance over the Japanese economy for the second half of the 20th century, and, to a lesser extent, continues to do so in the early 21st century.
The member's companies own small portions of the shares in each other's companies, centered on a core bank; this system helps insulate each company from stock market fluctuations and takeover attempts, thus enabling long-term planning in projects. It is a key element of the manufacturing industry in Japan.
NorBro
Major Contributor
From your vantage point, it very well could have been that way (if you're reading everyone correctly), but the Americans are only hired to play the part.
The system is in place to grow Japan's wealth, not America's (or anyone else's).
They can call it whatever they want but every country has the same goal [$$$] and it's accomplished in one way or another.
The system is in place to grow Japan's wealth, not America's (or anyone else's).
They can call it whatever they want but every country has the same goal [$$$] and it's accomplished in one way or another.
That’s a really tough question. I had a couple of C200s and now shoot on the C300III. Personally if I could have chosen either DGO or CRL to CFexpress on the C70, I would have taken the latter. Raw takes more time and storage, but if you’re comfortable with that it’s hard to give it up.
The DGO sensor makes a huge difference to noise, especially in the shadows. But if you are comfortable with the noise signature of the C200 or use quality noise reduction like Neat Video, I think having CRL makes a bigger difference to overall image quality.
Yes, I am familiar with construct. I just haven't seen any evidence that it explains the Canon/Sony situation. Just because there is cooperation within a keiretsu doesn't mean all the keiretsu are cooperating with each other.
Obviously there is some cooperation especially between Sony and Panasonic, but I've never gotten a "we're all one big happy family" vibe when talking to Canon and Sony employees.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/inno...merates-dominate-japanese-industry-180960356/
NorBro
Major Contributor
You haven't see any evidence?
Have you followed any cameras in the past 10 years? lol
I recommend not forming business opinions based on a "vibe" you've felt at a trade-show. Why would they be a happy family? They are supposed to be ruthless competitors.
I don't want to turn the conversation about this because people are excited about the C70.
But shenanigans exist. Without a shadow of a doubt. And you (anyone) would be extremely naive to not believe in it in 2020 after witnessing years and years of feature limitations, especially this year.
Have you followed any cameras in the past 10 years? lol
I recommend not forming business opinions based on a "vibe" you've felt at a trade-show. Why would they be a happy family? They are supposed to be ruthless competitors.
I don't want to turn the conversation about this because people are excited about the C70.
But shenanigans exist. Without a shadow of a doubt. And you (anyone) would be extremely naive to not believe in it in 2020 after witnessing years and years of feature limitations, especially this year.
QuickHitRecord
Veteran
Another angle.
morgan_moore
Major Contributor
https://www.canonrumors.com/here-is-the-canon-cinema-eos-c70-2/
Dont know what I think. I think it is the camera I most want.. until the Fx6.
Is the ND a pay for extra! ? I think the camera and the speedbooster (and ND) will not be cheap.
Dont know what I think. I think it is the camera I most want.. until the Fx6.
Is the ND a pay for extra! ? I think the camera and the speedbooster (and ND) will not be cheap.
The ND filters (2-10 stops) are internal. This is why there is a mention of a new thinner ND module (to fit in the mirrorless RF mount as previous EOS cinema cameras with internal ND had EF mounts with much more space between the mount and sensor). From the release announcement:
"Furthermore, a new, thinner ND filter system gives up to 10-stops of ND filtration ... The ND filter is designed to fit into the 20mm flange back RF system. Motorised variable ND filter (2/4/6/8*/10* stop)."
The way the typical EF to RF adapters work is that the RF mount has some additional communication contacts that are not really used by EF lenses. But the camera actually communicates through the adapter using the native EF lens protocol. So autofocus, aperture control, etc. all work pretty much as expected.
The wrinkle that the 0.71x focal reducer adapter introduces is that the effective f-stop changes, so if the adapter just passes through the standard aperture information (as an adapter without glass would) then when the lens is at an f/2.8 aperture the exposure level on the camera would be more like a f/2.0. Additionally, the lens corrections for vignetting, distortion, aberrations need to be different when the focal reducer adapter is in place. For example, with a simple pass-through EF to RF adapter and full frame lens on a Super 35 sensor, probably no vignetting compensation is needed in most cases since any falloff would be outside the imaging area. But the focal reducer adapter would bring any vignetting falloff back over the sensor area, which the camera would have to correct for (if lens corrections are enabled).
From the release announcement, it sounds like it is these features like in-camera lens corrections that will only work with 3 EF lenses at launch time (EF 16-35 f/2.8 III, 24-70 f/2.8 II, and 24-105 f/4 II). I believe other EF lenses will still work with the adapter, they just won't be considered full-function so lens corrections won't work:
"Full-function lenses can communicate various information with the EOS C70. The following three lenses are full supported without a firmware update: EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III USM, EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II USM, EF 24-105mm f/4L IS II USM. Lenses other than full-function lenses can also shoot with a brighter f-number with an equivalent angle of view as full frame. We will continue to expand the range of full-function lenses by gradually upgrading the firmware."
I believe the existing Metabones EF to RF adapter doesn't support lens correction information at all.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
I wonder if C70 AF will be as good as R5. It doesn't say "DPAF II" anywhere but it does say it inherited intelligent tracking from the R5. I also wonder what the exact weight is
Also, there's no way it can shoot 4K vertically in the horizontal position
But yeah I'm definitely intrigued. Need to see price and footage. I'll probably stick with the A7SIII because it's probably better for my Ronin-S. Not to mention matching/marketing with my FS7. But C300III footage looks nice.
I'm pretty confused about how it can record 4K120p All-I to SD cards. Not that All-I or 120p matter THAT much to me, but these details are probably fuzzy and it probably doesn't shoot 4K120p all-I xf-avc.
Also, there's no way it can shoot 4K vertically in the horizontal position
But yeah I'm definitely intrigued. Need to see price and footage. I'll probably stick with the A7SIII because it's probably better for my Ronin-S. Not to mention matching/marketing with my FS7. But C300III footage looks nice.
I'm pretty confused about how it can record 4K120p All-I to SD cards. Not that All-I or 120p matter THAT much to me, but these details are probably fuzzy and it probably doesn't shoot 4K120p all-I xf-avc.
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