Camera / grading tips to make digital look organic / film like

[Stab]

I am using digital camera's like Canon DSLR's and now a new GH3 to make corporate stuff and the look I put out lately is actually very suitable for that kind of work.

But soon I will shoot one of my first short films, and I want it to look more cinematic. 'Film like' so to say, although that is not the correct word as the Alexa or the BMCC can put out a 'film like' image to me as well. Even the DSLR's, like the GH3, should be capable of it, because Philip Bloom's 'Genesis' has the look also.

So what is it, besides the obvious framing and scenery, that makes it look organic and film like. Because most digital stuff that comes out of these camera's dont look like it.
Is it the color grading? Low contrast, saturation settings?

What tips can you give, besides the obvious 24p / 1/50th shutter speed, framing, camera movements, to make digital images look more like 'the film'

 

[hscully]

I think the most important aspect to creating a cinematic look is great lighting. Creating light that is sourced and expressive of the intention of the scenes, along with great framing is the best way to create a cinematic feel to your short.

There's a lot more to it. Knowing how to cover a scene so it will cut is so important. Choosing the right lens for focal length, FOV and DOF also makes a big difference in the quality of your shots and how they express the moment you're depicting. Look at what you like about the cinematography you admire and learn how they light and frame and move the camera to tell the story visually.

If I had to say the one thing. I would say lighting. I think it's much more about technique than camera.

 

[jax_rox]

Lighting and production design.

I'd also disagree that the BMCC has it. The BMCC still looks digital to me, the Alexa on the other hand looks like a really clean film stock. The Alexa apparently employs a 1/4 Classic Soft over its sensor, but I couldn't tell you with great certainty if that's rumour or fact. Classic Soft filters do like nice and help in taking that hard 'edge' off digital.

 

[morgan_moore]

I think, whatever you read, film has waaaay more DR than 'affordable' digital

So light light light - fill light to reduce scene DR will make digital one step closer to film..

S

 

[Bruce Watson]

So what is it, besides the obvious framing and scenery, that makes it look organic and film like?

Lighting, art direction, good sound (surprising how good sound effects the look of a film, but it does), a DP who knows how to use and move a camera,.... I'm just sayin', there's a reason it takes 100s of people to build a "Hollywood Film".

 

[kennedymax]

What everybody has said. The camera is but one of the tools used in production . . . . lens, camera support, sound, lighting instruments, props, set design, wardrobe, art direction, acting, etc. All are equally important in producing an acceptable show. And their use is subjective. One must have a refined vision of the production in order to manipulate the variables for a successful product.
Also, what doe organic mean . . . other than being a cute, botiquey expression?

 

[pulpwoody]

Lighting, art direction, good sound (surprising how good sound effects the look of a film, but it does), a DP who knows how to use and move a camera,.... I'm just sayin', there's a reason it takes 100s of people to build a "Hollywood Film".

Yes, yes, yes (I'll have what she's having....)

Of the few corporate projects I've done that actually allow for production design, this is one of my most overlooked elements. Determine the color scheme, scout the locations and set the background and scene for depth, context, color and texture. Nothing in a good production is on accident.

 

[Bruce Watson]

Yes, yes, yes (I'll have what she's having....)

Now, I'll have to admit that I'm better looking than most of the blokes here (I have admit it because no one else will), but no one has confused me with a girl since I was eight.

Time for another trip to the opthamologist, eh pulpwoody?

 

[j1clark@ucsd.edu]

'Film like' so to say, although that is not the correct word as the Alexa or the BMCC can put out a 'film like' image to me as well.

The following elements contribute to what you consider to be the 'Film Look'.

Lighting
Set design/decoration
Post Processing.
Camera Equipment.

Then there's acting talent...

There are other elements but looking at many youtube/vimeo videos and 'pro' work, I think those are the major elements.

If you look at the ABC show "Once upon a time...", shot on an Alexa, then look at movies shot on the Alexa it becomes obvious that the Alexa can deliver both 'video looking' results as well as 'film'.

The difference being 'lighting/set/post'.

I'm referring to the visuals only.

 

[hscully]

If you look at the ABC show "Once upon a time...", shot on an Alexa, then look at movies shot on the Alexa it becomes obvious that the Alexa can deliver both 'video looking' results as well as 'film'.

The difference being 'lighting/set/post'.

I'm referring to the visuals only.

This is a great point. I'm always looking to see which camera is being used on TV shows. (Blue Bloods - RED, Good Wife - Sonys) and these still are TV shows and look like it, not cinema. I always look at the disparity but I like it. I like the new TV shows and how they look. This may hew more closely to the OPs question about when post makes a difference in the look. As you say, lighting also. I have listened to Fred Murphy ASC on the American Cinematographer Podcast describe his lighting technique for Good Wife as "poetic realism," sourced but glamorous. I really do love the look of that show but it's not a modern cinematic look. It's stylized, more than you'd see in a movie drama, more hair light, etc

To your point Grey's Anatomy and Castle are both shot on film but look less cinematic than the Alexas used in Skyfall... production design, sets, lighting but not film (and Roger Deakins ). Where the two TV shows shot on film look well, more like TV due to the cinematic choices (beauty lighting, proliferation of CUs, walk and talks) than the epic Bond "film."

 

[El Director]

From a grading standpoint, I found the opposite of conventional wisdom helps. Conventional wisdom says to crush the blacks to create contrast. I find that raising the blacks and crushing the mids creates a more filmic contrast by keeping what little DR we have with DSLRs.

 

[pulpwoody]

Now, I'll have to admit that I'm better looking than most of the blokes here (I have admit it because no one else will), but no one has confused me with a girl since I was eight.

Time for another trip to the opthamologist, eh pulpwoody?

Bruce, I'm sure you're almost as good looking as me, but I also do my own lighting That was actually a "When Harry met Sally" reference, maybe not the best place for it, but whatever. Actually, Stab should probably watch that and take some cues form the production design of that film.

On a side note, no more need for the ophthalmologist. Earlier this year, plunked down on Lasik surgery. Best money I've ever spent on anything ever.
Carry on.

 

[Bruce Watson]

That was actually a "When Harry met Sally" reference...

Ah, that. If you had written it as "yes, Yes, YES!" there's an outside chance I might have picked up on it. But it's been so long and I've put some effort into forgetting any movie that includes Billy Crystal. And I'd largely succeeded. Until now. Sigh.... ;-)

 

[AdrianF]

Apologies for farting in church again, but why not shoot on film, if that's what you're ultimately after?

 

[David W. Jones]

Apologies for farting in church again, but why not shoot on film, if that's what you're ultimately after?

I would assume that most shooting digital trying for a film like look do so because they lack the budget to shoot film stock. So the blind suggestion to just shoot film is not a valid one for most folks.

What film look would you suggest? The Brady Bunch, Gilligan's Island, Seinfeld?

As someone who has shot film for over 30 years I can tell you that there are many projects which were acquired on film that many would say lack the look of film.

 

[j1clark@ucsd.edu]

I would assume that most shooting digital trying for a film like look do so because they lack the budget to shoot film stock. So the blind suggestion to just shoot film is not a valid one for most folks.

What film look would you suggest? The Brady Bunch, Gilligan's Island, Seinfeld?

As someone who has shot film for over 30 years I can tell you that there are many projects which were acquired on film that many would say lack the look of film.

These days it is easy enough to add worn sprocket jitter, color timing mismatch at reel breaks, 'lifted blacks' because someone didn't turn the house lights down enough, and of course the ever popular film scratches, to make most 'digital' film look like Film film.

Personally I don't know where people have been viewing their movies, but I clearly must have been in the sticks, because most of the 'digital' theater presentations have not had hardly as many 'defects' as Film film projections.

Further, most people will most likely view the digital film on a home TV, and I believe most home TV's are really whacked when it comes to being setup remotely 'reasonable' to approximate a theatrical presentation...

 

[AdrianF]

I would assume that most shooting digital trying for a film like look do so because they lack the budget to shoot film stock. So the blind suggestion to just shoot film is not a valid one for most folks.

What film look would you suggest? The Brady Bunch, Gilligan's Island, Seinfeld?

As someone who has shot film for over 30 years I can tell you that there are many projects which were acquired on film that many would say lack the look of film.

While I agree with what you're saying, the point which I was ( flippantly ) making, was that if someone is really intent on producing an image with all the aesthetics of a certain film look ( whatever that is ), then why not at least put that option on the table? It might be completely the wrong choice for the OP, but it is at least worth keeping the option open. We're fortunate enough at the moment to have a lot of choices. That can only be a good thing!

 

[drapeama]

Just in case you would have missed it. I think it does a fair job itself. With a good lighting, camera work and decent sound, you'll get closer to your goal.