I am curious to what ASA/ISO one would rate there light meter to compare that of which the DVX absorbs light? For instance, if the amount of light it renders is as sensitive as 320 ASA film stock or is it as sensitive as 500 speed. My light meter tests are reading at 2500 ASA/ISO, even if I set my light meter at either 24fps, (which the dvx trully is not because of the pulldown) or at 30 fps. Also, I know that this is an incident light meter reading and the camera has spot meter on it, but they still should roughly read the the same, if it is not a white reflecting object.
ASA rating for the DVX 100
- Thread starter Cope
- Start date
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
[quote author=Cope link=board=news;num=1078944734;start=0#0 date=03/10/04 at 10:52:14]even if I set my light meter at either 24fps, (which the dvx trully is not because of the pulldown) .[/quote]
The DVX truly IS 24 frames per second. The CCD runs at 24 frames per second, and it captures 24 frames equally spaced out across that second. How it records to tape is where the pulldown comes in, but that's irrelevant for light meter purposes. The DVX, in 24P or 24PA mode, is capturing at 24 frames per second just like a film camera would.
[quote author=Cope link=board=news;num=1078944734;start=0#0 date=03/10/04 at 10:52:14]even if I set my light meter at either 24fps, (which the dvx trully is not because of the pulldown) .[/quote]
The DVX truly IS 24 frames per second. The CCD runs at 24 frames per second, and it captures 24 frames equally spaced out across that second. How it records to tape is where the pulldown comes in, but that's irrelevant for light meter purposes. The DVX, in 24P or 24PA mode, is capturing at 24 frames per second just like a film camera would.
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Great, I know that it captures at 24fps I shoot film for a living, not video. But it doesn't get recorded in the end (DIGITAL TAPESTOCK!) at 24fps. So instead of trying to 1 up me, it would be a lot more helpful if you answered the question instead of trying to sidetrack from the subject and question. Once again the ? is what ASA you would rate the Panasonic DVX 100 at. Whether it be in the 60i, 30p, 24p, or 24p (adv). Thanks and remember you can have fun, be artistic and if you know how to work with people and are knowledgeable you can make a living shooting on this camera and many others. (whether they are film or digital)
Great, I know that it captures at 24fps I shoot film for a living, not video. But it doesn't get recorded in the end (DIGITAL TAPESTOCK!) at 24fps. So instead of trying to 1 up me, it would be a lot more helpful if you answered the question instead of trying to sidetrack from the subject and question. Once again the ? is what ASA you would rate the Panasonic DVX 100 at. Whether it be in the 60i, 30p, 24p, or 24p (adv). Thanks and remember you can have fun, be artistic and if you know how to work with people and are knowledgeable you can make a living shooting on this camera and many others. (whether they are film or digital)
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
The effective ASA of the camera is around 320 ASA.
I don't think Barry was trying to ONE up you, just educate you. Take it easy and don'y be so defensive. We're all pretty mellow in here.
The effective ASA of the camera is around 320 ASA.
I don't think Barry was trying to ONE up you, just educate you. Take it easy and don'y be so defensive. We're all pretty mellow in here.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
I think that would rather depend on the shutter speed you're using and gain settings rather than frame rate.
I think that would rather depend on the shutter speed you're using and gain settings rather than frame rate.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
No one-upsmanship implied. I was saying that it actually does shoot at 24fps, not at 60i, and pulldown isn't applied until the image is being recorded to tape. So if you're using a cine meter, you would want to use the 24 fps setting on it.
As far as answering the question goes, I didn't answer it specifically, because the specific answer is a bit slippery. The generally accepted answer is 320ASA. However, that depends on a number of factors: 60i is about a stop more sensitive than 24P is (due to the intricacies involved in processing an interlaced frame, and how the lines get added together to smooth them out and avoid interlace artifacts). And MichaelP did some tests that showed different ASA ratings for daylight settings, vs. tungsten settings.
So, the end answer is, try it under your specific circumstances, and make sure that you are actually using the 24 fps setting on the meter, not trying to compensate for it in the pulldown, etc. And your results may vary. People have said 200, they've said 500, but the most reasonable people seem to say it's about 320.
No one-upsmanship implied. I was saying that it actually does shoot at 24fps, not at 60i, and pulldown isn't applied until the image is being recorded to tape. So if you're using a cine meter, you would want to use the 24 fps setting on it.
As far as answering the question goes, I didn't answer it specifically, because the specific answer is a bit slippery. The generally accepted answer is 320ASA. However, that depends on a number of factors: 60i is about a stop more sensitive than 24P is (due to the intricacies involved in processing an interlaced frame, and how the lines get added together to smooth them out and avoid interlace artifacts). And MichaelP did some tests that showed different ASA ratings for daylight settings, vs. tungsten settings.
So, the end answer is, try it under your specific circumstances, and make sure that you are actually using the 24 fps setting on the meter, not trying to compensate for it in the pulldown, etc. And your results may vary. People have said 200, they've said 500, but the most reasonable people seem to say it's about 320.
Terry_Lasater
All about the Caption
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Barry said, "People have said 200, they've said 500, but the most reasonable people seem to say it's about 320."
Are you implying John is 'most reasonable'? ;D
Oops! I think I just stepped into 'The Hudson Zone'.
Barry said, "People have said 200, they've said 500, but the most reasonable people seem to say it's about 320."
Are you implying John is 'most reasonable'? ;D
Oops! I think I just stepped into 'The Hudson Zone'.
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
John and especially Barry I am sorry that I got a little defensive it was crazy day and I usually use a video tap (for the director) (and view fiender (for myself, along with the zebra funct.) to get the correct exposure. But I am doing a presentation using the dvx 100 in comparison to super 16mm tommorow and I want to mimick each step one needs to follow in order to shoot correctly with both cameras. (how to correctly light, set you're iris, rate the film stocks, frame, etc etc,) Thanks guys I appreciate your expert advice and no hard feelings. Take Care
John and especially Barry I am sorry that I got a little defensive it was crazy day and I usually use a video tap (for the director) (and view fiender (for myself, along with the zebra funct.) to get the correct exposure. But I am doing a presentation using the dvx 100 in comparison to super 16mm tommorow and I want to mimick each step one needs to follow in order to shoot correctly with both cameras. (how to correctly light, set you're iris, rate the film stocks, frame, etc etc,) Thanks guys I appreciate your expert advice and no hard feelings. Take Care
filmmaker58
Well-known member
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Here's how I estimate asa ratings for video cameras, and it has always worked pretty well. set the video camera to the mode you're going to use it in, and zoom in on a gray card, or flesh tones, or whatever (gray card gives the least margin for error). set the exposure, and see what you get. Say it's a 2:8. then I take my spot meter set at 1/50th, and shoot the grey card. I then toggle my ASA setting until it lands at a 2:8. I haven't had a chance to do the DVX yet, but a Sony Digibeta is slightly better than 320, and FP900 is about the same, a Sony IMX is around 500 at 0DB, etc. etc. I'll do the DVX next time i get to borrow Barry's.
Here's how I estimate asa ratings for video cameras, and it has always worked pretty well. set the video camera to the mode you're going to use it in, and zoom in on a gray card, or flesh tones, or whatever (gray card gives the least margin for error). set the exposure, and see what you get. Say it's a 2:8. then I take my spot meter set at 1/50th, and shoot the grey card. I then toggle my ASA setting until it lands at a 2:8. I haven't had a chance to do the DVX yet, but a Sony Digibeta is slightly better than 320, and FP900 is about the same, a Sony IMX is around 500 at 0DB, etc. etc. I'll do the DVX next time i get to borrow Barry's.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
No hard feelings at all, of course. I get a little technical at times (which usually causes John's brain to melt) but I was spelling it out so you weren't operating under some misconception.
I've been curious about the posts I've read as well, about why the DVX would be rated differently under daylight vs. under tungsten, etc. So maybe I'll get some time today and fiddle with it and see how it rates.
No hard feelings at all, of course. I get a little technical at times (which usually causes John's brain to melt) but I was spelling it out so you weren't operating under some misconception.
I've been curious about the posts I've read as well, about why the DVX would be rated differently under daylight vs. under tungsten, etc. So maybe I'll get some time today and fiddle with it and see how it rates.
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Tis is true. When Barry starts explaining my brain falls out. It's quite messy actually. Afraid to admit it, I'm starting tu understand more and more when he does explain. Im like "Oh yeah, I remember this rule!"
Tis is true. When Barry starts explaining my brain falls out. It's quite messy actually. Afraid to admit it, I'm starting tu understand more and more when he does explain. Im like "Oh yeah, I remember this rule!"
filmmaker58
Well-known member
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
It's more exact (not to mention easier) with the spot meter, because that's what the camera uses.
It's more exact (not to mention easier) with the spot meter, because that's what the camera uses.
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
The reason why pro cameras and film have a different ASA between Tungsten and Daylight is because of the 85B color correcting filter for daylight. An 85B filter causes a loss of 2/3 of a stop. I know the DVX does not have a physical 85B like pro cameras, but it must do the same electronically. That should explain the difference in ASA ratings. A camera with an ASA of 320 Tungsten would have an ASA of 200 in Daylight.
The reason why pro cameras and film have a different ASA between Tungsten and Daylight is because of the 85B color correcting filter for daylight. An 85B filter causes a loss of 2/3 of a stop. I know the DVX does not have a physical 85B like pro cameras, but it must do the same electronically. That should explain the difference in ASA ratings. A camera with an ASA of 320 Tungsten would have an ASA of 200 in Daylight.
Z
Zoomforce
Guest
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
wow im surprised everyone let Cope get away with such a jab at Barry.. good thing I didnt see this thread till now
wow im surprised everyone let Cope get away with such a jab at Barry.. good thing I didnt see this thread till now
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
A high octane yipper dog!
LOL
A high octane yipper dog!
LOL
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Okay, I am always a proponent of testing. Testing trumps theory totally.
So today I broke out the ol' Sekonic L-508C combo incident/spotmeter. Took the DVX outside. Set both to 1/1000 shutter speed, and shot just about every possible combination of bright light, shadow, white walls, leaves, raw sky, anything I could think of. The answer came back consistently the same: ASA 640. I tried it in F1 and in F5, same answer: 640. Tried it in 3.2k preset and 5.6k preset. 640 ASA.
So then I took it indoors and tried similar tests under tungsten lighting. Same answer: 640 ASA.
The DVX100, with no gain circuit applied, rates at 640 ASA.
Okay, I am always a proponent of testing. Testing trumps theory totally.
So today I broke out the ol' Sekonic L-508C combo incident/spotmeter. Took the DVX outside. Set both to 1/1000 shutter speed, and shot just about every possible combination of bright light, shadow, white walls, leaves, raw sky, anything I could think of. The answer came back consistently the same: ASA 640. I tried it in F1 and in F5, same answer: 640. Tried it in 3.2k preset and 5.6k preset. 640 ASA.
So then I took it indoors and tried similar tests under tungsten lighting. Same answer: 640 ASA.
The DVX100, with no gain circuit applied, rates at 640 ASA.
Re: ASA rating for the DVX 100
Why 1/1000? I would think exposing at different shutter speeds would yield different ASA readings as the CCDs sensitivity and film sensitivity may not have the same linearity to various exposer times.
I sure don't know, but just curious why you only did 1/1000.
-Rodger
Why 1/1000? I would think exposing at different shutter speeds would yield different ASA readings as the CCDs sensitivity and film sensitivity may not have the same linearity to various exposer times.
I sure don't know, but just curious why you only did 1/1000.
-Rodger