Basic sound kit help

[Nytkim]

Hello, everyone.

I am an university student and have been doing audio work with the university equipment: me66, fp33, marantz pm 670. There were some shure lavaliers but they don't work anymore. I like the overall quality but would like something better. I think the NTG-3 would be a nice step up from the me66. I don't like the amount of background the me66 captures.

Anyway, I want to buy my first audio equipments and I have decided to get the following:
1. Tascam DR-70D
2. Rode NTG-3

I work mostly with fiction. My question is: should I buy lavalier or just rent when I need it? In my city I can rent the Sennheiser G2 set. I intend to use the boom most of the time, but I might need lavalier for wider shots. How good can a wired lavalier be hidden in a wide shot? I never tried it myself. I could also buy some not so expensive wired lavalier like the countryman b3 with xlr connection to the tascam dr-70d and get a wireless system if I need. What do you guys think?

I am not considering lav + zoom h1 because I usually have a hard time breathing when I am not monitoring the audio.

 

[Rick R]

For the most part, one wireless mic is only good for one person. Most folks use several, depending on the scene.

Hiding microphones is another skill set all together... Hiding them is easy... hiding them without getting rubbing and other extraneous noise.. not easy. I would recommend the tutorial on Udemy, 'How to put a Microphone on Talent' by Thomas Popp, It ain't free, but it's comprehensive and well done. Unfortunately (or fortunately) it still takes a lot of 'hands-on' experience. (pun intended)

If your also the camera op, it's best to just hire a pro sound person, who will have the gear and more important... the experience.

 

[Alex H.]

Just to make sure I understand your circumstances: when you say you're doing audio work with the university's sound gear, do you mean that you are working with a focus on sound? Or do you mean that you're shooting AND using the school's sound equipment?

If you are focusing on sound, and considering developing that into a line of work for yourself, then the NTG-3 and DR-70D can be a good starting place for student productions that will also grow with you as you need to expand your kit. Don't forget, however, that you need to factor in a boom pole with shock mount and wind protection for the NTG-3, plus mic cables, and a really good pair of headphones. You might also want to look at a small bag (audio organizer) for the recorder and extras.

As for lavaliere mics, it may be more practical for now to rent wireless systems on an as-needed basis. Even the Sennehiser G2/G3 systems, though inexpensive by comparison, can be expensive to own.

And to answer your question about burying hard-wired lavs, you can certainly hide the lav itself in clothing, but you'll have a cable running across the floor no matter what. Further, having the lav hard-wired to the recorder is restrictive when it comes to blocking and actor movement. It's fine for a seated interview, but for anything else it's simply impractical.

 

[Nytkim]

Well, I am focusing on sound right now. I have worked as DP, director, producer, etc in different productions, but I have decided to go for sound. We try to have one person dedicated to each task when we can. I intend to get the NTG 3 along with the blimp, a k-tek or rode 3m boompole. I already have a DT 770 as headphones. Im thinking about the petrol 302 bag. Some USB power bank and eneloop as backup.

So basically hard wired mic aren't useful for fiction work unless there is a very specific situation, right?

I also plan to buy a sound devices 302 in the future. Will it have a good audio quality upgrade with the dr-70d? Or maybe should I buy the HD-P2 since I will be buying a mixer later?

Thanks

 

[Alex H.]

Well, I am focusing on sound right now. I have worked as DP, director, producer, etc in different productions, but I have decided to go for sound. We try to have one person dedicated to each task when we can.

Excellent! Thanks for the clarification.

I intend to get the NTG 3 along with the blimp, a k-tek or rode 3m boompole. I already have a DT 770 as headphones. Im thinking about the petrol 302 bag. Some USB power bank and eneloop as backup.

I'm not a fan of much that bears the Behringer name (though, their new X-series live digital consoles are actually Midas under the hood). The headphones you'll hear about most in use on film and TV sets and locations are the Sony MDR-7506 and the Sennheiser HD-280 PRO.

So basically hard wired mic aren't useful for fiction work unless there is a very specific situation, right?

They're useful when all you see is from the waist up, and the actors don't have to walk anywhere. They can come in handy as plant mics, too (hidden in props and set pieces to catch passing dialog in certain areas), but again you have to worry about hiding the cable run from the camera.

I also plan to buy a sound devices 302 in the future. Will it have a good audio quality upgrade with the dr-70d? Or maybe should I buy the HD-P2 since I will be buying a mixer later?

The Sound Devices 302 is dated, but is still a powerful, little mixer. Think about this, though: if you get the DR-70D, you have a recorder that multi-tracks four separate inputs. In other words, you can have four separate mics (say, a boom and three lavs) recorded individually, giving you complete control of mixing and editing in post. If you add a 302 in front of that, you have a mixer that takes three inputs but has only two outputs. If you were to use all three inputs on the 302, at least two of them would have to be mixed going to the recorder. You could instead look at finding a good deal on a used Sound Devices 442, which has four inputs with direct outs on each, meaning you can send each of the inputs to its own separate track on the recorder.

The HD-P2 is a fine recorder, also a bit dated, but offers TC sync (if you need that, anyway). However, this takes you down to two-track recording. This is fine for recording with only two mics; otherwise you'll be stuck recording a dedicated mix with no control over mix levels in post. You can put a 302 or other mixer in front, but again you're recording mixed instead of individual tracks.

The question you need to ask yourself first is whether you need to record more than two mics at a time for the work you do. If the answer to that is, "Yes," or even "quite likely" (should you be renting several wireless kits at a time for some projects), then perhaps start with the DR-70D or even the DR-680 for now. Both can be useful for quite some time as backup recorders should you eventually move up in the audio world. If sound takes off for you and you need to get serious, you'll already have a shotgun mic kit that can continue on, so you may want to look at high-quality mixer/recorder combos like the Sound Devices 633 or 644 when the time comes. Of course, depending on when that time comes, there may be even newer and better offerings.

 

[Nytkim]

Thank you for the clarification!

I will go with the ntg3 and dr-70d for now and upgrade to a mixer like the 442 or a better combo in the future. Since I probably won't be using lavs for most of the time, I will rent them when I need it.

I'm not a fan of much that bears the Behringer name (though, their new X-series live digital consoles are actually Midas under the hood). The headphones you'll hear about most in use on film and TV sets and locations are the Sony MDR-7506 and the Sennheiser HD-280 PRO.

The DT 770 is from Beyerdynamic, not Behringer.

 

[Alex H.]

The DT 770 is from Beyerdynamic, not Behringer.

Yes. Yes, they are. My mistake. Not a pair with which I have a great deal of familiarity. The Sony MDR-7506 have been my go-to for years, and I do have a pair of the Sennheiser.