Advice on buying: HPX170 vs all

Well, others will have more experience with the VDSLRs and hopefully will weigh in, but I'd say given the low-light capabilities, the fact that you'll have a real crew recording sound, and the goal for maximum resolution, I'd look at the GH1, the 5D and the other cameras in that range.
 
stephenmick said:
Looking at the original post, my concerns would be shooting with the 170 at night, in urban areas, without supplemental light. Depending on the exact nature of the lighting and the situation, the 170 may not be the best choice.
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So what are the better low-light cameras in this price range ?

- Sony EX-1/3 : 1 stop better, but I'm not keen on giving up the Panasonic look or having to deal with the extra weight of the EX cameras.

- Canon 5D MKII : Many stops better, but the 5D comes with a lot of DSLR as video camera baggage. The strong rolling-shutter effect means that this camera has to be on sticks or properly stablized to get a good shot. ( I am hoping that Canon brings out a newer model to fix this within the next year )
 
Thanks Stephen and Dingo

I think the Ex1 is a bit out of my price range.

Other than that, i would like to know more about the GH1 Dingo.
 
I don't think the OP has a Panny camera, so he won't have to worry about giving up the "look" or "mojo."

While I think there are going to be a number of newer models coming out in the next year or so, the fact is that CMOS is what it is. Canon or Sony or whomever else may find a way to mitigate or manage it better, but rolling shutter effects will remain. The question is how you use the camera. I would say that "on sticks" and "properly stabilized" describe the setup of just about every commercial or feature shoot I've stepped foot on. Understand what the limitations of the camera are and you can make it work for you.

I think one just has to look at some of the GH1 footage around to see that this might be a good solution to the OP's needs. Low light looks good. JDS's action short looked very nice. And given the price point for both the camera and media, I'd say it's a strong contender for this guy's needs.

If only there were some available for him to buy.

Again, while I've used the HVX200, the HPX170 and the EX1, I don't feel confident in telling the OP that they're the right choice for him based on his situation. Great cameras, for sure. Just maybe not for his needs.
 
Remember, information and advice are just that. You need to find these cameras and check them out yourself if at all possible. That's the only real way you'll know what they're capable of. Find a rental house or retailer near you and get hands on with any camera you're looking into.
 
Untitled04 said:
Hey Stephen,

It will be little to no crew most of the time. I will have a DP, but with not much experience, so little input. And as I've said before, the film will not have many setups as the majority of the shots will be without movement, long takes, long shots, but obviously nothing longer than 12 minutes. Best way to think about it, my style is very much minimalist along the lines of Ozu, Takeshi Kitano, Kiarostomi, Melville, any Taiwanese new wave director (i.e. hou hsao hsien) So basically, I am not trying to make a stylish action movie.

And lastly, sound is of the utmost importance to me, so I will be hiring a professional/s. I just need the picture to hold up on the big screen and work with as much natural lighting as possible.
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I'm stuck waiting for video to encode -- so I'll chime in -- saying up front that I entirely defer to the experts on this forum. So if they say something else -- go with them.

I haven't messed with the Canon -- and I could be mistaken -- but I am under the impression that it only does "30p."

Relative to my understanding -- this is a frame rate originally designed for "web video," -- and relative to my experience converting 30p to 24p (for film or the "movie look") is a disaster. This translates into meaning the Canon offers a "video look" with shallow depth of field -- assuming you use the right lenses.

Getting good low light performance from any camera, including the HPX170, is really an issue of knowing how to use the camera properly to achieve your objectives -- rather than one of buying the right camera. Equipped with the finest camera on earth -- if you don't know how to use it -- you'll end up with stuff that looks worse than pros with old/cheap cameras.

SO -- if you've got money to spend -- have you thought about hiring an experienced camera operator? You may be able to hire a pro for the cost of an HPX/5Dm2 -- and it's likely you'd get vastly better results than winging it with little experience with either a Canon or Panasonic.

Just my thoughts as I wait for video to encode. They're worth exactly what you paid for them.

Good luck!
 
If the requirements are

35mm DOF
NAt Light only
Nights Urban
Skeleton Crew
for under 5K

I would say 5D MK II.

I have the 170 and Love it. Got the letus and all the goodies. If your film is a bit of run-n-gun in all low light a VDSLR might suit you best.
 
stephenmick said:
I would say that "on sticks" and "properly stabilized" describe the setup of just about every commercial or feature shoot I've stepped foot on.
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I've seen lots of great non-stabilized hand held shots from Panasonic / Canon / Sony video cameras.

To date I have not seen one Canon 5D MKII non-stabilized hand held shot that I thought was comparable.
 
I'm not arguing the point, Dingo. I've done plenty of handheld with all three brands of those cameras, and the shots look fine. But it doesn't sound like the kind of shooting the OP is planning. He said the majority of his shots will be "without movement."

I'm not trying to inform you on which camera to look at, but him.
 
I thought Stephenmick had some good advice about a gh1 or 5dii, if it were me and I'm big on audio quality for indie features I'd buy a gh1 or 5dii (remember max 12 min recording time on the 5dii) take the money you save over a hpx or hmc and buy a nice schoeps mic or find a used 416 off ebay for $6-$700, boom pole, audio recorder etc.

5dii rocks at night and gh1 is pretty close to it, also for a night shoot there is a plug in for an editor called neat video that I have had awesome results with from night footage, best $100 I ever spent.

Edit: the neat video plug in removes noise from turning up gain or iso at night
 
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After much consideration, it looks like I'll have to wait for the GH1. Btw, chips, what shoeps mic did you have in mind?
 
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