Best Low-Cost Dumping and then Editing Options(laptop)

C

Cine99

Member
I really don't think this has been completely covered, but maybe I missed something. And I actually read through almost every thread. I'm pretty sure that with the information available, a lot of this stuff is answerable. I just am very confused and I think what I'm talking about is possible, but I'd like to be a little more positive by asking the more experienced/knowledgable out there. Here goes:

For someone who will be using the P2 cards, perhaps the 2 8Gig cards, what is the best solution for dumping in the field?

I DON'T want to simultaneously record to a laptop via firewire, I only want to dump to a firewire or USB 2.0 drive. What are my options?Are portable drives powered by the camera's USB and/or firewire port? If not then I'd have to be near a power supply when dumping right?

What company, in everyone's opinion, has the most reliable/fast USB and/or firewire drives?

If I'm dumping to a laptop for editing, will there be a bus speed problem as long as I go from the camera/dump drive to the USB port on the laptop and then have an external drive connected to its firewire 800/400 port, for moving footage from one place to another?

My last question has to do with editing on the laptop itself. Is a 15" Powerbook, the most recent one, powerful enough to handle DVCPRO 1080 in 24p straight cuts and maybe the occasional dissolve using FCP 5 Studio? Will an attached Firewire 800 or USB drive(for at home, this would obviously be a large external set, not bus powered like in the field) be fast enough to handle the throughput of DVCPROHD, doing straight cuts? I don't care if I have to render just the dissolve either. I'm just talking, previewing a timeline of straight cuts only without rendering. And finally, is there a way, perhaps connecting to the camera from the laptop, to attach an external SD viewing monitor?

If I can do all this, just edit straight cuts using the above mentioned equipment, then count me in. If I have to get a whole G5 setup with the Decklink HD or Kona2 or whatever, then we simply won't be able to afford it for our film.

Thanks everyone. Great and highly addictive board.
 
Its all about the dumping :happy:

Its all about the dumping :happy:

The editing aspect has been discussed in several threads. Theck those out first. :thumbsup:

As for the dumping, its been discussed briefly, and here is what I understand. On a PC laptop, you should be able to pop your P2 card into the PC card (PCMCIA) slot and immediately dump the video onto your harddrive. Currently, on a powerbook (the only mac with a pc card reader), this is not possible as apple has yet to make drivers available (or update firmware, or something) that enable OS X to read P2 cards. However, according to Barry, this is just a mere hiccup and should be possible upon release of the camera in december. Here is my dilemma:

I, too, am looking for a CHEAP and FAST dumping solution. Portable would be nice, but not vital (if necessary, I can make a desktop portable if its for use on a film-like set, it won't be pretty, but I can do it). In terms of FAST, I want to dump the files to a Firewire 800 external duel drive, RAID 1 for extra backup. These are avaiable for $150 without the dual drives, and currently you can get drives for 300GB for $130 as well.

OPTIONS: (please add to these)
1. PC laptop with 2 PC card slots:
One slot for the P2 card.
One slot for the firewire 800 cable.

Advantage: cheaper, under $1000 for sure. More rugged than a powerbook in my experience (may be OS X compatible in the future - MAYBE - you'll need the chip hack).
Disadvantage: Less stable OS, need for firewire 800 upgrade, or just firewire for that matter.

2. Powermac with firewire 800 and pc card (15").
Advantage: Ready to go hardware-wise, love os x, can use FCP 5 (my NLE) in the field for immediate feedback on shots.
Disadvantage: over $1600, not as reliable in the field. At the moment, not P2 compatable.

3.Panasonic AJ-PCS060 P2 Store.
Advantage: ready right now (call B&H). Very rugged in the field. Panasonic supported and warranty.
Disadvantage:
One drive without backup (no RAID options).
Only 60GB (sorry, but that's not enough for 1080 24p).
USB2 (you run out of space, and now you wait 30 minutes to transfer 55GB of footage over USB2 - firewire 800 does that in 1-2 minutes).
Price - over $2,500.00 USD. Yikes.



Please Add!
 
I know it's been discussed, but there are some issues there that I have not seen, and I've read nearly everything. For instance, maybe it's ignorance, but can the camera provide power via the USB port (STRICTLY FOR DUMPING FOOTAGE FROM P2'S, NOT TALKING ABOUT FIREWIRE STREAMING) to a portable USB drive. Or will I need to power it separately? Can it DUMP(again, not stream) to firewire. The reason I'm so clear about it is cause I want to use the P2 cards with no power supplies attached to the camera other than a battery. Talking about untethered recording and dumping.

And as far as the Powerbooks, while I'm sure they'll have P2 card support by the time I shoot, I wanted to know about throughput.

I love these boards, but it's frustrating that whenever a thread is started it can go on to be talking about something completely different than what was asked (for instance, the board that went off on the Apple Under 50k to 2k editing solution ad). Sometimes it comes back to the original question, but hardly ever in a definitive way. People are told to check out other threads first when they state that they already have. I mean... there's so much info and you can read until your eyes bleed, and you may get a bit here and a bit there, but they don't always add up to a complete answer. And while I know this all still needs to be tested, I'm just curious since a lot of you already know about throughputs. With the chart that one of the mods put up, I guess it all works in theory, but I"m just saying, DVCPRO HD is already out there, and has anyone been able to edit it with a powerbook and FCP. Is a firewire 800 drive storage solution attached to a 15" powermac fast enough for straight cuts and the occasional dissolve.

If I can use a portable USB drive (camera powered), can I then attach it to the laptop's USB port when I get home from a day's shooting, and then dump it through the USB port, through the laptop, then out of the laptop's firewire800 port to a massive external FW drive? Then, finally, will the laptop handle straight cuts in FCP of 1080 24p footage?

Asking with all due respect and sincerity to everyone out there, and I really have read as much as I possibly can and am STILL not sure about these questions. Just trying to put together a budget to raise money from.

Help me HVX200 thread users... you're my only hope.
 
not the authority here, but since i have time...

not the authority here, but since i have time...

>I know it's been discussed, but there are some issues
>there that I have not seen, and I've read nearly
>everything. For instance, maybe it's ignorance, but
>can the P2'S, NOT TALKING ABOUT FIREWIRE
>STREAMING) to a portable USB drive. Or will I need
>to power it separately? Can it DUMP(again, not stream)
>to firewire. The reason I'm so clear about it is cause
>I want to use the P2 cards with no power supplies
>attached to the camera other than a battery. Talking
>about untethered recording and dumping.

good question, i have no idea.

>of you already know about throughputs. With the chart that
>one of the mods put up, I guess it all works in theory, but I"m
>just saying, DVCPRO HD is already out there, and has
>anyone been able to edit it with a powerbook and FCP.

People say yes, but I don't buy it, that is if we are talking at 1080 24p. But I assume you would not be rendering in the field. Quick edits and composition yes, dissolve maybe, but constructing you final edit, probably not.

>Is a firewire 800 drive storage solution attached to a 15"
>powermac fast enough for straight cuts and the occasional dissolve.

The firewire 800 solution is for dumping only. For quick, in the field edits I would transfer footage from external HD to laptop HD. I take that fw800 storage at the end of the night and dump it to my dual G5 or what ever you are editing on.

>Then, finally, will the laptop handle straight cuts
>in FCP of 1080 24p footage?

I'll believe it when I see it. Not currently, maybe in 1-2 years when laptops get fast enough. Of course by then the laptop may need its own cooling system to keep it from burning up. :grin: BTW, I keep implying that I would be doing all of this. Sorry, but that's why its called crew - even if its only with one additional person. Someone else is going to have to worry about quick edits (aka, an editor). Keep asking questions, because it helps all of us.

markus
 
Boy, quick replies. Love it...

When you say that it's not fast enough for the final edit, just not sure what that means. If I can do straight cuts and have them play back in realtime, is it just the volume of cuts and the fact that it would have to have such a sustained throughput to play the entire, let say, 90 minute timeline? And also, are you saying that the FW 800 drives are just not fast enough to handle playback of the footage? How about rendering the entire timeline to one HD Quicktime? Know it would probably take FOREVER, but I just wonder if it's possible.

Anyway, so let's take it a step further then.

Ok... so fur dumping, let's just say I get a P2 Store, which can run on a battery. Then I dump to a G5 via USB 2.0 each night when I get back from shooting. What can we safely assume would be a minimum storage, card(decklink, kona?) and power requirement to edit straight cuts, render dissolves, and watch or output the entire final assembly to a tape deck or a full rez QT? I think seeing a safe requirement would at least put some minds to rest... (namely, mine), and know what it, at least for now, would cost to get footage and then edit it in it's native DVCPRO HD at home.

Enquiring minds wanna know... and thanks for any help.
 
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