Note I did not entitle this thread Avid Xpress VERSUS Final Cut Pro...but I might as well have. I've found it discouraging how often other indie filmmakers I encounter scoff at my Avid Xpress in favour of their Final Cut. For compatibility with other indie filmmakers, succumbing to the Final Cut Cult makes a lot of sense. But now after cutting two docs on a tight deadline on Final Cut, I sure welcome my Avid Xpress when I get home. Avid just seems so much more precise and accurate. Final Cut feels quite intuitive in some ways, but sloppy as well: you intend to click on a segment to drag it somewhere else but you end up changing some else (like opacity or something). It's very fussy and inaccurate. I find Avid is very precise--once you know the commands, it does the one thing you want, when you want. No mistakes. Very precise. Many say "it's just a tool, who cares which you use"...but when you're on an edit suite for 11 hours a day I really care, I really really do.
avid xpress & final cut pro
- Thread starter sean90291
- Start date
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
I have and use both. Prefer Avid for sure, but i've been editing on it since 1991.
Work wih FCPro for a few years and you'll be just as fast/precise.
Work wih FCPro for a few years and you'll be just as fast/precise.
Zak Forsman
Major Contributor
i feel the same way as you. i wish i could incorporate some of the more inuitive, organic methods found in final cut, but still prefer the avid's more robust interface. trying to online on a final cut pro bay can be a nightmare. avid is much more reliable with regard to media management and upressing. and avid's tech support doesn't give me the "final cut studio is a prosumer product" excuse that apple has used with me on more than one occasion.
krestofre
Knight of the Holy Order
Just my opinion, but I think the reason the FCP has made so much headway / became so popular is because of price point. I mean for LESS that Avid Xpress Pro you get Final Cut, Motion, Soundtrack Pro, and DVD Studio Pro. That's incredible bang for your buck even if you have to deal with media management issues and less precise controls. Esspecially in the world of Indie filmmaking, FCP has given an incredible tool to filmmakers that wouldn't have had it five years ago.
Avid's studio packages are great (but slightly more expensive) and they're PC only. So if you're a Mac user from the start, then there's no real alternative to FCS.
The other thing that FCS provides over Avid is interoperability. To send your audio from FCP to Soundtrack it's a right-click and sent to option. In fact to get your timeline to any other component of FCS, it's just a right-click away. That's pretty amazing!
That interoperability is the only reason I keep my eye on Final Cut. I recently ordered the FCS package and am anxiously awaiting putting it through it's paces.
FCP has also got a lot of press thanks to Walter Murch. I'm a huge fan of Murch, so I like keeping up with the things that he's doing. It's interesting that you'll often hear people say "FCP is ready for prime time, it was used to cut Cold Mountain and Jarhead." If you read about Murch's experience, it wasn't all wine and roses. Just recently I saw a recording of Murch's Q&A with the LAFCPUG. Even with FCP 5 it was interesting to hear of the things that was still missing from FCP that Murch and his team wanted. I also think that people tend to forget that Murch has an assistant editor to handle the media mangement aspects of Final Cut. Anyone here have an assistant editor?
I think I'm rambling now. Oh well ... I guess I was feeling verbose this morning.
Avid's studio packages are great (but slightly more expensive) and they're PC only. So if you're a Mac user from the start, then there's no real alternative to FCS.
The other thing that FCS provides over Avid is interoperability. To send your audio from FCP to Soundtrack it's a right-click and sent to option. In fact to get your timeline to any other component of FCS, it's just a right-click away. That's pretty amazing!
That interoperability is the only reason I keep my eye on Final Cut. I recently ordered the FCS package and am anxiously awaiting putting it through it's paces.
FCP has also got a lot of press thanks to Walter Murch. I'm a huge fan of Murch, so I like keeping up with the things that he's doing. It's interesting that you'll often hear people say "FCP is ready for prime time, it was used to cut Cold Mountain and Jarhead." If you read about Murch's experience, it wasn't all wine and roses. Just recently I saw a recording of Murch's Q&A with the LAFCPUG. Even with FCP 5 it was interesting to hear of the things that was still missing from FCP that Murch and his team wanted. I also think that people tend to forget that Murch has an assistant editor to handle the media mangement aspects of Final Cut. Anyone here have an assistant editor?
I think I'm rambling now. Oh well ... I guess I was feeling verbose this morning.
DavidBeier
Veteran
At the end of the day, I like the power and the ability to be precise of Avid but I really wish it could be a bit more intuitive at times. Mostly, I wish I could expand a clip on the timeline without having to use the trim mode and have it over-ride something or having to go back to the origional clip and lay it down again.
KingsReign
Well-known member
I am a Final Cut fan as I first edited on a Media 100 and the systems are more similar in nature but have been taking a likeing to my Avid Xpress Pro more and more lately.
One thing, Final Cut can do a DV Start/stop detect...can Avid do this as well?
One thing, Final Cut can do a DV Start/stop detect...can Avid do this as well?
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
Media Management.
Integrated and massive metadata management... I have been trying to re-edit a 35mm feature on FCP, and what takes me a 1/2 day on Avid takes about 2 days on FCP - 24 fame conversion, BWF audio, sync, 1/4 frame slip, etc. I haven't even started editing. When working on these types of productions, my list is very long...
DavidBeier
Veteran
I'm sorry for doubting you Avid. I won't do it again... (well, fix the whole different colors in pause and play crap and then I won't do it again)
Zack Birlew
Veteran
I'm currently in a fix over this as well. I know I want FCP and Shake but since almost everyone uses AVID, even as a second choice, I might just have to get Xpress Pro too just to learn it, I don't need the studio, it doesn't seem to work as well as a AVID + AE or AVID + Shake mix.
What makes this all easier though in the long run is that Apple's next OS version, Leopard, is supposed to have support for Windows on a second partition for a Mac OS/Windows dual boot configuration on the Intel Macs which will really help out a lot. But, I believe I want to learn FCP first however I can be persuaded to learn AVID first or both evenly, which I may just end up doing anyway. Any thoughts?
What makes this all easier though in the long run is that Apple's next OS version, Leopard, is supposed to have support for Windows on a second partition for a Mac OS/Windows dual boot configuration on the Intel Macs which will really help out a lot. But, I believe I want to learn FCP first however I can be persuaded to learn AVID first or both evenly, which I may just end up doing anyway. Any thoughts?
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
J P said:
Not if you have your sequence settings set up properly.
The Easy Setups menu is your friend.
daylightsavings
New member
krestofre said:
This much might have been true at some point but I think it is really less relevant now. In preparation to edit an upcoming feature, there was some brief discussion between the director and I about using FCP. It cam down to price really. It was cheaper for us to go with Avid. That's because we already had a good PC available. Several in fact. The price of Avid xpress pro may be 3 times the cost of FCP but the cost of a good Mac is three times the cost of a PC I could put to use with Avid. I have edited on a $400 refurbished dell tower with xpress pro. I think the price gap will lessen more in coming years as well.
I was tained in Avid at school but my day job now has me in FCP. I have to say Avid does make a lot more sense to me and I can work much much faster. FCP has some really cool points and I like it's timeline editing, which is more flexible than Avid's but I still can't help but feel it is a little clumsy. I think people in the indie scene really like it cause it's easy to mouse around and get things done, where as in avid, you definately some amount training or patience to get up the learning curve. FCP also has that apple buzz. The fact that apple is so popular among artist based industries, and also the whole anti-establishment feel to it, much different than Avid, which has more a business model like microsoft's and is seen as the corporate, self-serving agressor. The good thing about FCP is that it has "encouraged" Avid to release lower cost products such as xpress pro to compete at that level. And now look, We are getting a software only version of MEDIA COMPOSER for about $5000. How much did MC systems used to cost? I know someone that once sold an old mac Media Composer setup for $30,000. So FCP has made avid compete and lower prices at least.
The debate will go on and I suppose FCP will be a major player in the coming future. I'm glad I can edit in either but what it comes down to at the end of the day, even when I'm in FCP, i still have my keyboard mapped like Avid's. So if I am trying to trick my FCP into acting like and Avid, I might as well be in Avid, eh?