A7s Reception -> Colours Blown out?

chappelldigital

chappelldigital

Well-known member
Hi Guys

I've noticed during some receptions (wedddings, etc) that I get some weird blown out colours.
Curious if anyone can shed some insight into what is causing this....

a7s1.jpga7s2.jpg

Everything looks fine before the light goes on that makes everything blown out
a7s3.jpg

I've shot 3 or 4 different events where I've seen the same thing happen.

Messed up:
a7s4.jpg

But then 20 mins later everything is fine
a7s5.jpg

Thoughts on what could be causing some of that...???
Thanks!
 
I don't personally own an A7s...but I do follow its tech closely. I have seen comments about how the A7s handles blue LED lighting. It's has been covered in the "gotchas" section of the quirks of this camera. Since I shoot a lot of concert events...this is one of the primary reasons I did not get on board with this camera.

If there is a solution from experienced users, I would like to know as well. To my knowledge, it's a flaw in Sony color rendition.
 
I had a feeling it might be something wonky like that - hopefully someone can chime in with a reason/way to avoid it?
I've shot the exact same shots on the same night with my C100 and didn't have any issues.

I've noticed that sometimes the A7s gives me issues like that, but other nights, it doesn't. Possibly due to the types of lighting being used at the venues?
Shots above are both Rokinon Cine lenses (14mm 3.1 and 85mm 1.5)
 
Sony's a7s essentially reacts the same way as other Sony CMOS sensor cameras do.

I'm not alone in this observation. Renowned DP, Art Adams was on this topic on another list some weeks ago.

It happens when you have a light source in a very narrow spectrum that over excites the sensor. It is particularly bad when the LED color happens to saturate one of the 3 colors blue, red or green.

The reason why it has reared it's head so much with the A7s is more happenstance as a few owners here do a lot of music videos or do test videos in nightclubs with pulsing LEDs.

The A7s ticks many checkboxes when it comes to a DSLR functioning as a usable video camera in a produciton environment. There is finally a DSLR that has pro-audio outputs, managable moire, decent dynamic range, low light capabilities, UHD output, broadcast acceptible codec, remarkable OLED viewfinder, good color reproduction, Full Frame or Crop Mode, decent offspeed recording, etc.

You have to take what you hear on forums with a measured sense of judgement. There is a good reason why the A7s has become a runaway hit as a lightweight guerilla cam with pro camera ops. Pixel peeping tends to cloud things.

Every camera has it's limitations. The blue LED issue goes way beyond just the a7S. Best thing to do is not to use an a7S in a dance club with pulsing lights. Use something else, probably a CCD camera would be best but it might have different but similar issues with sensor pixels going wild with these brightly colored LEDs.
 
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This is the primary reason that event videographers, wedding videographers, concert videographers, and anyone else shooting in some of the most publically used lighting environments should be aware of.

Lots of debate over Sony color science. Not getting into all that here. What I can tell you is...Sony's awesome tech achievements come at the price of limiting the user in some of the most commonly shot environments.

Every camera company's tech caters to a different type of shooter. I primarily shoot in concert environments. So, for me, the Sony ecosystem is not for me. For others, it may never be an issue.
 
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The issue seems to happen when WB is set below 5000k in most picture styles and some creative modes. If you use the "deep" creative mode instead it seems to go away. I've been wanting to buy a 82A filter to try to balance tungsten optically instead of electronically to be able to overcome this using slog. If anyone can try this, I'd be grateful.
 
I forgot about dialing the white balance. 82A filter is a really good idea. Should help a lot.

EDIT:

If Canon cameras work better in these kind of environments then that is the tool that should be used.

On the Sony maybe cranking the white balance up and filtration will solve the problem. Now another issue is introduced with the skintones that are going to get messed up once the LEDs are gone and the house lights come up, unless the 82A is in place. The combination of having a close to daylight white balance and then optically bringing it back to tungsten with the 82A could be an elegant solution to the problem.
 
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Here is a thread that discussed the topic

And here is the simple and effective solution: use white balance of 5000K or higher, and the problem is gone.

(nyvz is the awesome forum mate who found this fix, as you can see in the thread I linked)
 
I shot a DJ performance on new years eve with A7s and the stage was filled with those blue lights, but thanks to an article here at DVXUSER (which I can't find now) I was able to get away with it.

Turn Picture profile OFF, use Creative style. I think its Autumn Leaves that doesn't clip the blue as much.
To help it further, I also dialled down the contrast and saturation.
 
Samuel H said:
Here is a thread that discussed the topic

And here is the simple and effective solution: use white balance of 5000K or higher, and the problem is gone.

(nyvz is the awesome forum mate who found this fix, as you can see in the thread I linked)
Click to expand...


The issue is when the scene should be balanced lower that 5000k. When bands are lit tungsten....and the scene should be balanced appropriately, but there is the presence of LEDs, this could easily happen with Sony cameras. Then this issue is more of an issue.

As far as putting a filter on...that is a cool idea...but it is a bandaid to a flaw in design. Other company's color science handles this situation with ease....if not in a very pleasing way.

I think the solution is "use the right tool for the job." In a concert or event environment...for me...Sony cameras are not the best tool for the job.
 
Samuel H said:
Here is a thread that discussed the topic

And here is the simple and effective solution: use white balance of 5000K or higher, and the problem is gone.

(nyvz is the awesome forum mate who found this fix, as you can see in the thread I linked)
Click to expand...

Good to know! Thanks for the link - will be test those solutions out next reception for sure. Depending on the result, it may have me grabbing my C100 more often for certain situations though.
 
ReelWorksMedia said:
The issue is when the scene should be balanced lower that 5000k. When bands are lit tungsten....and the scene should be balanced appropriately, but there is the presence of LEDs, this could easily happen with Sony cameras. Then this issue is more of an issue.
Click to expand...

I've shot in those conditions, and this fix worked great for me. Just shoot at WB 5000K and then fix WB in post: much easier than fixing those blue-highlights-from-hell.
 
Samuel H said:
I've shot in those conditions, and this fix worked great for me. Just shoot at WB 5000K and then fix WB in post: much easier than fixing those blue-highlights-from-hell.
Click to expand...

So, when I do a custom white balance measurement inside a high school gym with Expo Disc (18% gray) and the camera says 3800 - are you saying shoot at 5000 anyhow?
 
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