Another lucrative "no pay" Craigslist job post

mainstreetprod

mainstreetprod

Veteran
[h=2]What more can I say? Job text below:


Short Film Music Video (Down town)[/h]
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compensation: Internship



This is a cinematic music video for an up coming music artist.. We are open to creative suggestions and input. The short is about 3-5 minutes long. It's a nice creative piece to put on your reel and won't take up too much of your time. It is a half day shoot. Must be available on the 22nd and 23rd of August.

WHAT WE OFFER:
-Hands on training
-On screen production credits
-Opportunities for creative input
-Lunch will be provided

WE NEED:
-CAMERA PERSON (with editing skills) (SFX are a plus)
-PRODUCTION ASSISTANTS (must be flexible to play multiple roles)
-MAKE- UP ARTISTS
-MUSIC SUPERVISOR/DIALOGUE EDITOR
-SET DESIGNER (mostly set dressing)
 
Millions of people have cameras now that make awesome images and are easy to use. They cannot get paying jobs for using those cameras because they don't have the experience or talent, or they don't want paying jobs because they only want to shoot what they want to shoot because it's fun, just like some people like to paint or play the guitar even though they don't do it for money. This is not going to change any time soon so you might as well get used to it. I suggest you don't answer these ads if you are getting paid for your talents with the camera and/or lighting.

I am willing to bet someone will answer this ad and they will shoot the video and have a lot of fun doing it.
When it stops being fun and they want to do it for a career they won't answer ads like this any more.
 
Yes. I mean, probably not all such ads get any takers, but I bet some do. It's all about fun - if it sounds fun, people will do it; they may not be pros, or even any good, but there will be some warm bodies. I've seen much worse ads out there, where not only are you getting no compensation, but it sounds like a lot of work that's not going to be terribly exciting like shooting some restaurant menu ad, and the "producer" and "director" have a whole list of demands on top of that... those are the ads that make me wonder - I cannot imagine anyone would agree to it, but yet, if nobody ever did, they wouldn't be making those ads, no? The world is mysterious and contains multitudes - just because you or I don't understand it, doesn't mean it isn't reality. Somebody is making those crappy ads, and somebody is responding. But I doubt it really affects the market for pros or anyone who actually gets paid, my feeling is that if nobody responds, it's not like they would at that point think "I must pay people", but more like "well, this project ain't happenin'", in other words, no "jobs" are being lost for the pros or semi pros because somebody responds to such an ad. BWDIK.
 
OldCorpse said:
But I doubt it really affects the market for pros or anyone who actually gets paid, my feeling is that if nobody responds, it's not like they would at that point think "I must pay people", but more like "well, this project ain't happenin'", in other words, no "jobs" are being lost for the pros or semi pros because somebody responds to such an ad. BWDIK.
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People that want to play movie maker answer these ads, and there's an endless supply of them now that great cameras and lights are so reasonably priced these days. The people making these ads will never pay for your professional services, and they will never have to. There's always someone graduating high school or college buying some new camera gear and wanting to play movie maker. They just need something to point their camera at, and these ads provide that.

Professionals shouldn't get bent out of shape about it. This isn't Nike or Toyota shooting a commercial and trying to cut corners.
 
Scott F said:
I'm not getting bent out of shape (and I'm *NOT* a professional either) but I do get a kick out of these posts in the Cafe. I can't lie, they make me laugh.

My 2 cents: It is nervy to have these lists of demands when the compensation you are offering is the word "Internship".

At the end of the day, you get what you pay for. This guy may luck out and get a person(s) with good gear & desire to work for free.


I mean c'mon, if the OP didn't post up, we wouldn't get comedy like this ^
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Agreed. I'm not really posting these to complain. To me, they are good for laughs.
 
At least the gigs in your area are not GROSS like they are in my neck of the woods. I can't believe some of the stuff people post in my area. Just the nastiest sort of folks posting the most ridiculous gigs.
 
It's probably not nearly as bad as Vancouver. Every other ad wants someone to work for free with a: "it will look great on your portfolio!." The job market here is too saturated and everyone pays s*%t.
 
Scott F said:
My 2 cents: It is nervy to have these lists of demands when the compensation you are offering is the word "Internship".
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I don't see it as them 'demanding' anything. They're asking. They're hoping. It never hurts to ask. And you'd be amazed what you can get sometimes.

Over a decade ago, when I made my very first film -- the dramatic short 'Three Wishes' -- nobody in the business knew me from Adam's house cat. Even so, I got a director who drove from Orlando, FL to Charlotte, NC on his own dime, brought 2 DVCAM camcorders and a light kit, and directed, shot and edited the film for free. He did a pretty decent job, all things considered. I was green back then, of course. But the film got finished -- which is more than a lot of folks can say about their first attempt. It even got into a film festival -- the only one I submitted it to.

If you have a good script and any kind of track record, there are people who will give it their very best effort just to get the credit and footage for their reel. God bless 'em!

That being said, you should always pay people if you can. That goes without saying. But there are talented people out there willing to work for free in order to get a good film on their resume.
 
they may work for free and they may be good, but many times it will also take you 3 years to get something done that would have taken two weeks had you paid everyone, due to those good folks having to backburner your project when a paying gig comes along.
 
Josh Bass said:
they may work for free and they may be good, but many times it will also take you 3 years to get something done that would have taken two weeks had you paid everyone, due to those good folks having to backburner your project when a paying gig comes along.
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That's true. But if you have time and no money, then this is the way you go.
 
i think there is a real danger in a project dragging on like that. crew lose interest. actors lose interest. FILMMAKERS can lose interest because of the seemingly endless uphill battle to get something that seemed so simple done. passion only takes you so far.
 
Josh Bass said:
i think there is a real danger in a project dragging on like that. crew lose interest. actors lose interest. FILMMAKERS can lose interest because of the seemingly endless uphill battle to get something that seemed so simple done. passion only takes you so far.
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there's a real simple solution to that - just make sure your project is so compelling, so attractive, such a good piece of art, that everyone wants to be involved and their enthusiasm doesn't flag :)... of course, if you have such a project, before you know it, it gets financing because people want to finance good projects, period, and good projects are rare, so when one comes along, they'll gladly throw money at it - at which point you can pay people and all those issues of "lose interest" go away :). In other words, money is particularly important when the project is underwhelming, and you need to pay people to maintain their enthusiasm for the money because sure as heck it won't be enthusiasm for the project. As so often in life, those who need it least because they already have the most will get even more - in this case, those with a great project (i.e. those who already have the most), are the ones who need the money the least (because people would love to work on such a project for free), and it is them who will get the money anyway. Ain't that the truth :)!

But back to our ad - "you want me to work on your project for free? tell me more about it, let me read the script etc., and then I'll tell you if I'll do it" "well, let me tell you up front, the project stinks, which is why we need you to work for free, because nobody wants to give us the money for a project that stinks! so, interested in working for free on this really stinky project" "wow, that sounds perfect, because my skills stink, so it'll fit the stinky project really well!" "fantastic, a stinky project, executed by people who have no skills, the result will really stink!" "so what's in it for me?" "think of what a great resume builder you'll have when you can show people this stinky project!" and so on goes the conversation.
 
Josh Bass said:
i think there is a real danger in a project dragging on like that. crew lose interest. actors lose interest. FILMMAKERS can lose interest because of the seemingly endless uphill battle to get something that seemed so simple done. passion only takes you so far.
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You're right, there is a serious danger of that. I got lucky on my feature 'Afterlife'. Even though everyone worked on deferred pay, and many had a 4-hour drive to come on shoot days, everyone hung with us -- despite the fact that it took us nearly a year of shooting on weekends and holidays to get it in the can. We had very dedicated people, but it's true that you can easily lose folks if a shoot takes too long.
 
thanks. again, passion only takes you so far. generally, in my limited experience, it is only the core people (writer, director, maybe a few others) who see the "big picture" of how "great" their project is, actors and crew who are volunteering just see the bits and pieces theyre doing each day. not saying they dont read the script, but over time as the shoot drags on and on they only think of the little chunk theyre doing each day instead of that big picture, and it starts to not seem so great or exciting, and wears them down as seemingly endless demands are made on their time over a long period by the core filmmakers. not to mention the continuity errors actors can cause by getting haircuts, gaining/losing weight, getting pregnant, getting goat legs to replace their regular legs, whatever. and why shouldnt they? its just a volunteer gig theyre doing as a favor on weekends, you know, their OFF TIME?
 
David W. Richardson said:
I wish I could find financing that easily for 'A Scottish Fling'. It's a great rom-com with a great script.
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Only two possibilities: (1) You have not looked for the money in the right places, shown to the right people, marketed it appropriately or (2) it is in fact not "a great script" in the judgment of the people with control of the money.

That said, I am sympathetic. Because sometimes (1) is self-determined and a conscious choice. You may simply not even look for money, period. I understand that perfectly. I have a script that I want to do, but I will not look for money, and I will insist on doing it myself for almost no money. Reason #1 why I won't look for money - I have zero desire to lose a single second looking for money... I have one friend who has been looking for money for his film for 5 years now, countless hours and immense energy and efforts, and has not found it... my position is different - even if I found it, the loss of those 6-8-12 months is just not worth it to me, as time is more important (to me). I'd rather not burn my brain cells on raising money - yes, I made a choice, I'd rather not have it, and finance on my own. Reason #2: I want to do exactly what I want, with zero input from the money people. If you ask for money, be prepared to bend to the wishes - you don't want that, don't take the money. Reason #3: psychological freedom: "OK, here's the money, no conditions" "Very grateful, but I have to refuse - the film will not make back any money at all, and I feel it would be wrong for me to lose someone else's money - I'm happy to lose my own."; besides, there is psychology (mine, perhaps not yours): even if someone hands me the money with zero conditions, and zero expectations of making it back, I cannot accept it, because I will be influenced subconsciously by that fact - I might pull back, or otherwise alter, even subconsciously, what I do, because of an unspoken thought and self-imposed expectation "ooh, I don't want to outrage, disappoint, offend or otherwise cause stress to the person who gave me the money"... and so I might strike that scene or alter it subconsciously so as to meet those unspoken expectations (even if self-imposed). I want total freedom of the mind. And so, there is no sense in my bothering to look for money, or accept it in the unlikely event it's handed to me. But on the upside, I will not ask you - a stranger - to work on my project for free... the free labor will come from my wife, and a couple of friends who are of the "got your back unconditionally" variety (not everyone does) - so you'll never see a Craigslist ad from me :)
 
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