Call Canon about 5D 24p firmware update

Drew Ott

Drew Ott

Wish I were banned.
Clearly Canon already knows that people want the 24p update, but I just called their support line and the guy I spoke to said that very few people ever call in with suggestions. He also said that going through customer service and suggesting updates was the only certain way to be heard by the "high ups" at Canon.

I called this number: 1-800-828-4040
 
That's cool. But I thought I read somewhere that there was already a development preview of the 24p firmware and Canon never released it because it had too much jello effect?

That's doesn't make a lot of sense to me since it's less frames, so I don't know.
 
Well, on the GH1, the jello is much worse in the 1080p24 mode than in the 720p60 mode. So the likely explanation is that a slower frame-rate means that the read-out from the sensor is clocked at a lower rate as well.
 
When you finish calling, post in your experience.
My experience was pleasant. I didn't scream like I wanted to, & the rep informed me that the "voice messaging system" for feature requests when immediately to the proper department(s), and was the best way to request features in existing products.

Here's some of Pablov's (from cinema5d) list to help structure your call:
FEATURES/IMPROVEMENTS REQUEST LIST:

- Add / Improve: In Full HD (1920x1080) mode, allow these frame rates: 29.97, 25, 23.976 fps
FIX the current 30.00 fps to the standard NTSC 29.97 fps
Improve the video quality in 23.976 and 25 to minimize "jello" effect
- Improve AutoFocus algorythm in Live View mode (contrast detection mode)
- Add Focusing Aids in Video mode
- Add HD (1280x720) video mode with the above frame rates.
- Improve: Make HDMI output at FULL HD (1920x1080) and CLEAR of any overlay or information when recording and/or when just watching in Live View (if when recording is not possible)
- Add: a split video function to continue recording once the 4GB limit is reached in another video file without stopping the recording process.
- Allow Audio Manual Gain


Please start calling. They're available 24/7, and need to hear our voices asking for these much needed features....

When you're done, post here with your experience. Call now
1-800-828-4040
 
roxics said:
That's cool. But I thought I read somewhere that there was already a development preview of the 24p firmware and Canon never released it because it had too much jello effect?

That's doesn't make a lot of sense to me since it's less frames, so I don't know.
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If Canon felt lower frame rates led to an unacceptable level of rolling shutter artifacts, then WTF did they put 20fps on the 500D?
It doesn't make any damn sense for them to use that as an argument.
 
But the 500D is a different camera, so your point is...? It's like looking at the 7D and wondering why Canon won't let the 5D do 1080p25, 720p50, and 720p60. Maybe there is hardware limitation...
 
CALL THEM AND ASK!!!!

Seriously, put the keyboard down and join the revolution! Call Canon.
Multiple people are reporting that the canon reps are quoted as saying, "this is the best way to get feature requests pushed through."

This whole "24p hasn't been released due to low quality issue" is speculation & rumor. Our calls can force Canon to announce that it is indeed impossible, or actually provide the updates.

Look at it this way. It costs Canon a fair amount of $ to run a call center right? When 40% of the time a rep is fielding calls requesting firmware updates to the 5D mk2 it begins to make fiscal sense to just provide the updates or announce the fact that it is impossible (and then maybe ML will prove them as lairs).
:beer:

Canon's method of ignoring their customers needs when it comes to feature releases can be fought, it will not be easy, but start by calling.
 
Of course, asking never hurts. But just don't be disappointed if the answer is no, and don't bother letting your imagination run wild if Canon states its "excuse" is a hardware limitation. If it won't work, then it won't work. That's all I'm saying. Debating on counter-speculation is even worse than the positive speculation.
 
Why waste your time calling? Even if every reader of this thread called, it would still amnt to a tiny amount.. I wouldn't bother..
 
I still think that it is a hardware issue and if it could have been done with a firmware upgrade that it would have happened by now. My .02
 
Also, consider the business sense of releasing a firmware update before the 7D ships. Canon knows that many 5D users want 24p. They know that many of them will buy the 7D just to have it. (And to Canon, 5D users who dump their cameras don't matter, since the original sales have already been made.) If they release the firmware before shipping the 7D, then many pre-orders will get canceled. It's definite loss of sales from people who would've otherwise bought a 7D (or two).

So the smart move would be to get people to double-dip. And let's face it, many consumers aren't buying the 5D not because of the 30p, but because it's too expensive for them. There are many users out there who are willing to work with 30p but who can't swing the $2700 for the body alone. So even if/when the 24p firmware comes, those people wouldn't buy a 5D anyway. No lost sales.

Supposing that the firmware works just fine (which han't been proven), and Canon's just withholding it just because Canon is evil, then another smart move would be to play dumb about it and release it several weeks or months AFTER the 7D ships, when the furor for the new camera dies down. That way, they can claim not to know how big of a selling point the 24p was until they saw how crazily well the 7D sold because of it. By releasing the firmware at that time, they can reinvigorate 5D sales, both by attracting new customers as well as former 5D owners who sold their cameras to get 7Ds.

Just look at what happened with the manual control firmware (which they evidently withheld for months). Stoked videographers and still photographers alike caused the 5D to be sold out everywhere for months. Then just when sales were dying down, and the camera was getting back in stock everywhere, along with the timing of the Magic Lantern custom firmware, Canon released the manual control firmware, which many/most users considered even more important than 24p (hence a higher priority and bigger selling point). Suddenly, the 5D was white hot all over again, and another round of sell-outs ensued. The press releases and official statements seemed like a case of Canon deliberately playing dumb, in light of what anonymous sources have said about when the firmware was originally developed.

So get real, folks, and use some common sense. If it ain't happening not because of a hardware limitation, then it ain't happening because Canon wouldn't want it to happen, at least not so soon. So you can maintain hope that the firmware will be released, if you want. But you should not expect to see it for a good long time.
 
And in the amount of time it took you to write that post that tells us what we already know, you could have called and made the suggestion.

It may be a hardware issue, it may not. And the firmware update may never happen. But it most certainly will not happen unless more people like Drew take the initiative.
 
ydgmdlu said:
Also, consider the business sense of releasing a firmware update before the 7D ships. Canon knows that many 5D users want 24p. They know that many of them will buy the 7D just to have it. (And to Canon, 5D users who dump their cameras don't matter, since the original sales have already been made.) If they release the firmware before shipping the 7D, then many pre-orders will get canceled. It's definite loss of sales from people who would've otherwise bought a 7D (or two).
Click to expand...

So by that logic Canon would rather have a customer buy a camera that costs $1000 less, just because it's the newer model? I just bought my 5D a few months back, and that was after searching for a while because it was out of stock everywhere. So the demand for the 5D is obviously still there. Assuming it's possible (which is a big, big assumption) to add the desired 7d features to the 5D, then consumers have 2 options.

- A cropped vdslr under 2k with video bells and whistles
- A full framed vdslr for a grand more with the bells and whistles

Splitting the features over 2 cameras so people will "double dip" seems like the worst business plan ever. If the video geek market is just a small percentage of these cameras, the double dipping video geek percentage is going to be waaaaaay lower. If they add the features to the 5D, then they more or less have a full framed version of the 7D. I personally know a few people who want the video features, but are passing on the 7D just because it's not full framed.

All I'm saying is that I still feel good about the possibility of 24p in the 5D via a firmware update. If overcranking in 720p gets added too, even better. For the time being though, I have a full framed, vdslr with amazing low light performance. Shake gets me decent 24p, and I can borrow or rent a camera for overcranked shots. The kick a$$ full frame stills coming out of it more than make up for the short comings. I'll be happy for the next few years until the 5D Mark III or whatever comes out, and hopefully by then the jello problems will be lessened, and those video features we all want will be on a full framed vdslr. If I had both cameras sitting in front of me in a store right now, I really gotta say I think I would still go 5D.
 
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slimchrisp said:
All I'm saying is that I still feel good about the possibility of 24p in the 5D via a firmware update.
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24p in the 5Diii, yea. I'll be very shocked if canon releases a 24p firmware update, almost 100% certain they will make you buy another camera to get it. Besides people are telling me it is a hardware problem that firmware can't change correctly, it might be able to drop 6 frames but the timing is still off.

I'd even bet the rumored 24p 5Dii that was supposedly seen on Iron Man II was actually a 7D.
 
ChipG said:
I'd even bet the rumored 24p 5Dii that was supposedly seen on Iron Man II was actually a 7D.
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I'd buy that.

I guess my thing is that I've kind of changed in the way I look at gear. I'm worn out from chasing the next shiny new toy. When I bought my 5D (just after the manual controls firmware update announcement), I made the assumption that nothing else would be added. I asked myself if I was happy with what I was getting, and decided that the answer was yes. Workarounds exist for what I wanted, and everything else was already there.

If you always wait for that one feature you need (ie scarlet), you'll never have a camera. And if you keep dumping your *outdated* gear, well, you have more money than I do. :violin:

My 5D ain't perfect, but I love it the way it is. If anything else gets added, then even better. :)
 
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If everyone who just posted in this thread had called, explained to the rep why 24p is a needed addition along with a host of other things listed on page one, you'd have taken up no less than 20 minutes of a reps time. We could have burnt a day+ worth of call center time on pressing this issue, with the people in this thread alone. Imagine if you did a few times a week. Think about it again before you dismiss this idea.

How do you not understand this is the BEST way to pressure canon to release either an update or press release stating it is impossible.

Maybe you all like being jerked around? You can get used to it being a canon customer.
 
Slim,

I hear yea, I'll probably keep my 7D's for a couple years providing there is not a big flaw we don't know about yet.

We are finaly at a point where we can stop being measurebators becase they are all so good. I know people who are pissed off they have a gh1 after the 7d was announced, gh1 is an awesome camera! I would have ordered two more if the timing wasn't perfect with the 7d announcment and I'd be very happy with them.

Lot's of people are going to have these awesome cameras and stand around doing nothing wth them. I'm spending my money on nice glass this time.
 
ChipG said:
We are finaly at a point where we can stop being measurebators becase they are all so good.
Click to expand...

HA!!! And Amen!!!

ChipG said:
I'm spending my money on nice glass this time.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've moved from the new toy syndrome phase of life, and into the lens whore phase. The way I stare at all the lenses I want on B&H I'm like Gollum with the ring. :Drogar-Love(DBG):

I gotta say though, what makes me really happy is that I held off on my 35mm adapter setup for my hvx. For about the price of a good adapter and rails, I bought the 5D kit. Not big and bulky, amazing low light performance, and a kick butt still camera to boot. You gotta think that Canon and Nikon had an eye on what Red was doing, or maybe pro/prosumer vdslr cameras had already been in the works. The d90 kicked off the beginning of a big paradigm shift in our world.

We live in good times friends.
 
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I agree this would still definitely be a good idea. Canon has never given a definite yes or no on 24p other than that it would be "difficult". They could just be lazy, you never know. Having 24p at FF would still be a nice addition for shooting B-roll footage and plenty of folks still haven't used a 5D on a production because of the framerate issue. They'd only sell more units by including a feature on a still more expensive model than they'd lose in 7D sales, not to mention more L series lens sales. I think Canon only has more to gain by including the feature. I for one would still consider getting a 7D even if Canon released 24p for 5D for the crop factor, being able to use smaller anamorphic adapters on wider lenses etc.... among other features.
 
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