Adobe rebrands Creative Suite (CS) to "Creative Cloud" (CC) with NEW FEATURES

[Matt Gottshalk]

I agree that the one size fits all model won't work for everyone, but I have been on the "cloud" with Adobe since the beginning and love having the latest updates and improvements as they come, rather than wait 12-18 months for the old software improvement cycle.

One of the Adobe developers also mentioned that older versions of the software (starting with CS6) will always be available to download so that you will always have backward compatibility with older projects (hello Apple).

I personally like opening up Premiere on both my Macbook Pro and my monster PC concurrently with the same license.

It works for me.

 

[Gary Huff]

The software has to phone home to use it so if you're on a computer that has no internet access then how the heck do you use it?

I'm kind of skeptical of this new service, what if I'm out on the field and it requires you to check in to Adobe's cloud storage. Would that mean I won't be able to utilize the program until I connect to the internet? Or would it allow me to continue and will follow-up on a check up the next time I start the program?

As keylight so adequately explained:

I asked this very question at NAB. It needs to phone home at least once every 30 days. If you're constantly offline (say you're traveling) then you can call them up and they'll give you a key code you can use to unlock it for 30 (or was it 45) days. But then you'll need to get on the net within that period so it can phone home again.

Seems fair enough to me.

What's the mininum subscription period? - do you purchase in yearly blocks, or for an initial year then month by month, or what?

You get a lower monthly payment if you sign up for a year. If you need it for just a single month, you can do that too.

Personally I'm getting increasingly fond of Lightworks the more I learn to use it. Pro license is only $60/year. We will subscribe to CS Cloud with the next round of computer updates, well worth the money. But my primary NLE will likely be Lightworks going forward.

I don't get this. Lightworks is unusable for me outside of paying $60 per year. So now it's not so much a subscription based model, which Lightworks totally does have, it's just a matter of it being cheaper. How will you open your projects if you don't cough up another $60 per year? Decode for the codecs that people are primarily shooting requires the paid model.

Well, hell, $60 per years gets me just Lightworks, while a Creative Cloud subscription gets me a raft of amazing software.

I personally like opening up Premiere on both my Macbook Pro and my monster PC concurrently with the same license. It works for me.

My experience too.

 

[GaryinCalifornia]

I asked this very question at NAB. It needs to phone home at least once every 30 days. If you're constantly offline (say you're traveling) then you can call them up and they'll give you a key code you can use to unlock it for 30 (or was it 45) days. But then you'll need to get on the net within that period so it can phone home again.

sorta glad to know... because I live in the country... and my internet some times rides the airwaves... from 4g to nog... but still not thrilled with it... should have did the upgrade to CS6..

 

[Egg Born Son]

Edit: Yep. No more perpetual licensing. Looks like all yur dollars belong to Abobez.....

EDIT: All your dollars are belong to Adobe


I stopped playing computer games with the introduction of steam. First steam game I bought was a large game (30GB) which cost me $40. The key provided was corrupt so after two weeks of arguing with them they finally activated it. It then downloaded the entire game from the internet over the local install. The internet fees for that download cost me over $100 at the time. It still constantly connects itself without my say so and burns through my modest internet limit. And that was for a game. Had issues with the next two purchases too. I love computer games but I haven't bought a game since. It wasn't old age, using my time sensibly or maturity that ended games for me. It was steam. I can only imagine the issues that will occur with this product. I don't truck with this cloud excrement.

When I pay for a product I expect to have that product in perpetuity to use in the manner I see fit. I want a box, packaging and a printed manual. This is what I expect when I pay for things. When something costs over $1000 it should be delivered to my door by bikini girls. In the fight against piracy these companies are only going to drive their last remaining paying customers into downloading. Aside from making us mad enough to finally push aside our morals which have stood resolutely against the tide; by not providing a box, physical installation media, printed manuals etc there is no longer a point of differentiation other than paid or stolen. All they have to do is find the subroutine that calls home and remove it. If I'm going to download for money why wouldn't I download not for money? It's almost the same thing from the consumer end.

The most frustrating thing as a non-downloader is that my friends consistently get better service and response from pirates than I do from the real companies. They think this will protect them from hackers? If it hasn't been cracked already I give it a couple of months. They only way to stop it is to deliver a product that doesn't employ code. Code can never be safe. Downloaders will always steal. They will never catch them, they will never get them as paying customers. They need to find a way to keep the few of us stupid enough to keep paying for things happy with our decision. This is not the way to go about it.

 

[DerekT]

EDIT: All your dollars are belong to Adobe


I stopped playing computer games with the introduction of steam. First steam game I bought was a large game (30GB) which cost me $40. The key provided was corrupt so after two weeks of arguing with them they finally activated it. It then downloaded the entire game from the internet over the local install. The internet fees for that download cost me over $100 at the time. It still constantly connects itself without my say so and burns through my modest internet limit. And that was for a game. Had issues with the next two purchases too. I love computer games but I haven't bought a game since. It wasn't old age, using my time sensibly or maturity that ended games for me. It was steam. I can only imagine the issues that will occur with this product. I don't truck with this cloud excrement.

When I pay for a product I expect to have that product in perpetuity to use in the manner I see fit. I want a box, packaging and a printed manual. This is what I expect when I pay for things. When something costs over $1000 it should be delivered to my door by bikini girls. In the fight against piracy these companies are only going to drive their last remaining paying customers into downloading. Aside from making us mad enough to finally push aside our morals which have stood resolutely against the tide; by not providing a box, physical installation media, printed manuals etc there is no longer a point of differentiation other than paid or stolen. All they have to do is find the subroutine that calls home and remove it. If I'm going to download for money why wouldn't I download not for money? It's almost the same thing from the consumer end.

The most frustrating thing as a non-downloader is that my friends consistently get better service and response from pirates than I do from the real companies. They think this will protect them from hackers? If it hasn't been cracked already I give it a couple of months. They only way to stop it is to deliver a product that doesn't employ code. Code can never be safe. Downloaders will always steal. They will never catch them, they will never get them as paying customers. They need to find a way to keep the few of us stupid enough to keep paying for things happy with our decision. This is not the way to go about it.

Good point, another concern is what if I needed to reinstall my OS for any reason would i have to contact Adobe to reactivate the key? This was a common problem with service such as Steam in which if you had to upgrade your system/ reinstall you would have to call in and verify and at times you end up jumping through hoops just to have them reactivate it.

 

[alaskacameradude]

Incredible disappointment but as others said, not a huge surprise. Very glad I've got CS6 Master Edition.

One of the big consequences of doing this will be, I predict, a dramatic slow down in the development of new features and tools going forward. Sure, there will be minor refinements (like today's announced updates) but they'll have much less incentive to spend on R&D because they don't need to generate enough change to excite customers into buying a $500 upgrade. Now they'll make that $500 (actually $600) every year regardless of whether or not they make improvements.

Oh, and watch for them to cut costs by reducting their labor costs too.

Now that they are essentially the only game in town, and you gotta pay them every month in order to play that game, Adobe has something of a stranglehold on this market, and like Microsoft and IBM before it, Adobe should, and probably will be, investigated before too long.

I predicted this awhile ago and was told that I was just 'stirring the pot'. Yup now with less incentive
to create awesome new features to entice upgrades, they will be more like a cell phone or cable company
providing a monthly service. Screw this, they lost a customer who had just switched to them from FCP 7.
I'll go FCP X before I do creative cloud, nice knowing you Adobe. A PR disaster comparable
to Apple with FCP X in my opinion. As a company you don't want to take options away
from your customers.

 

[deltoidjohn]

The worst new feature is that the new Adobe is only available via creative cloud subscription. You cannot purchase a boxed retail version or stand-alone license.

What do you mean the worst new feature? There were other new features announced today? You wouldn't know it at all... talk about a PR disaster!

I disagree. If you buy a perpetual license CS6 full up suite package, it will cost $2600 today. That's 4+ years worth of cloud subscription to all of Adobe's software products, some of which are not included in CS6. If you do annual updates at $500, that's another $2k.

But what about existing customers? I've already made my investment but now we're being tossed to the wolves in the same boat as new customers, save for the $240 discount on the first year. I already have the full CS6 Suite (well, Productions Premium Suite which has every program I would ever use for my work and more that I've never even touched) and could previously pay about $400 every 18 months (before CS5.5 introduced an annual release cycle) which works out at $22/month. That's if you were upgrading at every new release (actually cheaper for some such as myself, considering their upgrade from CS5.5 to CS6 was free).

Next time I want to upgrade, I'll be locked into paying $50/month - over double what I was paying (so there goes the double platform argument - you could've been upgrading 2 licenses per release for cheaper).

 

[keylight]

EDIT: All your dollars are belong to Adobe

Darn. I always get that wrong! As for the Steam game you talked about, I'm going to make a guess that it was Half-Life 2 (with TF2). Well, maybe not. But your experience with whatever game it was sounds almost identical to my own experience with HL2/TF2.

 

[deltoidjohn]

One of the Adobe developers also mentioned that older versions of the software (starting with CS6) will always be available to download so that you will always have backward compatibility with older projects (hello Apple).

Unless they plan to give you a perpetual license to use older versions (ie, once they release CC2.0 you can download and continue using CC1 or CC1.5 even after you stop subscribing) then it does not really help at all. Backward compatibility has never really been a problem. Any time I've upgraded, I've always been able to open older projects (eg CS3 projects in CS6). The real problem is that once the subscription stops, you lose access to all your current projects. Obviously if you are still working on a project you will keep your subscription current - but what happens later when you stop subscribing for a period, and you need to go back and open up an old project? Do you have to pay for a months subscription (at the stand alone rate of $75/month)?

 

[keylight]

If you buy a perpetual license CS6 full up suite package, it will cost $2600 today. That's 4+ years worth of cloud subscription to all of Adobe's software products, some of which are not included in CS6. If you do annual updates at $500, that's another $2k.

But what about existing customers? I've already made my investment but now we're being tossed to the wolves in the same boat as new customers, save for the $240 discount on the first year.

Razz, I think this article on Adobe's Creative Monopoly does a great job of breaking down numbers and explaining some of the serious problems with what Adobe's done. Worth reading the whole thing, but I'll quote a small part here:

With a mature product like CS6 it becomes much harder to innovate. In fact for many users, the pace of innovation since CS3 has slowed to the point where they forgo upgrading to each new version and instead opt to upgrade every other version. From CS3 to CS5 to CS6 (skipping CS4 and the CS5.5). Rather than spend $600 to upgrade each year, people were spending $600 to upgrade every 2 to 4 years. It’s also notable that Adobe’s release window seemed to contract a bit with each release. The chart on the right show a typical upgrade schedule for many users (in bold).

This was not an ideal situation for Adobe and they set out to find a way to change this pattern. Enter Creative Cloud – a new product that not only promises endless updates to customers, but endless payments to Adobe, whether or not the upgraded features are worth it. Rather than collect $600 every two or three years from perpetually licensed users, they can now collect a full $600 per year from subscribers in perpetuity. They said just this in their March 2013 10Q (left).

“Current” doesn’t mean Adobe will keep you up to date with new features. It means means you will keep Adobe up to date with your payments. Once you’re on the subscription, you’re on it for the rest of your creative life.

And then there's this chart:

 

[refocusedmedia]

You guys really shouldn't compare this to Steam as a negative, considering Steam is a proven success beyond any shadow of a doubt. It is an ingenious platform for gaming, and it works well for that purpose.

As for CC, I just read that although the software needs to check-in every 30 days to verify your subscription status, you can continue using the software up to 180 days offline.

http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#how-works

"You will need to be online when you install and license your software. If you have an annual membership, you'll be asked to connect to the web to validate your software licenses every 30 days. However, you'll be able to use products for 180 days even if you're offline."

 

[Egg Born Son]

I used Steam as an illustration of a wider philosophy than a direct comparison. Steam might work for you but it doesn't work for me. Even if it worked flawlessly it is not what I want, same as pensioners don't want to use an ATM. I don't want, need or use the features people like yourself like. My problem isn't that steam exists, it's that the option has been taken from me and those that like it keep trying to sell me on it but it is fundamentally opposed to my concept of a product. I own a product. I like to be able to dust it off in 10 years and still be functional. Like my PS1. Hell, I still have an Atari 2600. A subscription is a membership. I don't own it.

I also oppose the entire cloud concept. Again I am not alone. I'm not afraid of it (mostly - datamining, one of the key drivers behind these technologies has Orwellian potential), I do understand the concept. But it does not appeal and I oppose it on a fundamental level. And I will be left behind again. I don't facebook, that fact has cost me over half my friends and 90% of my social contact because those that facebook/tweet don't interact outside of it. But I won't be bullied. Maybe I'm backwards but there is no reason my camp, in which I am not alone, can't have the delivery method we want. Other than a decision made in a meeting by people who don't use the product dictating how the people who do use it will. The market is supposed to drive business but I don't see much of that anymore. Consumers do as they are told and a lot of money has been spent to train them to do so over the last decade or two. Or maybe I'm just a nutjob.

 

[refocusedmedia]

A subscription is a membership. I don't own it.

Well, in reality you don't own any software you've purchased. You've been granted an indefinite license.

And cloud tech has its advantages, Steam being a huge one. Another being able to easily restore my iPhone from an iCloud backup. The reason I don't think it's a valid comparison here is because Steam works for 95% of gamers, whereas I think CC is shaping up to be split much more evenly.

But I do agree that the real issue here is that we are being forced to use CC if we want to continue using Adobe, and are unable to choose the option of what delivery method we prefer. I agree that is obnoxious and a completely valid complaint (not to mention justification for dropping Adobe altogether).

You really should get on Twitter though, it's the most important online social tool for filmmakers especially.

 

[OldManVideo]

I'm not a lawyer and I don't even play one on TV; but isn't this bundling? I thought courts ruled you can't sell something with a cluase that you have to buy something else, too.
I realize they are saying it's a rental type of program, but I would like to hear from someone that has more knowledge of law that this may be the case.

Just a thought.

 

[alaskacameradude]

I used Steam as an illustration of a wider philosophy than a direct comparison. Steam might work for you but it doesn't work for me. Even if it worked flawlessly it is not what I want, same as pensioners don't want to use an ATM. I don't want, need or use the features people like yourself like. My problem isn't that steam exists, it's that the option has been taken from me and those that like it keep trying to sell me on it but it is fundamentally opposed to my concept of a product. I own a product. I like to be able to dust it off in 10 years and still be functional. Like my PS1. Hell, I still have an Atari 2600. A subscription is a membership. I don't own it.

I also oppose the entire cloud concept. Again I am not alone. I'm not afraid of it (mostly - datamining, one of the key drivers behind these technologies has Orwellian potential), I do understand the concept. But it does not appeal and I oppose it on a fundamental level. And I will be left behind again. I don't facebook, that fact has cost me over half my friends and 90% of my social contact because those that facebook/tweet don't interact outside of it. But I won't be bullied. Maybe I'm backwards but there is no reason my camp, in which I am not alone, can't have the delivery method we want. Other than a decision made in a meeting by people who don't use the product dictating how the people who do use it will. The market is supposed to drive business but I don't see much of that anymore. Consumers do as they are told and a lot of money has been spent to train them to do so over the last decade or two. Or maybe I'm just a nutjob.

You are far from the only person miffed at Adobe right now. This is not going over well for them.
A lot of people not happy with this move. I'm sure they will be losing some of the advantage they
built up after FCP X. FCP users were used to being able to upgrade 2 or 3 versions at a simple upgrade
price. In other words it cost the same to upgrade from FCP 1 to FCP 7 as it did to upgrade from
FCP 6 to FCP 7. So you only upgraded when they actually added features YOU needed. These are
many of the users Adobe gained after FCP X. Trust me, many of them will not be happy with this
move by Adobe.

 

[refocusedmedia]

I posted this elsewhere, but -- considering how Adobe capitalized immensely on Apple's FCP7-FCPX fiasco -- I really don't understand why they decided to create their own version of it with this CS6-CC mess.

With MC7 hot on their heels, FCPX straightening itself out, and new competition like Resolve10 and Lightworks coming into their own... what moron(s) thought it would be a good idea to polarize and restrict their user-base, alienating a potentially large percentage of them?

For crying out loud, they *just* announced Premiere had obtained the #1 spot in NLE market share and then some 30 minutes later they announce this. How does such a glaring misfire occur?

 

[Gary Huff]

and new competition like Resolve10 and Lightworks coming into their own...

I think people are unaware that Lightworks requires a subscription to be usable.

 

[kplo]

Sony Vegas Pro users can upgrade for less than $150 each new release. Downside is: except for information regarding problem solving on forums such as this, there is almost no customer support from Sony on this product.
If Adobe's customer support is really good, that might take some of the pain away from this cloud "rental' concept.
Dunno...just my .02.
Ken

 

[j1clark@ucsd.edu]

I posted this elsewhere, but -- considering how Adobe capitalized immensely on Apple's FCP7-FCPX fiasco -- I really don't understand why they decided to create their own version of it with this CS6-CC mess.

This is somewhat different to the FCP-X debacle... in that case not only did they move to a 'buy through App Store' method of delivery, they also changed the product in ways that made it 'useless' at the time for anyone doing serious work with FCP-7, so there was no upgrade incentive in the least.

In this case, as far as I can tell CS6 is 'better' for some value of that word than CS 5.5 and below... at least it has worked out well for me... except... I still have problems upgrading my new computer... and will only have the time to seriously look in to completely cleaning my system of adobe anything, then reinstalling CS6 alone (I have a working CS5 setup and didn't want to remove that when I upgraded to CS6...).

Anyway, the subscription based package has worked well for my needs and allowed me to use the tools that I need without having to pay the $$ up front...

Lightworks has pretty much come too late for me... 5-7 years ago... sure... but even now with a Linux beta out, I really don't have too much interest in looking into it, except as something to mention if I give a seminar on 'low cost film editing'...

Since I don't spend 50 or 100 bux a month on 'cable access'... I can spend that same amount (ok I did get the $29 per month 'new user' discount...) on access to all the tools I'd use.

As for having real media around 'forever'... I have a set of Mac OS 7 compatible Photoshop 2.5 floppies in the Clark Computer Museum... which is about all they are worth these days...

(I have some 9-trak mag tape reels with some 'really old stuff'... like a Unix distribution from the 80's as well... wait... did I finally part with those??? don't know... can't remember...)

 

[BrandonT]

Dang it. I have really been enjoying using Premiere this year, after changing from FCP7. I teach a production course at a state college as an adjunct, so the production premium package that include Premiere, AE, Prelude, Flash, Media Encoder, Illustrator, Encore, and probably one or two more programs-- it only cost me $450. And the license "allows" me to use it on my for profit jobs. So no, CC will not be better for me. The one thing that I'm missing out on is InDesign, which I might need to use three or four times a year.

Do you guys figure that the backlash will force them to change their mind at all? Maybe do like Netflix had to do after announcing that the streaming and DVD mailer services were being split into two companies, and then say that they now realize that it was too soon and that while they will eventually move to the new model, that they will keep the current model for a while longer.

Maybe this will give Apple and FCPX a chance again. I hear it has become a pretty good platform by now.

Any way, I'll probably just hold on to CS6 for two or three years, then, and see where things go.