Archive Solutions for DSLR video - RAID1, RAID5 or something else?

R

RandyQ

Well-known member
hi folks,
I'm looking for an archive solution for my DSLR video files. Take note that this is ARCHIVE - I will not be using these files for active projects, and only for long-term storage. No need to stream video files for editing.

I like the safety of a mirrored drive (RAID1), but how does this work if I want to expand later (meaning I want to add drives).

I like RAID5 because (I think) I can keep adding additional drives, but I'm uneasy because its not 100% mirrored and I'm afraid it might not be possible to recover if one of the drives crashes. Because its an archive, reliability is the key performance indicator.

Has anyone tried any of these? Which works best?

rgds/ RandyQ
 
Maybe I'm wrong about how this works, but my understanding is that RAID is designed to redundantly back up data when working with active content. In other words, it is constantly automatically duplicating itself over redundant drives while you work, so a physical disk error on one drive won't spell loss of data. This is ideal for databases and other types of working data that won't necessarily have any "down time" to backup. Rather, it is all being backed up "live".

The thing is, you're talking about archiving stuff, not backing up live data while you work. In that case, what is the point of the RAID system? Just copy your data onto 2 external drives. You still get the benefit of redundant backups in case one fails, with the added benefit of having two physical independent locations (You don't have to worry about a power surge or bad power supply frying both drives in the Raid simultaneously, which happened to my friend, and you can even keep them in separate physical locations in case of fire, flood, etc). You can just keep buying drives as you reach capacity.
 
While it doesn't matter if it is DSLR footage or not (data is data) you should do some research.

Very basic (commonly used) RAID rundown:
Raid 0
Writes across all drives (min of 2) very fast but if any drive fails you loose ALL of your data

Raid 1
Writes same data to 2 drives (mirrored) if one drive fails you still have the other one. Uses double the amount of actual file space you use.

Raid 5
Writes across multiple drives (min 4) and if one fails you can replace it and the array will rebuild it self. If a second drive fails while the 1st drive is down or rebuilding you loose your data. Only needs 25% more space than you use, can be expanded.


If you want an easy to use raid I would look into a Drobo.
We use an internal raid 0 for working on active projects for speed. It gets backed up to a G-tech Raid 5 every night and once a project is finished we also copy it too it's own HD and remove it from the raid 0.
I am looking into tape backup as well

All this info available online if you look:

Google "Raid"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAID
 
this is a pretty frequently and heatedly debated topic.

first of all. many people will tell you that hard drives are not a good archiving media. and that data tape is a better long term storage option.
i am not one of those people. ive been archiving to hard drives for well over a decade and have yet to lose anything (aside from one lacie incident, which i should have seen coming)

a RAID isnt a bad idea, but there is really no need for it for archiving. as mentioned, the various RAID "flavors" are intended for either speed or contingency of live, active footage.

in your case, the value of a RAID could be achieved by simply duplicating the footage to another drive unit.

if youre working off an internal or single external drives. and by the nature of your question, id assume you are. a good idea might be one of these:
http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/NewerTech/Voyager/Hard_Drive_Dock

i have two of them and they are great for dumping and shelving projects. just pop in a naked drive module and go! biggest downside is you'll find yourself with a cabinet of nearly identical looking mechanisms. so your physical cataloging / labeling system needs to be pretty good ; )

if you use hard drives for archiving. its a good idea to power up and do a few random opens and closes on them a couple times a year or so. just to discourage the mechanisms from seizing up from longterm inactivity.

there are a number of more sophisticated and more complicated archiving systems. but for most individuals, they are just too costly or too involved.
 
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RAID5 for online workRedundant single removeable drives for freeing up spaceBluRay data disc or LTO tape for long term storagePeople question using optical media for long term storage, because they aren't sure it'll last 25 years. Realistically, it only has to last about 5-10 years, or until it can be moved to a newer, better archival medium. I used to back up to CDR, but don't have a single one of those left... Because I moved or purged everything on them once DVDR was dependable.
 
mcbob said:
RAID5 for online workRedundant single removeable drives for freeing up spaceBluRay data disc or LTO tape for long term storagePeople question using optical media for long term storage, because they aren't sure it'll last 25 years. Realistically, it only has to last about 5-10 years, or until it can be moved to a newer, better archival medium. I used to back up to CDR, but don't have a single one of those left... Because I moved or purged everything on them once DVDR was dependable.
Click to expand...

That's assuming you do, in fact, purge and copy onto new media every few years. That's a great habit to be in, honestly.
Personally, I have some media from over 10 years ago (music tracks and animation I worked on, before the whole y2k hoopla) on CDR that has faded over time. The ink on some of the discs actually ran/faded away, which means they are no longer readable. Likely the old computer I used to create them is in a closet somewhere, and some of the information still exists on the HD. So, I have very mixed feelings about backing up on optical media. And unlike a hard drive which you can bring to a data recovery center (for a lot of money), I don't think there are any data recovery services for optical. But that's just me. I don't think I trust my data to be on any one medium.

Has anyone considered solid state media storage? I've never seen anyone do it, perhaps too $$? But without moving parts or fading ink, a good P2 card or SSD should hold your data indefinitely in theory, right?
 
Has anyone considered solid state media storage? I've never seen anyone do it, perhaps too $$?
Click to expand...
it sure sounds like a "solid" though insanely expensive way to go. but i havent heard of anyone doing archive testing with them. i mean theyre pretty bulletproof for short term use. but i wonder if the maybe the media degrades slowly over time or something???

but right now. a 500 gig (which would be considered a very small project) would take about $1000 to back up on SSDs
 
wgzn said:
it sure sounds like a "solid" though insanely expensive way to go. but i havent heard of anyone doing archive testing with them. i mean theyre pretty bulletproof for short term use. but i wonder if the maybe the media degrades slowly over time or something???

but right now. a 500 gig (which would be considered a very small project) would take about $1000 to back up on SSDs
Click to expand...

True. That's about as much as a data recovery center would charge for a seized HD motor.
 
As I'm shooting more AVCHD, I'm flirting with using Transcend SD cards like tapes... Write once, backup to hdd, store indefinitely offsite. Price per hour is comparable.
 
mcbob said:
As I'm shooting more AVCHD, I'm flirting with using Transcend SD cards like tapes... Write once, backup to hdd, store indefinitely offsite. Price per hour is comparable.
Click to expand...
Is it? How much time are you able to record on an average sized card with AVCHD?
With the standard bitrate on my Canons in H.264, I'm able to record about 45 minutes on a 16GB card, which costs at least $30 (for a low end brand). When I break out my DVX (which I still do on occasion), tapes cost me about $6-$15 each, depending on if I bought in bulk or locally. Each tape records an hour. That means I can keep somewhere around 3+ hours of footage on tape for the same price as 45min worth of flash media.

Is the AVCHD 1080 format that much better that this is cost effective for you?
 
As I'm shooting more AVCHD, I'm flirting with using Transcend SD cards like tapes... Write once, backup to hdd, store indefinitely offsite. Price per hour is comparable.
Click to expand...
if we're just talking about source footage. that might not be a ridiculous idea.

but if we're talking about project files with alpha-graphics, sound, renders, exports, DVD files, and client-provided-god-awful-whatever,... that situation becomes unrealistic very quickly.
 
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Yes, I'm just talking source footage.

With my AF100 and GH2, I get about 45-60 minutes on an 8GB card; the Transcend 8GB costs about $10 each, or about exactly as much as a good quality HDV tape. SD card prices will continue to drop, tape prices have pretty much stabilized. It might be more reasonable sooner than I'm thinking.
 
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