Why the sudden interest in skin tones? The claim for removing the OLPF on the 5D3 is that it improves resolution. The fact that none of those who have hacked their cameras bothered to try any comparative before/after shots to confirm/deny the effectiveness of their surgery means that the few clips that we have seen are worthless for evaluation. Shooting resolution charts is the perfect & only way of proving that removing the OLPF actually improves resolution & does it without introducing unwanted moire &/or aliasing. Just try a bit of scientific testing & then we can worry about the skin tones.
Canon 5d mark iii improved- olpf removed for higher resolution
- Thread starter PappasArts
- Start date
Emanuel
Cross-Examiner
Skin tones talk has nothing to do with OLPF removal, only about charts' limits. Barry even said what I actually was already expecting that he had some wabbit ready for : ) with my answer on the multiple variables impossible to mimic. Also advanced by Barry BTW. Something I've always liked in Barry. He is very intelligent poster/tester once he knows very well the pros and cons of anything he is called to evaluate or pronounce about. And even if we can be more or less with his opinion, there's always some kind of common territory in-between. A true is often relative. It is about the pertinence of this relativeness where the skin tones came up to the discussion.
Not necessarily but it's bound to start an argument or something. In response, however, I would say that I personally only want it to be somewhere in the ballpark of "it that shall not be named in any other sub forum but its own", that would probably get me to convince the powers that be to buy one and remove the OLPF.
The Full Frame look is still the full frame look, unique and interesting. The lowlight is obviously pretty killer and the DR, to my eyes, is where I'd like "it that shall not be named in any other sub forum but its own" to be.
A minor trade of in resolved detail isn't an issue. With the OLPF in (as far as I've seen, even though there aren't any technical tests done) it's not minor, it's major to my eyes and a complete turn off.
Lammy
Well-known member
Yup- agreed with the pro's of the 5D3 for sure.
I honestly don't see that major a change without the OLPF as I do with OLPF(+ sharpening or with anamorphic lenses whatnot). I do see it's slightly sharper but at what expense?
Now just waiting to see more tests without the OLPF and the pros/cons
I honestly don't see that major a change without the OLPF as I do with OLPF(+ sharpening or with anamorphic lenses whatnot). I do see it's slightly sharper but at what expense?
Now just waiting to see more tests without the OLPF and the pros/cons
gonzo_entertainment
Veteran
"it that shall not be in any other sub forum but its own"
Ha!
Ha!
No, I have an iPhone 4S and the video quality is nice for a phone however the quality is not even as good as the Mark II, especially when there is significant motion. What is cool is being able to shoot and edit right on the phone and legally include copyrighted music and upload to youtube: http://youtu.be/vmzVAU5lsVE?hd=1. A line chart test for the iPhone 4S might be entertaining, but it's not a tool I would consider for shooting a movie when I have access to better tools. Nokia has some interesting tech: http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13970_7-57386706-78/the-secret-behind-nokias-41-megapixel-camera-phone/, though you won't see many folks shooting movies with it (at least one feature film was done on a Nokia cell phone, so the marketing advantage of being first is gone (and they had to massively rig up the phone and make work with additional lenses, etc.). Like others have stated- shoot with what you have; getting it done is more important than than the tools.
Regarding no-OLPF compared to post-sharpening: I was able to get very close, but not quite match no-OLPF with post processing (working with James' test images). That said, after post-processing, the 5D3 quality is sharp enough, even at 24mm with a FaderND gen 1: https://vimeo.com/40200361 (IPB + post sharpening and processing).
If resolution charts show no-OLPF doing 1000+ horizontal lines and no significant moire and aliasing (or similar performance to the C300, which has aliasing and moire in certain conditions), I might consider the maxmax.com conversion (which removes both OLPFs, adds optical glass and transplants the dust cleaning system).
If resolution charts show no-OLPF doing 1000+ horizontal lines and no significant moire and aliasing (or similar performance to the C300, which has aliasing and moire in certain conditions), I might consider the maxmax.com conversion (which removes both OLPFs, adds optical glass and transplants the dust cleaning system).
Cosimo Bullo
Veteran
It did for sure in James once he got the field order correct in the NLE. I downloaded both and it was like removing a film from the monitor... unfortunately that was after the buzz had passed, and I'm not sure how many people actually took the time to look at the corrected version.
PappasArts
Veteran
Well you could get the JVC4K for 1000 plus lines. This of course after downscale.
I posted a res chart 4K>2K frame grab from a 4K file uploaded video. More here: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?279914-JVC-4K-Camera-GY-HMQ10-Videos-amp-Info
It's not near perfect, however we should be throwing JVC a bone though, to encourage them to be in this game. Better then throwing money at unknown out of the blue "hipsters" with near zero resources compared to companies like JVC etc.
Holy Christ, I think I just went on a evangelical rant. Sorry. Back on topic.....
So when is Andrew at eoshd going to show some video? I would have thought since he is the only one known, aside from Miller to remove the OLPF in the world, he would jump on that.
Pappas
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Cosimo Bullo
Veteran
I think he may be doing a test with the GH2, 5d3 and the FS-700 as we speak.
Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
Charts don't tell you the whole story, I absolutely agree, but, for me, in terms of resolution and moire/aliasing, when I look at where the 7D and where the FS100 sit on the chart, I can use that to understand how other cameras might respond given the point where I start to see the aliasing. For instance, if the 5Dm3 showed aliasing at around the same point as the FS100, then I'd be absolutely fine with it. I also want to see it because I want to see if I want to replace my 7D with it possibly. Or, if the 7Dm2 that eventually comes, if it's similar to the 5dm3, then I'd consider removing the OLPF as well if this is the possible outcome.
I just don't know either way. I'm more curious than anything else. Given how much complaining (and I am one of those people) that people did about moire on the older Canon cameras, maybe Canon wanted to MAKE SURE it was GONE! A stronger OLPF can do that at the sacrifice of resolution. You can definitely apply sharpening in post, and I think there is NOTHING wrong with that, but, at the same time, things that are actually as soft in the scene as the resolution that was captured are going to get sharpened as well, so it's not like it's a perfect recreation of what the camera would have seen if it could have seen the full resolution to begin with. However, given all my cameras have sharpening turned on, it's not like I don't already see this anyways
And I don't think it looks bad myself, but then I wonder, how often have I seen FULL resolution that was not achieved by sharpening....I might now have.
I just don't know either way. I'm more curious than anything else. Given how much complaining (and I am one of those people) that people did about moire on the older Canon cameras, maybe Canon wanted to MAKE SURE it was GONE! A stronger OLPF can do that at the sacrifice of resolution. You can definitely apply sharpening in post, and I think there is NOTHING wrong with that, but, at the same time, things that are actually as soft in the scene as the resolution that was captured are going to get sharpened as well, so it's not like it's a perfect recreation of what the camera would have seen if it could have seen the full resolution to begin with. However, given all my cameras have sharpening turned on, it's not like I don't already see this anyways
And I don't think it looks bad myself, but then I wonder, how often have I seen FULL resolution that was not achieved by sharpening....I might now have.Cosimo Bullo
Veteran
Rick, you remain the most reasonable person on this forum. Good points all.
PappasArts
Veteran
My 5D3 is currently at MaxMax getting the upgrade, they have had it since early last week. We'll see what happens. I have not heard from them concerning when I might get the camera back, hopefully this week.
I also have the C300 so I will be able to see how these 2 might compare.
Bill
I also have the C300 so I will be able to see how these 2 might compare.
Bill
You are brave to spend all that money voiding your warranty when the evidence for the effectiveness of removing the OLPF for improving video quality is about as strong as that for improving the sound quality of CDs with a green marker pen.
nigel
Why do you care?
But since you asked, I'm curious and I like what I see from Mr.Miller's efforts in this area. Contrary to what most people are saying about sharpening in post, I am not that happy with the overall look once I've sharpened footage. Just looking for a different path.
However, people's efforts to wring something out of their gear should not elicit anger from folks who don't find it to their tastes. I guess, I think it's interesting to see what might might be inside this camera. Which might be why any of us continue to use a still camera to produce video, not the best tool in the bag, but it's interesting that it can do what it does.
Why do you care?
But since you asked, I'm curious and I like what I see from Mr.Miller's efforts in this area. Contrary to what most people are saying about sharpening in post, I am not that happy with the overall look once I've sharpened footage. Just looking for a different path.
However, people's efforts to wring something out of their gear should not elicit anger from folks who don't find it to their tastes. I guess, I think it's interesting to see what might might be inside this camera. Which might be why any of us continue to use a still camera to produce video, not the best tool in the bag, but it's interesting that it can do what it does.
Jordi Luque
New member
Hi 3 hats! Are you going to remove 2 olpf? or only external (vertical blur)? tnx!