All usage on those films was for "specialty shots". Red Tails especially was primarily shot on a F35, not the 5D.
ALl-I Or IPB on MKIII?
- Thread starter Kholi
- Start date
All usage on those films was for "specialty shots". Red Tails especially was primarily shot on a F35, not the 5D.
marvinhello
Well-known member
Yeah, my point was DSLR shots intercut vey well with those highend cameras like F35
In "Act of Valor" 5D2 footage mixed perfectly with film.
What do you mean by "mixed"? It's not like the wides are F35s and the closeups are 5D2. The footage is either on screen for a split second or in sequences which can alter the look given the circumstances of the narrative.
I meant 1080/60p, not dSLRs in general. Although the 5DIII is pretty soft. Re: 1080/60p--it's useful in theory, but for the shoots that demand slow motion you can just rent an Epic or Phantom and if you can't afford that 720/60p isn't materially worse for vimeo or whatever, which is 90% of this slight slow motion test shoot garbage ends up. The 5DIII's lack of resolution and poor sharpening algorithm are vastly more serious problems than its lack of 1080/60p. What percentage of commercial footage is shot in slow motion? Less than 1% I'm sure. What percentage of commercial footage is shot in true 1080p or better? A pretty substantial percentage. We need more sharpness.... Even the GH2 has enough, but not the 5DIII. This is its greatest weakness. By far. Don't say do it in post--that brings out compression artifacts and takes more time than I have.
I know dSLRs are used in movies as crash cams all the time. Just shot some 7D/5DIII footage for a feature for Universal the other week... Did I use slow motion? No. Is the dSLR footage too soft to cut against the Alexa footage? In places it's borderline...
I'm not trying to offend anyone and certainly not dissing dSLRs (I love them), just pushing hard for a feature I think we need--improved in-camera sharpening. Canon has a bad algorithm for video and for stills. Even raws developed in dxo look much better than those developed in dpp or in-camera jpegs if you apply sharpening.
Focus peaking and zebras would be great, too!
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DendriteStudios
Active member
When your work involves a lot of action sports that end up on the big screen across the world, 1080/60p is a huge concern. The difference in quality between 1080 and 720 on canon dslr's is huge. Renting doesn't cut it when I am potentially in the middle of nowhere for a month on end living in tents. I need to own for that type of work I do. Two sides to every coin. Whatever magic lantern gets done will be an awesome improvement. We know that based on their other work. I wish them the best of luck. If they can make 1080/60p work I'll purchase a 5dIII and give magic lantern a sizeable donation.
Dave ©
Well-known member
Seems like we've covered this one numerous times before. According to Shane Hurlbut -- who should know, 75% of Act of Valor was shot on the 5DII, even before it could shoot 24p or real 29.97. I suppose that if the entire film was made from "specialty shots" then you may be correct. In as much as the aerial shots could be considered specialty shots or otherwise, those were primarily shot on the Sony (per Shane) due to concerns about moire with water and forest patterns, etc.
djkarn105
Well-known member
Yes but the amount of post processing, roto and paint that goes into those shots is more than the entire budget of the average DVXUser's show. Having processed 5D footage for the highest of high end VFX studios, the workflow is something like this:
1) The DIT cooks up a picture profile that best suits the shot
2) Test footage of that profile is sent to the VFX house where an engineer reverse engineers the best way to unpack the footage into 10bit DPX or EXR.
3) The footage is converted and sent to the roto paint department where it sees a denoise and sharpening pass and any aliasing, moire or rolling shutter artifacts are corrected.
4) Since it's probably green screen footage or a background plate it is sent to the compositor who proceeds to blur and or sharpen the footage to make it look realistic.
You're talking about a weeks worth of work by some very talented VFX artists on a 30 second shot.
galbach
Well-known member
Act of Valor used the 5d for a more than just "Specialty Shots" http://www.hurlbutvisuals.com/blog/2012/05/act-of-valor-workflow/
willardjackson
Member
Leave it to DVXusers to turn a thread about which codec is best to use on a camera to cat fight about whether the camera is good enough for the big screen. I see the same arguments in every thread. I think we should get this thread back on track to which codec is better, and if anyone has any insights as to if more can be squeezed out of the all-i codec. I think it would be more productive for us all.
willardjackson
Member
I could be more condescending, but having followed these forums for years before I even signed up I know how these threads get hijacked and then become useless. I for one would still like to know what people are using more. IPB or All-I. I think All-I would benefit me more because I have a almost three year old mbp and it would edit faster on cs6, but some people are saying there is macro blocking in the codec that isn't in the IPB. So it seams both codecs have pros and cons. I just wonder which codec has the most pros over cons.
That whole process happens for every material, no matter what it has been shot on. Red material is always converted to 10-bit dpx files at our post house too. Stuff shot on Alexa and RED will sometimes be degrained and re-grained, stuff shot with 35mm will always be somewhat "fixed". Aliasing and rolling shutters are sometimes impossible to fix properly too, but usually those shots are cut out.
I think you are somewhat confused as what does a "roto paint department" have to do with denoising etc?
In grading we start adding grain and matching the looks properly, not in the VFX plates.
People think this happens with JUST dslr material? Think again, it happens with every material, no matter what camera shot it.
And back to the question, I too would love to know the real cons and pros about All-I vs IPB. Though will do my own tests when I get the cam
dustylense
Veteran
It's simple guys... Canon made the all I codec to edit easier in NLE's natively, thats about it.
Magic Lantern may have added features that some find make the camera easier to use but they have not improved the video quality at all even though you can muck about altering the recording bit rate. 720/60p has never been implemented for the 5D2.
juanjosefe
New member
Marvin, as the resolution of the 5D3 can't be improved... with Magic Lantern some day, can it record in-camera, for example 1,5K (3000x1500), and then, in-post downsize to 1920x1080? Can this be possible?
marvinhello
Well-known member
Well, anything is possible, it's just we don't know how to dig that deep yet.
5D3 ALL-I mode uses H264 High Profile Level 5.1, this level supports the following formats:
1,920×1,080@max 120.5fps
2,560×1,920@max 51.2fps
4,096×2,048@max 30.0fps
4,096×2,304@max 26.7fps
Considering the thermal design and other factors, I think 2,560×1,920 @24fps looks doable, it's just a question of how?
juanjosefe
New member
That would be really dreamy!! I really can't imagine how difficult should be all this programming and codecs!!! EDIT: Thanks for all the work of Magic Lantern Group!!
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marvinhello
Well-known member
Not "mine"... The real work is done by Alex, G3gg0 and Indy, et al...
willardjackson
Member
Marvin, is there a place with up to date info on the work of Alex, G3gg0 and Indy? I've seen the Magic Lantern google group, but i seems like the hackers don't post much. Maybe i'm missing something. Maybe a blog or something on the progress.