Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
Precise media management is NOT optional or a small thing in a professional editing application and Apple better get a clue in that regard.
Avid's reaction to FCPX
- Thread starter Newman
- Start date
Precise media management is NOT optional or a small thing in a professional editing application and Apple better get a clue in that regard.
keylight
Veteran
Avid has definitely had its ups and downs, and although I really don't like the way Apple operates (tight control over almost everything), I do give them credit for forcing Avid to shape up and refocus it's product lines. Anyone remember Film Composer, MCXpress, XPress DV.... And a ton of different iterations of those and many other products. Too many different tools that were separated by a couple of features each.
Anyway, Apple forced Avid to make some significant changes along the way, and today they have an incredibly solid product line that has come down enormously in price. So although I'll never own FCP (and yes, I have edited with FCP) and I will take Avid over all other platforms any day, I'm still happy they have strong competition in the marketplace. It makes them a better company. Better focused to its customer's needs. And frankly, I hope they don't worry too much about trying to compete down market. Just keep building great professional tools. Their academic pricing on MC5.5 and the fact that it is available on PC and Mac should keep feeding new users right up the line. The price is right there next to FCPx, and with free upgrades for 4 years and an inexpensive upgrade path to a commercial license after that, I think Avid's future looks good.
As long as they don't rest on their laurels. By the sound of it, they aren't.
Anyway, Apple forced Avid to make some significant changes along the way, and today they have an incredibly solid product line that has come down enormously in price. So although I'll never own FCP (and yes, I have edited with FCP) and I will take Avid over all other platforms any day, I'm still happy they have strong competition in the marketplace. It makes them a better company. Better focused to its customer's needs. And frankly, I hope they don't worry too much about trying to compete down market. Just keep building great professional tools. Their academic pricing on MC5.5 and the fact that it is available on PC and Mac should keep feeding new users right up the line. The price is right there next to FCPx, and with free upgrades for 4 years and an inexpensive upgrade path to a commercial license after that, I think Avid's future looks good.
As long as they don't rest on their laurels. By the sound of it, they aren't.
RainstormVideo
Member
+1
Couldn't have said it better. I'll be sticking with Avid but competition is a great thing for everyone.
Do you mean that I can do a full branding and marketing campaign for your mediocre business for free, and I can even put it on my portfolio?! Wow, I can't wait until you share my contact with your other cheap friends!
Haha!
I cannot see accessibility as a bad thing! Especially not accessibility backed up by the power and flexibility to do a great deal of subtle stuff when you need it.
The only reason I can make a living the way I do is that it has become possible for one person to be his own photographer, lighting technician, film development lab, airbrushing bureau, printing house, script writer, director, cameraman, sound engineer, editor, colourist, producer and distributor. (Oh, and graphics designer, too).
Have I stolen work from the editors who used to charge hundreds of dollars an hour? No, because the work I do is of small circulation and it simply wasn't financially viable before the days of powerful computers, digital cameras, digital video and "professional" software with approachable, accessible interfaces and price tags that an indie can afford.
The good professional editors will survive, but like the printers of the newspaper world, those who do not move with the times and embrace the new developments are going to wake up to a nasty shock when their clients do indeed take some of these things in house. You have to offer your clients more than just "pay your money, leave me the tapes, pick it up in a week to take to the colorist". If you are providing what they consider to be vital creative input, they'll get the graphics designers working on their website and talk to you about how to shoot and edit content for that website with a quick turnaround and great quality. If you drag your heels, they'll get an in-house guy with a can-do attitude to try editing footage instead, and you might just have talked yourself out of a job- because it might turn out that that guy with a can-do attitude can edit pretty damn well for what the client actually needs.
Cheers, Hywel
The only reason I can make a living the way I do is that it has become possible for one person to be his own photographer, lighting technician, film development lab, airbrushing bureau, printing house, script writer, director, cameraman, sound engineer, editor, colourist, producer and distributor. (Oh, and graphics designer, too).
Have I stolen work from the editors who used to charge hundreds of dollars an hour? No, because the work I do is of small circulation and it simply wasn't financially viable before the days of powerful computers, digital cameras, digital video and "professional" software with approachable, accessible interfaces and price tags that an indie can afford.
The good professional editors will survive, but like the printers of the newspaper world, those who do not move with the times and embrace the new developments are going to wake up to a nasty shock when their clients do indeed take some of these things in house. You have to offer your clients more than just "pay your money, leave me the tapes, pick it up in a week to take to the colorist". If you are providing what they consider to be vital creative input, they'll get the graphics designers working on their website and talk to you about how to shoot and edit content for that website with a quick turnaround and great quality. If you drag your heels, they'll get an in-house guy with a can-do attitude to try editing footage instead, and you might just have talked yourself out of a job- because it might turn out that that guy with a can-do attitude can edit pretty damn well for what the client actually needs.
Cheers, Hywel
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ATL Media Group
Veteran
I agree, and they are overcoming it! I started with Premiere 4.2, then around version 6.5 it became so unstable for longer projects that I jumped ship over to Canopus's Edius. Had I not been a techno geek who loved building high end PCs I probably would have gone to a MAC, but I am, so... Since CS5 and Win7-64bit the Adobe/Windows stability issues are all but history even on very long projects. CS5 Production premium is great.
lawriejaffa
Veteran
Yeah i use CS5 myself - i mean thats one unique advantage is the cross platform of software in the suite/ dynamic linking etc. Still though final cut was always a pleasure to edit on too and at least with me shared the habit of never crashing!
dustylense
Veteran
Every so often, make a habit of a simple "save all"? In FCP it takes like less than 2 seconds to do. All programs crash here and there.
DChang
Well-known member
Avid's reaction? Forget Avid, what's going to happen to Lightworks! 
Avid has been trying to get it together for a long time now, thanks to Apple, Avid has had a hard time justifying their ridiculous prices.
I agree with Hywel, it doesn't matter how accessible "professional" software becomes, that just means you need to up your game. Perhaps the industry is changing, perhaps your clients are changing, you have no control, you need to keep doing what you do best. There used to be a time when typist was a profession. Now anyone can do that, just how now a days graphic designers can edit video. But not as good as a real editor!
FCP has the majority of the industry, it is undoubtedly professional software, and now professional software is $299, get over it and start working. Avid's CEO's comments about professional this and professional that doesn't look good when the best film editing Oscar film was cut on FCP.
People are jumping to too many conclusions, just calm down and get back to work.
Avid has been trying to get it together for a long time now, thanks to Apple, Avid has had a hard time justifying their ridiculous prices.
I agree with Hywel, it doesn't matter how accessible "professional" software becomes, that just means you need to up your game. Perhaps the industry is changing, perhaps your clients are changing, you have no control, you need to keep doing what you do best. There used to be a time when typist was a profession. Now anyone can do that, just how now a days graphic designers can edit video. But not as good as a real editor!
FCP has the majority of the industry, it is undoubtedly professional software, and now professional software is $299, get over it and start working. Avid's CEO's comments about professional this and professional that doesn't look good when the best film editing Oscar film was cut on FCP.
People are jumping to too many conclusions, just calm down and get back to work.
dustylense
Veteran
Avid's reaction? Forget Avid, what's going to happen to Lightworks!
Avid has been trying to get it together for a long time now, thanks to Apple, Avid has had a hard time justifying their ridiculous prices.
I agree with Hywel, it doesn't matter how accessible "professional" software becomes, that just means you need to up your game. Perhaps the industry is changing, perhaps your clients are changing, you have no control, you need to keep doing what you do best. There used to be a time when typist was a profession. Now anyone can do that, just how now a days graphic designers can edit video. But not as good as a real editor!
FCP has the majority of the industry, it is undoubtedly professional software, and now professional software is $299, get over it and start working. Avid's CEO's comments about professional this and professional that doesn't look good when the best film editing Oscar film was cut on FCP.
People are jumping to too many conclusions, just calm down and get back to work.
+1 trillion!
For real. Most are bashing a program that they haven't even used yet. You don't like it, based on what you've "SEEN" (not used), don't buy it! Save your $299 (LOL $299!!!!!!!). I've seen all these post about what FCP will do upon export. WTF? I think they have a way to EXPORT YOUR FOOTAGE!
KyleProhaska
Veteran
^^^^ Best post in this thread... (Dchang)
One of the reasons I haven't switched to Avid MC is the artificial restrictions they place in the software. No secondary color correction (unless you want to pay 10K for DS) or buy Colorista and limited to 1080p while the rest of the world is supporting up to 4K natively. Their authorized vendors still try to upsell you to much more expensive products.
But, they have the industry defacto standard for media management and colaborative workflow. And as long as no one challenges them in that respect, they can get away things being the way they are. Being able to put all your media into a single export file, and open it on any other supported Avid software platformanywhere in the world, is what gives them the edge in high end broadcast and feature films. But those are markets where paying 36K for a turnkey Avid DS system is a minor expense.
But, they have the industry defacto standard for media management and colaborative workflow. And as long as no one challenges them in that respect, they can get away things being the way they are. Being able to put all your media into a single export file, and open it on any other supported Avid software platformanywhere in the world, is what gives them the edge in high end broadcast and feature films. But those are markets where paying 36K for a turnkey Avid DS system is a minor expense.
A number of us who do post-production work on OSX. As strange as it might seem, it ends up being the most cross platform, because it can run Final Cut, Avid, and Adobe. The only programs that I could think of using offhand that don't run on OSX are a few 3D programs, and there are plenty of OSX options there.
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Melvin Harris
Black Flag Member
+1
Exactly why I am sporting and upgrading both my pc and my mac... the mac is the most cross platform indeed, but there are things that are exclusive that I need to use... such is life, I suppose
walnutcrunch
Well-known member
I think FCP has very robust media management in FCSvr. I think sometimes it isn't adminned very well by the people running it. But ours is rock solid and it's probably the most powerful part of a whole FCP system with multiple seats. I really want to see apple say something about FCSvr. The only thing that would make me jump to another platform at this point is abandonment of FCSvr.
Please stay on topic. This thread is not about whether Macs or PCs over priced or underpriced, unreliable or other comments that predictably engender platform wars.
These exchanges change no one's minds, and create more heat than light.
These exchanges change no one's minds, and create more heat than light.
Andrew S
Member
Ok here's another view point, FCP has 2 million plus users. Lets say 2 million people take up the offer on FCPX thats a revenue to Apple of approx $ 600,000,00 a huge figure, even if only 33% thats $ 200,000,000 so the costs of software are cheep in relation to sales. FCPX will be a winner because
1. Its a new platform from the ground up with the very latest computer capabilities taken in to account. Avid has been a bolt on process for the last 10 years.
2. Apple wont let it fail and want to take editing into the 21st century not 20th.
3. New kids on the block will see apple as the most progressive and intuitive process, its very slick. The new kids are where the future money is. If l was avid l would be very worried. Avids past glories are in the past and there interface will look very old once people get used to seeing FCPX.
4. I think motion and colour etc will be sold as separate units and will be up graded during the next few months, people will still have these from FCP7.
Just a few thoughts.
Its adapt or die.
1. Its a new platform from the ground up with the very latest computer capabilities taken in to account. Avid has been a bolt on process for the last 10 years.
2. Apple wont let it fail and want to take editing into the 21st century not 20th.
3. New kids on the block will see apple as the most progressive and intuitive process, its very slick. The new kids are where the future money is. If l was avid l would be very worried. Avids past glories are in the past and there interface will look very old once people get used to seeing FCPX.
4. I think motion and colour etc will be sold as separate units and will be up graded during the next few months, people will still have these from FCP7.
Just a few thoughts.
Its adapt or die.