Any help from IS if shooting with steadicam?

E

entry

Carbonite Member
Does IS lens help if you shoot using glidecam 4000 pro? I'm not sure if I should use IS lens in my next project where I have to shoot running people using steadicam.
 
I don't own it, but I can borrow it for free. Just have to make 2 hour drive to get it :p shooting this weekend so I'm just thinking if it will be waste of time to pick it up.
 
I think you need to test this carefully

IS does smooth

But steadicams also smooth

IS ruins the end of panned shots

S
 
OK, here's the ultimate input on this -- read it (posted 3 days ago [ LINK ] by John Chardine):

«I finally had a chance to bring up this topic with Chuck Westfall- Canon USA technical guru. He was kind enough to send me some Q&As on this topic- answers of course written by Chuck himself. Rather than edit I thought pretty well everything here is relevant to the topic so here it is (by the way just emailed him out of the blue a couple of hours ago so how's that for customer service!:

Note in particular Q8/A8
---------------------------------------------
Q1. The instruction sheets with my IS lenses say to turn the IS function OFF when using a tripod. I have heard other photographers argue the opposite. Would you discuss the pros/cons of this?
A1. The answer depends on which type of IS lens you're talking about. With the IS super-telephotos (200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS) as well as the 400/4 DO IS, it's OK to leave IS turned on when the lens is mounted on a tripod. For older-vintage IS lenses introduced before 1999 (28-135/3.5-5.6 IS, 75-300/4-5.6 IS, 100-400/4.5-5.6L IS, and 300/4L IS), it is much better to shut off the IS function when the lens is mounted on a tripod. For other IS lenses, see A9.
Here's the explanation for the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS lenses:

Q2. The instruction manual warns that the IS stays on after pressing the shutter button half way, and that use of IS on a tripod may damage the lens.
A2. Here's what the instruction book says (page E-8): "Do not set the image stabilizer switch to 'I' when using the camera on a tripod. Doing so may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically. Turn the image stabilizer off '0' before using the camera on a tripod."
There is no language here or anywhere else in the instructions concerning damage to the 28-135 IS caused by using the camera on a tripod. All they're saying is that using IS while the camera is on a tripod "may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically."

Q3. Why does tripod use cause a problem with the older IS lenses?
A3. Short explanation: The IS mechanism operates by correcting shake. With the older IS lenses (the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS), when there is no shake, or when the level of shake is below the threshold of the system's detection capability, use of the IS feature may actually *add* unwanted blur to the photograph, therefore you should shut it off in this situation.
Longer explanation: Remember that the IS lens group is normally locked into place. When the IS function is active, the IS lens group is unlocked so it can be moved by the electromagnetic coil surrounding the elements. With the older IS lenses (the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS), when there's not enough motion for the IS system to detect, the result can sometimes be a sort of electronic "feedback loop," somewhat analogous to the ringing noise of an audio feedback loop we're all familiar with. As a result, the IS lens group might move while the lens is on a tripod, unless the IS function is switched off and the IS lens group is locked into place.

Q4. Is IS best kept off, then turned on for each shot as needed, then turned off again, much as one would use the exposure compensation dial?
A4. For most hand-held work, leave the switch on; for tripod work, shut it off, as noted in the instruction book.
The recommendations above do *not* apply for the 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS. Here is some information for them:

Q5. [with 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS , 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS] Does IS operate when the lens is on a tripod or not??
A5. I can positively confirm that it does, and quite well as a matter of proven fact.

Q6. The Owner's Manual (page 12) says it does not.
A6. I know. But testing indicates otherwise.

Q7. Canon Inc.'s EF Lens Tech Report (Vol. 13) implies that it disengages but then says it stabilizes when using a tripod.
A7. I see no such implication. My copy of this report says: "With previous IS lenses, it was necessary to turn off the Image Stabilizer when using a tripod because it might operate incorrectly. But the Image Stabilizer installed on these IS lenses has an additional function that prevents improper operation when using a tripod. It also corrects camera vibration caused by slow shutter photography when using a tripod: a common problem with Super Telephoto lenses. About one second after the shutter is pressed halfway, the unit automatically determines that a tripod is being used from the output of a vibration gyro." These statements are 100% accurate based on my testing. There are no other references to the use of IS on a tripod anywhere in this report, as far as I can tell.

Q8. My own guess is this. When the tripod/head is rigid and there is little or no vibration, IS does disengage. When you loosen the head -- as for following birds in flight -- the gyros sense some vibration and the IS begins to operate again.
A8. This is not quite right. Based on my own personal testing and observation, as well as a personal consultation with one of Canon Inc.'s chief executives in the Lens Division, these lenses effectively have 2 IS modes *within Mode 1.* The decision on which mode will be used is made by the equipment, not the photographer, based on an evaluation of the degree of detected movement, as follows:
When the lens is mounted on a steady tripod and the shutter button is pressed halfway, the IS begins to operate immediately and the image in the viewfinder goes through a very slow vertical shift for about 1 second. After that, if the shutter button continues to be pressed halfway, the IS mechanism automatically goes into a special mode which is designed to detect and correct for mirror slap and shutter movement at slow shutter speeds. Based on my personal testing, it does this job spectacularly well. Close examination of results from shooting tests definitively proves that there is no advantage to be gained by shutting off IS, or even by locking the mirror prior to exposure.
When the lens is mounted on a monopod or hand-held *and* the gyro sensors detect movement exceeding a certain rate, the IS mechanism switches into its conventional correction mode which is designed to compensate for relatively gross and/or erratic lens movement.
So, what you're seeing when you loosen the ball head and start moving the lens is essentially an automatic switchover from "tripod IS" to "conventional IS."

Q9. With regards to the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM lens, notwithstanding the battery power considerations mentioned in the manual, does this lens have the ability to detect when it's on a tripod?
A9. The EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM (along with most other IS lenses released after 1999) has the ability to detect when it is mounted on a tripod. If you keep the shutter button half-pressed, or better yet, use a remote switch to simulate a half-press, the stabilizer mechanism will drift the image downwards for the first second or so, then the mechanism will stop moving. (It's for this reason as well as battery power conservation issues that the instruction booklet recommends shutting off the IS system while the lens is mounted on a tripod.) You can see the effect if you look through the viewfinder while half-pressing the shutter button. However, it is important to understand that this form of disabling is different than shutting off the IS function with the mode switch on the lens. In the latter case, the IS mechanism is centered and locked into place, whereas in the former case, the IS mechanism shifts the image downward slightly for a second or so, then stops moving. It's not moving, but it's not centered or locked, either. It's effectively on standby, so that it can resume its corrective capabilities instantly if movement is detected. Again, you can see this for yourself by looking through the viewfinder while pressing the shutter button halfway for at least several seconds, assuming the lens is mounted on a tripod and the IS switch is on. To my way of thinking, this is not the optimum way to use the equipment. In my opinion, if you use the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM on a tripod, it would be best to turn off the IS mechanism via the switch on the lens, rather than depending on the tripod detection capabilities of the IS mechanism.
Here is a list of IS lenses released as of August 10, 2009 that are similar to the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM in terms of their behavior when used on a tripod:
EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
EF-S 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
EF 24-105mm f/4L IS USM
EF 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6L IS USM
EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS
EF 70-200mm f/4L IS USM
EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

Q10. [In terms of Canon lenses,] should I use IS Mode 2 all the time? If not, why?
A10. The answer to these questions largely depends on whether you're shooting hand held or from a tripod. For hand-held photography, I recommend Mode 1 for stationary subjects and Mode 2 for panning, with any IS lens that has both modes. When using a tripod, the first thing you need to think about is whether to use IS at all. Unless you are using one of our IS super-telephoto lenses (i.e., 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS, 800/5.6L IS), I recommend shutting off the IS for best results. If you are using one of the aforementioned IS super-telephoto lenses on a tripod, the choice between Mode 1 and Mode 2 is largely a matter of personal taste. If there is any possibility of panning, Mode 2 is best. If not, it doesn't make any difference.
(For the benefit of readers who might be unfamiliar with Canon’s nomenclature, Mode 1 on an IS lens attempts to compensate for vertical and horizontal camera movement simultaneously. Mode 2 shuts off IS in the panning direction when panning is detected.)

Q11. Could you please clarify the operation of Mode 2 (panning) IS on the Canon EF70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM lens? Does it work correctly only when panning across the long axis of the frame (horizontally) or is it smart enough to detect a smooth pan in any orientation/direction and correct for vibrations perpendicular to that detected axis (even diagonally, for instance)?
A11. Every Canon Image Stabilizer lens has two "gyro sensors" oriented at right angles to each other. If the IS lens has a Mode 2 setting, it compensates for panning by shutting off image stabilization in the direction that is parallel to the panning movement. With this system, it's entirely possible to compensate effectively for panning in any direction, even diagonally. It also makes no difference whether the camera is held horizontally, vertically, or diagonally with respect to the horizon line of the image.»

Other interesting bibliography about Canon lenses:

(same Chuck Westfall- Canon USA technical guru)
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0808/tech-tips.html

http://nobell.org/~gjm/photography/lenses.html

http://www.usa.canon.com/app/pdf/lens/EFLensChart.pdf
 
WOW

Emanuel said:
OK, here's the ultimate input on this -- read it (posted 3 days ago [ LINK ] by John Chardine):

«I finally had a chance to bring up this topic with Chuck Westfall- Canon USA technical guru. He was kind enough to send me some Q&As on this topic- answers of course written by Chuck himself. Rather than edit I thought pretty well everything here is relevant to the topic so here it is (by the way just emailed him out of the blue a couple of hours ago so how's that for customer service!:

Note in particular Q8/A8
---------------------------------------------
Q1. The instruction sheets with my IS lenses say to turn the IS function OFF when using a tripod. I have heard other photographers argue the opposite. Would you discuss the pros/cons of this?
A1. The answer depends on which type of IS lens you're talking about. With the IS super-telephotos (200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS) as well as the 400/4 DO IS, it's OK to leave IS turned on when the lens is mounted on a tripod. For older-vintage IS lenses introduced before 1999 (28-135/3.5-5.6 IS, 75-300/4-5.6 IS, 100-400/4.5-5.6L IS, and 300/4L IS), it is much better to shut off the IS function when the lens is mounted on a tripod. For other IS lenses, see A9.
Here's the explanation for the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS lenses:

Q2. The instruction manual warns that the IS stays on after pressing the shutter button half way, and that use of IS on a tripod may damage the lens.
A2. Here's what the instruction book says (page E-8): "Do not set the image stabilizer switch to 'I' when using the camera on a tripod. Doing so may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically. Turn the image stabilizer off '0' before using the camera on a tripod."
There is no language here or anywhere else in the instructions concerning damage to the 28-135 IS caused by using the camera on a tripod. All they're saying is that using IS while the camera is on a tripod "may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically."

Q3. Why does tripod use cause a problem with the older IS lenses?
A3. Short explanation: The IS mechanism operates by correcting shake. With the older IS lenses (the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS), when there is no shake, or when the level of shake is below the threshold of the system's detection capability, use of the IS feature may actually *add* unwanted blur to the photograph, therefore you should shut it off in this situation.
Longer explanation: Remember that the IS lens group is normally locked into place. When the IS function is active, the IS lens group is unlocked so it can be moved by the electromagnetic coil surrounding the elements. With the older IS lenses (the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS), when there's not enough motion for the IS system to detect, the result can sometimes be a sort of electronic "feedback loop," somewhat analogous to the ringing noise of an audio feedback loop we're all familiar with. As a result, the IS lens group might move while the lens is on a tripod, unless the IS function is switched off and the IS lens group is locked into place.

Q4. Is IS best kept off, then turned on for each shot as needed, then turned off again, much as one would use the exposure compensation dial?
A4. For most hand-held work, leave the switch on; for tripod work, shut it off, as noted in the instruction book.
The recommendations above do *not* apply for the 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS. Here is some information for them:

Q5. [with 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS , 600/4L IS and 800/5.6L IS] Does IS operate when the lens is on a tripod or not??
A5. I can positively confirm that it does, and quite well as a matter of proven fact.

Q6. The Owner's Manual (page 12) says it does not.
A6. I know. But testing indicates otherwise.

Q7. Canon Inc.'s EF Lens Tech Report (Vol. 13) implies that it disengages but then says it stabilizes when using a tripod.
A7. I see no such implication. My copy of this report says: "With previous IS lenses, it was necessary to turn off the Image Stabilizer when using a tripod because it might operate incorrectly. But the Image Stabilizer installed on these IS lenses has an additional function that prevents improper operation when using a tripod. It also corrects camera vibration caused by slow shutter photography when using a tripod: a common problem with Super Telephoto lenses. About one second after the shutter is pressed halfway, the unit automatically determines that a tripod is being used from the output of a vibration gyro." These statements are 100% accurate based on my testing. There are no other references to the use of IS on a tripod anywhere in this report, as far as I can tell.

Q8. My own guess is this. When the tripod/head is rigid and there is little or no vibration, IS does disengage. When you loosen the head -- as for following birds in flight -- the gyros sense some vibration and the IS begins to operate again.
A8. This is not quite right. Based on my own personal testing and observation, as well as a personal consultation with one of Canon Inc.'s chief executives in the Lens Division, these lenses effectively have 2 IS modes *within Mode 1.* The decision on which mode will be used is made by the equipment, not the photographer, based on an evaluation of the degree of detected movement, as follows:
When the lens is mounted on a steady tripod and the shutter button is pressed halfway, the IS begins to operate immediately and the image in the viewfinder goes through a very slow vertical shift for about 1 second. After that, if the shutter button continues to be pressed halfway, the IS mechanism automatically goes into a special mode which is designed to detect and correct for mirror slap and shutter movement at slow shutter speeds. Based on my personal testing, it does this job spectacularly well. Close examination of results from shooting tests definitively proves that there is no advantage to be gained by shutting off IS, or even by locking the mirror prior to exposure.
When the lens is mounted on a monopod or hand-held *and* the gyro sensors detect movement exceeding a certain rate, the IS mechanism switches into its conventional correction mode which is designed to compensate for relatively gross and/or erratic lens movement.
So, what you're seeing when you loosen the ball head and start moving the lens is essentially an automatic switchover from "tripod IS" to "conventional IS."

Q9. With regards to the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM lens, notwithstanding the battery power considerations mentioned in the manual, does this lens have the ability to detect when it's on a tripod?
A9. The EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM (along with most other IS lenses released after 1999) has the ability to detect when it is mounted on a tripod. If you keep the shutter button half-pressed, or better yet, use a remote switch to simulate a half-press, the stabilizer mechanism will drift the image downwards for the first second or so, then the mechanism will stop moving. (It's for this reason as well as battery power conservation issues that the instruction booklet recommends shutting off the IS system while the lens is mounted on a tripod.) You can see the effect if you look through the viewfinder while half-pressing the shutter button. However, it is important to understand that this form of disabling is different than shutting off the IS function with the mode switch on the lens. In the latter case, the IS mechanism is centered and locked into place, whereas in the former case, the IS mechanism shifts the image downward slightly for a second or so, then stops moving. It's not moving, but it's not centered or locked, either. It's effectively on standby, so that it can resume its corrective capabilities instantly if movement is detected. Again, you can see this for yourself by looking through the viewfinder while pressing the shutter button halfway for at least several seconds, assuming the lens is mounted on a tripod and the IS switch is on. To my way of thinking, this is not the optimum way to use the equipment. In my opinion, if you use the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM on a tripod, it would be best to turn off the IS mechanism via the switch on the lens, rather than depending on the tripod detection capabilities of the IS mechanism.
Here is a list of IS lenses released as of August 10, 2009 that are similar to the EF70-200mm f/4L IS USM in terms of their behavior when used on a tripod:
EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
EF-S 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
EF 24-105mm f/4L IS USM
EF 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6L IS USM
EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS
EF 70-200mm f/4L IS USM
EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

Q10. [In terms of Canon lenses,] should I use IS Mode 2 all the time? If not, why?
A10. The answer to these questions largely depends on whether you're shooting hand held or from a tripod. For hand-held photography, I recommend Mode 1 for stationary subjects and Mode 2 for panning, with any IS lens that has both modes. When using a tripod, the first thing you need to think about is whether to use IS at all. Unless you are using one of our IS super-telephoto lenses (i.e., 200/2L IS, 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 400/4 DO IS, 500/4L IS, 600/4L IS, 800/5.6L IS), I recommend shutting off the IS for best results. If you are using one of the aforementioned IS super-telephoto lenses on a tripod, the choice between Mode 1 and Mode 2 is largely a matter of personal taste. If there is any possibility of panning, Mode 2 is best. If not, it doesn't make any difference.
(For the benefit of readers who might be unfamiliar with Canon’s nomenclature, Mode 1 on an IS lens attempts to compensate for vertical and horizontal camera movement simultaneously. Mode 2 shuts off IS in the panning direction when panning is detected.)

Q11. Could you please clarify the operation of Mode 2 (panning) IS on the Canon EF70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM lens? Does it work correctly only when panning across the long axis of the frame (horizontally) or is it smart enough to detect a smooth pan in any orientation/direction and correct for vibrations perpendicular to that detected axis (even diagonally, for instance)?
A11. Every Canon Image Stabilizer lens has two "gyro sensors" oriented at right angles to each other. If the IS lens has a Mode 2 setting, it compensates for panning by shutting off image stabilization in the direction that is parallel to the panning movement. With this system, it's entirely possible to compensate effectively for panning in any direction, even diagonally. It also makes no difference whether the camera is held horizontally, vertically, or diagonally with respect to the horizon line of the image.»

Other interesting bibliography about Canon lenses:

(same Chuck Westfall- Canon USA technical guru)
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0808/tech-tips.html

http://nobell.org/~gjm/photography/lenses.html

http://www.usa.canon.com/app/pdf/lens/EFLensChart.pdf
Click to expand...

Many thanks!!!
 
Yes, the forum from where's coming is birdphotographers.net, not bird cinematographers ;-) But the info is there, the glass behaves like that. You can adapt the features in behalf of your needs. Hope the technical description helps.

As everything in life, the gear should be translated to its own use. Nothing is taken as granted. It is also a matter of learning to deal with the tools. That's it, just tools. There's no magic potion dealing with stabilization technology on the moving image side either.
 
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