a7s skin tones: slog2 vs pp off (shogun 4k)

caseywilsondp

caseywilsondp

Well-known member
yesterday on the spot i was shooting, i decided to run a couple of takes with pp off just to see how it'd turn out in post.
because the shogun is still waiting on lut support, i was lighting the scene with pp off, then shooting in slog2 (1600 iso for pp off, 6400 iso for slog2).
here are the results straight from camera. obviously we lit the scene very warm/amber and the skin reflects that, but i think it's quite natural looking and pleasing.

pp off from camera:

timeline1.00_00_14_07.Still005.jpgtimeline1.00_00_17_14.Still004.jpg
(interestingly, and maybe the more tech-savvy people will know, but the jpeg is a bit more saturated and slightly more contrasty than how it looks in my nle)

slog2 from camera:

timeline1.00_00_20_02.Still006.jpgtimeline1.00_00_22_05.Still007.jpg

if anyone wants to try their hand at grading the slog2, i'd love to see it.

tiffs if you're so inclined of the slog2:
wide tight

i haven't written anything up about it yet (i usually make small posts about my shoots on my website), what do you think would be useful information for me to cover in the post? would uploading a prores slog2 file from the shogun be helpful for anyone?
 

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Ya - cut a short 15 or so second prores clip of the slog2 and post it here - I'd love to try my hand at grading it.
 
Wow, dusty, if you hadn't said that was Cine4, I'd had guessed SLog2. You using MacGregor's settings?
 
Here's my Slog-2 Grades,

6MmQ1oU.jpg
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2_timeline1.00_00_20_07.jpg
F65 SGamut Slog2 => rec709 Slog2 LUT in PS. Gamma/contrast adjusted manually with curves etc.
Various tweaks in PS including removing NR artifacts from skin- curious what the noise looked like before NR (added noise in PS after fixing skin).
Goal was natural looking skintones vs. anything dramatic. Monitors calibrated using X-Rite i1Display.

For skintones, not a fan of PP Off on the A7S. While it can look OK in some cases (including styles such as Autumn Leaves), it falls apart fast where the PPs do not. Slog2, CINE1/2/4 work better.

After conversion to JPG and upload, colors shifted. Adjusted to look closer to pre-JPEG:

3_timeline1.00_00_20_07.jpg

Another test: link to jpg vs. upload to forum (unchecked checkbox below URL box):
3_timeline1.00_00_20_07.jpg
 
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jcs said:
View attachment 98180
F65 SGamut Slog2 => rec709 Slog2 LUT in PS. Gamma/contrast adjusted manually with curves etc.
Various tweaks in PS including removing NR artifacts from skin- curious what the noise looked like before NR (added noise in PS after fixing skin).
Goal was natural looking skintones vs. anything dramatic. Monitors calibrated using X-Rite i1Display.

For skintones, not a fan of PP Off on the A7S. While it can look OK in some cases (including styles such as Autumn Leaves), it falls apart fast where the PPs do not. Slog2, CINE1/2/4 work better.
Click to expand...

Photoshop? Do it in Resolve. And those frame grabs were s-log. And why are your Jpegs shifting that much? WTF?
 
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dustylense said:
Photoshop? Do it in Resolve. And those frame grabs were s-log. And why are your Jpegs shifting that much? WTF?
Click to expand...

Lol- when I launched Resolve (latest version), it locked up (never happened before, didn't want to spend time debugging the issue). PS can load LUTs, so used PS. JPEG color issues are common (especially in different browsers), most noticeable with skintones. PS has far superior color controls vs. Resolve, and can even be used on video (very slow at this point).

Regarding yellow in SLog: if you use SGamut, it's important to use an SGamut to rec709 LUT to get back into a 'normal' colorspace (vs. ultrawide gamut).
 
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jcs said:
Lol- when I launched Resolve (latest version), it locked up (never happened before, didn't want to spend time debugging the issue). PS can load LUTs, so used PS. JPEG color issues are common (especially in different browsers), most noticeable with skintones. PS has far superior color controls vs. Resolve, and can even be used on video (very slow at this point).

Regarding yellow in SLog: if you use SGamut, it's important to use an SGamut to rec709 LUT to get back into a 'normal' colorspace (vs. ultrawide gamut).
Click to expand...

Uh, I don't know a single person that would grade a project in PS, much less ask for their project to be graded in PS. I mean, unless you have a month for turnaround. Can your PS grade do power windows? Tracking? Qualifiers? How about playback with your director sitting there next to you on a complicated color grade. Will he or she be happy with the render times?

Jpeg color issues? Your shift when you first posted was so wacky. I don't seem to be having any issues. If I load this page, my Resolve window, and the exported Jpeg I used for this post sitting on my desktop, they all look identical. It's called color management.

Screen shot of the DVXthread and the Jpeg used to upload (including the screen shot too which is a PNG).
Screen Shot 2015-02-28 at 1.12.17 PM.jpg
 
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timeline1.00_00_20_07.Still009.00_00_02_09.Still002.jpg
Graded using Filmconvert with very minor tweaks. Used Kodak Vis3, reduced grain, film colour at 90 and film curve at 90. Some slight colour correction.
 
dustylense said:
Uh, I don't know a single person that would grade a project in PS, much less ask for their project to be graded in PS. I mean, unless you have a month for turnaround. Can your PS grade do power windows? Tracking? Qualifiers? How about playback with your director sitting there next to you on a complicated color grade. Will he or she be happy with the render times?
Click to expand...

The shift wasn't that dramatic- I ended up moving back to warmer as trying to get closer to a normal skin color didn't quite look right when lit with so little blue light. While I had turned off Convert to sRGB, I left the embedded color profile, which apparently works better turned off. Googling this: appears to be a big issue: https://www.google.com/search?q=photoshop jpeg color shift .

I test everything and use what works best. For stills, PS is the best tool for the job, by far. I'm not an expert in Resolve- how do you quickly adjust color temp (without manually messing with RGB scale/offset via LGG etc.)? Super fast & easy in PS (ACR filter) or PPro (Fast Color Corrector). Resolve is pretty cool, but also pretty archaic compared to other tools. The earlier lock up was due to some kind of problem with Resolve's QuickTime interface (it will ultimately load after a long delay).
Couple quick grades in Resolve 11. First uses F65 SGamut+Slog2 to rec709+Slog2, second uses Alister's Filmic2 1 OVER LUT. Both tweaked further after LUTs applied. Again, goal was accurate skin vs. any kind of look (second example has a bit of 'look' due to LUT used).

Resolve2_1.1.3.jpg
Resolve1_1.1.1.jpg
Another PS version after web viewing (everything looks much better in PS vs. viewing in browser (Chrome on Win7)):
PS2.jpg

Ideally color tests should go for skin tone accuracy first so we can see if all is correct (not easy!), followed by any looks for the story / emotion (easy!).

Can't remove the Attached Images junk below- forum bugs...
 
dustylense said:
Honestly, I don't like S-Log on the A7s one bit. Just get your scene and idea in camera and on set. Also, we shot Cine 4 for quicker turn around.
Click to expand...
I bought a7s for the slog but after I underexposed an important interview I stopped. No more slog without onset luts.
 
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