a7s saturation/White balance color adjustment question

I

Ignacy

Member
Yesterday I pointed my A7s at a piece of Green screen fabric laying on my studio table and to my surprise discovered that I could not replicate the vibrant saturated green look that I saw with my own eyes on the A7s, unless I did one of the following two things:

1. In the cine profile settings, bringing the saturation to it's maximum value got me much closer to the shade of green I was seeing.
2. In the white balans menu I adjusted the color settings a bit to get the green closer to how I was seeing it with my own eyes. (I'm not speaking about the kelvin value!)

Is one of these methods a no-no?
Obviously, in a run and gun situation one doesn't have the luxury to adjust this kind of stuff but what about controlled conditions?

Am I allowed to adjust the white balans settings, as in point number 2 above, for a given scene to beter reflect what I'm seeing with my own eyes or will it affect other parameters negatively?
Do some of you on this forum adjust the saturation and white balance color settings on a shot by shot basis in studio conditions when you have time to set up the shot?
 
A) What Kelvin did you have dialed in?
B) What was the color temp of the light falling on the green screen?
C) Have you charted your camera to make sure it's accurate (both what it records, and what the monitor represents)?
 
Hi Bill, thanks for your reply.
In response to your questions:

A) I dialed in a 5600 kelvin. The time of day was a sunny mid afternoon (no clouds). The green fabric was only lit from the light coming through the window.
B) Exactly the same as in point A, 5600 kelvin.
C) I don't understand exactly what you mean by "charted" (:)) but I have adjusted some of the picture profiles according to recommended settings on this user forum.
No matter what Picture profile I switched to the green always looked desaturated unless I'd change the saturation or adjust the white balance colors (A-B-G-M).
Also, I double checked the recordings on my computer and the desaturated green looks exactly the same as it does on my camera's monitor screen...
 
I shot this using these settings (it's a test edit that I uploaded without any further work in post, so the talent could see themselves being awesomely beautiful; you can see a few shots in which I failed to overexpose by a stop as I usually do, and they look a lot worse).
 
Thanks for your reply Samuel.
I was doing my tests with other picture profiles than S-log. Nevertheless I can still see through the "milky" s-log quality of your attached video that your green screen is "greener" than any picture profile or creative style I have on my A7s (without modification of the parameters).
It's probably due to the fact that your settings have saturation all the way up to +15.
It seems as though all the sony a7s pic profiles have a desaturated look to them from the outset. Why is that?
Fun work you're doing :)
 
Samuel H said:
I shot this using these settings (it's a test edit that I uploaded without any further work in post, so the talent could see themselves being awesomely beautiful; you can see a few shots in which I failed to overexpose by a stop as I usually do, and they look a lot worse).
Click to expand...
So this is using the Slog 2 with cinema color space rather than s.gammuet? Might have to try this setting tonight with the A6300.
 
ReelFilmGeek said:
So this is using the Slog 2 with cinema color space rather than s.gammuet? Might have to try this setting tonight with the A6300.
Click to expand...
According to the forums, wether you own a A7s or a7sII, it's better not to use S-Gamut in S-Log unless you're exceptionally good at color grading. Apparently it's also much easier to clip the highlights in S-Gamut...
 
Ignacy said:
According to the forums, wether you own a A7s or a7sII, it's better not to use S-Gamut in S-Log unless you're exceptionally good at color grading. Apparently it's also much easier to clip the highlights in S-Gamut...
Click to expand...
Hm and what about the FS5? Been using Slog on the FS5 and FS7 at work and feel like i've been getting some good results (in my opinion but then again im not a colorist pro and its been more basic color and nothing really stylized).
 
ReelFilmGeek said:
Hm and what about the FS5? Been using Slog on the FS5 and FS7 at work and feel like i've been getting some good results (in my opinion but then again im not a colorist pro and its been more basic color and nothing really stylized).
Click to expand...
Aren't the FS5 and FS7 both 10bit? As opposed to the a7s 8 bit? That's probably the reason, just guessing.
 
Ignacy said:
Aren't the FS5 and FS7 both 10bit? As opposed to the a7s 8 bit? That's probably the reason, just guessing.
Click to expand...

The FS7 is but the FS5 is only at 1080 and we have been working in a 4k workflow. Will try to play around with these settings to see what works better. My main concern from not using slog 2 s-gammet.3 is will luts no long be apply correctly if you change it to cinema
 
ReelFilmGeek said:
The FS7 is but the FS5 is only at 1080 and we have been working in a 4k workflow. Will try to play around with these settings to see what works better. My main concern from not using slog 2 s-gammet.3 is will luts no long be apply correctly if you change it to cinema
Click to expand...
That's a very good question and I'm very interested in getting an answer for this too ;) Anyone?
 
(the big boys have the "proper" slog and sgamut versions, the a7S has a botched sgamut and the a7S II has a limited version of slog3; there's not much to learn about the FS7 and FS5 by looking at the a7 series, if you ask me; never laid a hand on the FS7 or FS5, though, I'm just assuming they are free from these kind of issues)
 
Hmm, Rec 709 + Cine 4 with CMY/RGB lined up to their respective targets via WFM. This is not an exotic PP, will test with my camera.
Good to know.
 
jurny said:
ignacy ----- NEVER ------ use totolo PP. unless you like pink holes in the sun.... https://youtu.be/F0tGT042tTI
Click to expand...

I'm shooting right into the sun here: https://vimeo.com/139061000 no problems.

Will try to replicate your shot with the sun higher in the sky. In the mean time would you mind double checking your settings?
Also, if you could tell me your lens, shutter speed and f/stop that may help. Trying to gather some intel.

Thanks.
 
i had high hopes for your profile. i had exact settings. checked it after my jaw dropped when i saw that hole. non sony lenses. i film on nikon 2.8 zooms or m42.
 
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