Big News in the World of Electric Cars!

As long as solar panels need more energy to produce them as the give in theyr live that makes no sense.

But I heard they got a new technologie now that makes it a bit better. Wait and see.

We don´t run out of oil.

Have you ever asked yourself how many rotten T-Rex it takes to fill a tank?

The old theory that oil comes fom dinosaurs and trees that dropped dead - and not got eaten or decompose like every other tree and animal today - but somehow sunk down a view thousand feet and magicly turned to oil - always sounded strange to me.
Then they came up with "Oil is formed from the preserved remains of prehistoric zooplankton and algae which have been settled to the sea (or lake) bottom in large quantities under anoxic conditions." Doesn´t sound solid in my book ether. Every attempt to proofe that theory in a lab failed.

This here makes more sense to me:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenic_petroleum_origin
 
You know I used to think solar panels (aka photovoltic cells) had promise, untill you realise just how in-efficient they are:

(1) Panels require sunlight to hit directly, even less then direct sunlight causes dramatic loss of electric power

(2) Panels are made up of lots of smaller "cells" even if one cell is partially blocked (say shadow from a branch of a tree) then that causes dramatic loss of electricity generation. This is known as internal short circuiting.

(3) Cost

I'm not saying they are bad, but it has its negative,

NOW saying all that a better solution is:

Solar heating

why?:

Well in Spain around 1982 a "Solar Chimney" now called "Solar updraft tower" proved a totally viable alternative,

It requires just 7 people to run (pretty much self sufficent)

Its so simple in design, even third world countries could construct it, in fact you could make one in your backyard :D

Best Part, it continues to make electricty during the night! 24hr generation

How does it work? simple:

Heat air using "Greenhouse" type setup, then as the air expands, force it through a "Cooling tower", this force turns turbines which generate electrity, the heat produced during the day is stored inside water containers, release it during the night to carry on generating through the night.
even as we speak Australia and Spain (under EU plans) are planning a "Solar updraft tower" that will be able to produce 40MW (and designs for 100MW exist).


Downsides:

Best suited for hot countries, and requires fairly large land area.


Solar Updraft Tower
 
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The problem is America's demand for higher standard of living. Now that we've achieved that, we need to learn how to do things smarter.

Already things are set in motion for a greener more sustainable future.

The point is not whether there is an abundant amount of oil left, the idea is to find alternative sources of energy because of CO2 emissions.

It's not that the earth is in trouble, it's our lives that are in danger.

Check out the PBS documentary series by Kontentreal

http://www.design-e2.com/
 
Yes I've cycled practically untill my late teens, then sadly I got my first car, and my bike has stayed in my shed.

But I want to get back into biking ,I'm loving those dual suspension (triple crown?) with lovely, lovey disk brakes hmmmm...
 
Postmaster said:
As long as solar panels need more energy to produce them as the give in theyr live that makes no sense.
Click to expand...

Thats just not true. Absolutely not. Price is a different animal, but not the energy which was needed to produce them. Thats a myth.

In germany the newest generation of solar panels takes about 15 months to get back the energy that was used to produce it. In southern europe its about 8 months.

And over it's lifespan you gain 20 times (for southern europe its 38 times) the energy that was needed to produce it.

http://www.volker-quaschning.de/datserv/kev/index.html
 
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Cheap Solar Power

Cheap Solar Power

I've been following this thread (and many others in other forums) regarding our addiction to oil, and the resistance to change.

With regards to solar power being too expensive, this is QUICKLY CHANGING! I'm surprised that no one else has yet mentioned this company in San Jose, California:

www.nanosolar.com

These people have devised a "printing press" method of making solar sheets that can be put on any surface you desire. They started mass production this year, and when they reach mass market proportions, the costs are equivelent to 30c per watt (cheaper than today's prices for gas/oil).

Its changing fast, and will change even faster. Solar is the future IMHO

Dillon
 
Actually I couldn't remember their name but that company was mentioned in both the History channel progam Renewable Energy and a Nova special on solar energy. They also talked about the concept of a photovoltaic paint. It is all very exciting and hopefully we will finally got our heads out of butt on developing this technolgy but I am still cautious. I did a report in school back in the early 80's where I concluded that we would be getting about 25% of our energy from solar by the year 2000 (we get less the 1% from renewables now). Granted at that time many still believed we would all have our own private airplanes and cars would drive themselves by the year 2000.

At this point, the only way I see us making a substantial shift to renewables is if this trend of quadrupling gas prices continues....which seems more and more likely.

Cheers
 
I can't talk about gas and oil and prices..I'll get brain bubbles! However I can say I do like the look of this electric car. Sorry if someone made the connection already, I couldn't read the whole thread. Anyway, a few shots of the Tesla can be found

HERE
 
dillont said:
I've been following this thread (and many others in other forums) regarding our addiction to oil, and the resistance to change.

With regards to solar power being too expensive, this is QUICKLY CHANGING! I'm surprised that no one else has yet mentioned this company in San Jose, California:

www.nanosolar.com

These people have devised a "printing press" method of making solar sheets that can be put on any surface you desire. They started mass production this year, and when they reach mass market proportions, the costs are equivelent to 30c per watt (cheaper than today's prices for gas/oil).

Its changing fast, and will change even faster. Solar is the future IMHO

Dillon
Click to expand...

I read about this company in Time. I hope it takes off, seriously.
 
Anhar Miah said:
Its so simple in design, even third world countries could construct it, in fact you could make one in your backyard :D

...Australia and Spain (under EU plans) are planning a "Solar updraft tower" that will be able to produce 40MW (and designs for 100MW exist).
Click to expand...


From your Link:

"The chimney had a height of 195 metres and a diameter of 10 metres, with a collection area (greenhouse) of 46,000 m² (about 11 acres, or 244 m diameter) obtaining a maximum power output of about 50 kW."

1. What kind of backyard do you have? :Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)
2. 50KW is a joke for a 195 metres tower sitting on 11 acres.

@Simon

As I said, they got better panels now.

Frank
 
Postmaster said:
50KW is a joke for a 195 metres tower sitting on 11 acres.
Click to expand...

That was only ment as an experiment on the types of materials that could be used,

did you read the rest of the artilce, and you are are aware of the plans for a 50MW power station? and it can be further scaled to a 100MW power station.

Also note, that the worlds first Nuclear tests ONLY generated 100kW I suppose you would consider Nuclear as a "joke" too?, of course the first full commercial Nuclear power station in the UK produced 50MW, and in the USA the first Nuclear also produced around 60MW.

This technology is scaleable, and can be easly expanded

Also another very promising technology (again in Spain)


I'll reiterate something from an engineering point:

Direct conversion of Solar energy to electricty is very inefficient,

however using solar heating to heat water and drive turbines is much more efficient in generating vast amounts of electrity and is a very viable alternative.

I'm not saying solar panels do not have their uses, they do, however if we are looking for big scale power generation then photovoltic cells are impractical.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6616651.stm
 
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I got a book called "The World in the Year 2000".
It is from 1921 and they had already that idea of those towers.

There where hundrets of great ideas and patents before WWII. But often they did not have the materials or the money to bring them to reality. In some cases they got blocked and destroyed, the inventors ruined by the indutry like the famous Fish carburator.

I got 4 of them on the shelf (one is even a prototype) and one in my 41 Chevy. And it does what the inventor said: 30% better mileage and 30% more power.

Frank
 
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